Yeast Starters - Help!

[Tayport]

Hi Guys,

Just wondering if a yeast starter is really necessary?

Was planning on brewing a Belgian Wit tomorrow with Wyeast 3944, but one of my friends said that I'll need to put together a yeast starter first and the problem is that I don't have any dry malt extract...

Help!

 

[dennisking]

Wyeast always need a starter I believe. I would postpone the brew day for a week and sort out a starter.

 

[snail59]

Depends if you have the Activator or Propagator. Activator can be pitched direct after 3/4 hours. Propagator needs to be done as a starter and will need 24 hours or more before Pitching.

 

[robsan77]

Not worth cutting corners. I have tried and failed before with liquid yeast. Dont try and use sugar instead either.

 

[dennisking]

Not worth cutting corners. I have tried and failed before with liquid yeast. Dont try and use sugar instead either.

Definitely, yeast is too important to cut corners. I mainly use Whitelabs and they state you can pitch straight from the vial, and I did this at first and they worked. But the small effort involved making a starter means it gets off to a more robust start with the minimum time lapse.

 

[snail59]

Not worth cutting corners. I have tried and failed before with liquid yeast. Dont try and use sugar instead either.

Who's on about cutting corners??. Wyeast Activator is designed to be used direct. Just smack the pack let it get started over a few hours and then pitch. ACTIVATOR

The propagator is designed to be made up as a starter. PROPAGATOR

 

[gurtpint]

Not worth cutting corners. I have tried and failed before with liquid yeast. Dont try and use sugar instead either.

Who's on about cutting corners??. Wyeast Activator is designed to be used direct. Just smack the pack let it get started over a few hours and then pitch. ACTIVATOR

The propagator is designed to be made up as a starter. PROPAGATOR

As I understand it, the ready-to-pitch liquid yeasts are a good thing in theory but rarely in practise. Here's a bit posted on this forum earlier on:

Think about this for a moment. This yeast has been bottled . . . shipped to an airport . . . put in a plane. . . . flown to the UK . . . Sat in UK customs . . Transported to the Retailer . . . sat with the retailer . . . transported to you . . .Do you really think that you are going to have a fresh yeast at its best :hmm: :hmm:

 

[Aleman]

Not worth cutting corners. I have tried and failed before with liquid yeast. Dont try and use sugar instead either.

Who's on about cutting corners??. Wyeast Activator is designed to be used direct. Just smack the pack let it get started over a few hours and then pitch. ACTIVATOR

The propagator is designed to be made up as a starter. PROPAGATOR

The activator packs are designed to provide about the same number of cells as a Whitelabs tube . . . when absolutely fresh they will achieve the aim of being able to start a 5 US gallon batch of beer (Although the cell count is well below the HPR of 1/2 Million cells per ml). This causes long lag times, and less clean ferments . . . Using a 5L starter prevents this


HPR - Homebrew Pitching Rate
CPR - Commercial Pitching Rate

 

[Moley]

(Although the cell count is well below the HPR of 1/2 Million cells per ml).

HPR - Homebrew Pitching Rate
CPR - Commercial Pitching Rate

Yes .... and?
Give us the comparative CPR.

 

[Aleman]

(Although the cell count is well below the HPR of 1/2 Million cells per ml).

HPR - Homebrew Pitching Rate
CPR - Commercial Pitching Rate

Yes .... and?
Give us the comparative CPR.

The minimum commercial pitching rate (CPR) is 1 million cells per ml

 

[luckyeddie]

Incidentally, Aleman, is there a maximum pitching rate?

I understand that different pitching rates will alter lag time; I also understand that it can actually alter the characteristics of the final brew. Presumably because of the way that yeasts use their available energy and the rate at which they reproduce under certain concentrations?

I can feel a small-scale (1 gallon carboy size) experiment coming on. I just love playing - and so long as it's drinkable, I'll drink it.

 

[Aleman]

Yeast produce the majority of their esters and other flavour compounds during the 'lag' phase, the more yeast you pitch the shorter the lag phase, and the less flavour compounds you get. I think Jamil recommends a maximum pitch rate of around 200million cells per ml,

 

[luckyeddie]

Cheers, Aleman.

That explains a lot - like why the missus and I reckon that the taste of the under-pitched Belgian golden ale we tasted a bit of a couple of days ago was so absolutely wonderful and fruity. I guess we're both ester addicts (not Ms Rantzen)