Wanted: Peroni Gran Riserva recipe

[UKSkydiver]

Hi everyone

Since brewing I've moved away from drinking generic commercial lagers. I will even err towards some ale or other if I find that there isn't a stout or dark ale on tap in pubs.

That said, whever I go to Pizza Express, I am partial to a Peroni Gran Riserva. I had one last night and it really is to my liking. Malty, sweet and refreshing.
That's the preamble, please let's not get in to a "commercial lager tastes like p!$$" discussion - I don't disagree, but I happen to like this one.

I had a bit more of a look at the label and other than the 'doppio malto' designation, I noticed it also has 'Bock' on there.

I've had a search here and I see no recipes for a Gran Riserva clone. Does anyone have any pointers to this or a similar bock recipe please?

Many thanks

 

[IainM]

I'd say that it's like a light dopplebock or a strong marzen. I'd build a recipe with brewfather or brewer's friend with a base malt of Munich or Vienna. I'd probably go vienna. Perhaps with 10% Munich, or a touch of aromatic or caramel, enough to get to 6.6%. I'd hop with something like herle, hallertauer or tettnang, bittering only, to get to around 22 IBUs. Use a german lager yeast.

 

[Scrattajack]

whever I go to Pizza Express, I am partial to a Peroni Gran Riserva.

When we used to go, if driving I'd have a normal Peroni, if not a Gran Riserva and a large house red, which happened to be a pretty decent Montepulciano that was great with an American Hot.

 

[An Ankoù]

I'd say that it's like a light dopplebock or a strong marzen. I'd build a recipe with brewfather or brewer's friend with a base malt of Munich or Vienna. I'd probably go vienna. Perhaps with 10% Munich, or a touch of aromatic or caramel, enough to get to 6.6%. I'd hop with something like herle, hallertauer or tettnang, bittering only, to get to around 22 IBUs. Use a german lager yeast.

I've never tasted it, but if it's a bock around 6.6%, Here's Gordon Strong's recipe for Maibock, Recipes, 2015, p 196.

25 litres : OG 1065 : FG 1014 : abv 6.7% : IBUs 29 : SRM 7 : Style- Helles Bock : Efficiency 70%

4.1 Kg German pils malt (Weyermann)
1.8 Kg German Vienna malt (Best)
907 g German Munich (Best)
454 g Belgian aromatic malt (Dingermans)
all in the mash - hybrid step and single decoction, mashout

Mash rests:
55C 10 minutes
63C 15 minutes
Pull decoction and heat to 70C for 20 minutes, boil 10 minutes, remix.
70C 30 minutes
77C 10 minutes

14g Tettnang @4.5% whole FWH
14g Magnum @ 14.4% pellets @60 mins
14g Tetttnang @ 4.5% whole @5 mins
14g Tettnang @ 4.5% whole @0

White Labs WLP833 German Bock Yeast
Water treatment RO water treated with 0.25 teaspoon 10% phosphoric acid per 19 litres. I tsp calcium chloride in the mash.
90 minute boil
Ferment at 9C for two weeks then 0C for 16 weeks.

Well, that needs a whole load of simplifying, especially the mash schedule!!!!! I suggest you change all the malts for Italmalt to get the genuine Peroni flavour Malti < ®Italmalt < Agroalimentare Sud < Agroalimentare Sud

Only joking. Hope you can pick the bones out of Gordon the Geek and make a recipe from it.
If you don't know Strong, he uses RO water for everything.

 

[foxbat]

It's known to be Saaz for the hops and I'll stick my neck out and guess that 'doppio malto' means two malts. They state there are no cereal malts so it's just barley. It's a commercial mega-brewery so it won't be 97 malts and eleventy three hop additions so my wild-ass-guess would be 5% caramunich I or 3% caramunich II with the remainder made up with pilsner malt. Maybe a bit of Carafa for colour. Saaz for bittering and one flavour addition. One of the German malty lager yeasts.

 

[UKSkydiver]

Thanks all

I also read here that it uses Saaz hops, and a thing called Prima barley malt which according to this whisky article suggests it's no longer used due to lower yields (Albeit for whisky. Could be a different pot of sparrows for beer)

 

[IainM]

I believe doppio malto means double the amount of malt.

 

[UKSkydiver]

Hey all - coming back to this as my next brew.

As usual I don't have all the ingerdients, so there are a few subs.

Malt: I've read a bit about using high percentages of various malts and it seem that Vienna can be used quite high and has suffient enzymes to do what enzymes do. I'm happy with the maltiness it might bring.

Hops: I literally have no idea about hops so if anything jumps out as being completely wrong, please guide me.

Yeast: I have either CML Hell or Saflager W34/70 so I'm plumping for CML Hell unless it's a really, really bad idea.

Thank you

Vitals
Original Gravity: 1069
Final Gravity: 1016
IBU (Tinseth): 25
BU/GU: 0.36
Colour: 22.5 EBC

Mash
Temperature — 65 °C — 45 min

Malts (3.537 kg)
2.6 kg (73.5%) — Vienna Malt — Grain — 7.8 EBC
441 g (12.5%) — Dark Munich Malt — Grain — 44 EBC
276 g (7.8%) — Caramalt Malt — Grain — 26 EBC
220 g (6.2%) — Aromatic Malt — Grain — 37.5 EBC

Hops (32 g)
4 g (5 IBU) — Challenger 7.5% — First Wort
14 g (19 IBU) — Northern Brewer 9.5% — Boil — 30 min
8 g (1 IBU) — Saaz 3.4% 3.4% — Boil — 5 min
6 g — Saaz 3.4% 3.4% — Boil — 0 min

Yeast
1 pkg — CML Hell 78%

 

[matt76]

If you haven't already made it and pitched your yeast, I would favour W-34/70 over CML Hell.

I used Hell a couple of times with 1 successful Baltic Porter but 2 "I'm not happy with that" brews, a Helles and Munich Dunkel.

I think W-34/70 is a more consistent and much more widely used performer (that or Lallemand Diamond Lager).

 

[foxbat]

I'll be interested in how this turns out. The original is a very nice beer.

 

[Rodcx500z]

Brewing my first stout in a long time. So after looking at @Hazelwood Brewery recipe and what I had in stock this is what I ended up with

3.8 kg Maris
500g oat malt
200g dark crystal
200g chocolate rye
200g cafe light
250g aromatic malt
250g roasted barley added at mash out

20g Magnum FWH
Yeast is CML Beoir

I can't take my eye of this
Talk about pushing your luck
View attachment 54750

I'll be interested in how this turns out. The original is a very nice beer.

I will second that Foxbat, one of only a few lagers i will drink

 

[UKSkydiver]

Brewed this last weekend

 

[apmuckle]

Brewed this last weekend

I really like this beer too. When it’s ready I’d be really interested to hear how it turned out.

 

[dv12]

Im a big fan of Gran Riserva as well. My last brew was traditional bock by Greg Hughes. Stayed true to the recipe but used some W37/40 slurry for the yeast. I missed the OG by a few points but still it is a lovely beer. Keeps getting better as the weeks pass. I need to track down a bottle and do a side by side for fun.