Turbo Cider Questions :)

[Gambler]

Hi Guys

I'm looking to start a strawberry turbo cider soon, and I have a few questions for the TC gurus if you dont mind

I'm going to be adding the strawberry flavour in the form of Lowicz syrup. Should I (or can I) add it right at the start, or will the fermentation ruin the flavouring?

I want to sweeten the cider. Anyone care to suggest a sweetner, and offer an idea of how much to add to hit medium dry? (I know thats a vauge term, but any advice would be better than me guessing). Also, I guess thats fine to add right at the start?

And finally, as I need to buy some yeast for this, I might as well get one known to work well. Has anyone tried a few differnt ones, and be kind enough to share which they feel worked well?

Thanks for any advice :)

 

[GeorgeSalt]

Haven't tried the strawberry, but I am partial to using the Lowicz blackcurrant or raspberry or cherry.

Syrup goes in first, that way you can give the bottle a swill out with some apple juice to make sure you get it all.

I prefer to sweeten in the glass with a dash of apple juice to taste. It also nicely takes the edge off the strength if you're using a whole bottle of syrup in the gallon.

I use either Young's cider or champagne yeast. Both give a clean finish.

 

[evanvine]

1 tbls Splenda per 3 litres!
1 T-bag per 6 litres
1 CT per 5 litres

 

[Gambler]

Thanks for the replies

I'll do a bit more research on a couple of other things, then I'll pop it on some time soon :)

 

[frenchy]

You will probably need to boil the syrup before using it.
Regarding the sweetener you might want to expirement several settings and after tasting choose which one you want to use in your future batches.

 

[GeorgeSalt]

You will probably need to boil the syrup before using it.

Noone else boils the Lowicz syrups that I'm aware of. It ferments like the clappers when added straight from the bottle, as per several existing threads on using these syrups.

 

[oldbloke]

Yes, they use citric acid and vitamin C rather than any sorbates or sulphites. Good to go straight from the bottle.

 

[Gambler]

Hmmmm

I presumed I'd be able to get the syrup online, and while I thought I would have to pay a premium, its just silly money really.

Theres a polish shop near my work place, so I'll try that on the lunch break tomorow.

If I have no luck there, then has anyone seen the strawberry syrup in one of the big supermarkets?

Ordered everything else I need (and a load of other stuff I just want lol) so should be good to go soon.

 

[GeorgeSalt]

The strawberry syrup is the one I see the least, even the orange flavour is more common. Try Tesco (never seen strawberry Lowicz there though), try Lithuanica if you have a store nearby, try all your local eastern European shops..

 

[Gambler]

Visited my local easten european shops today

one had raspberry, orange, cherry and what apeared to be ginger, but no strawberry

I think I might just go with raspberry...

 

[Gambler]

OK, so this is happening tomorrow :)

I'm going with the following for a 30l run;

4 tsp tannin powder
4 tsp yeast nutrient
1 pack youngs cider yeast
4 bottles of raspberry lowicz (1760ml)
4l of some kind of red juice (cranberry, pomegranate, red grape etc.)
Apple juice topped up to ~26l (approx 20l)
Another 4l of apple juice added after initial fermentation has settled down a bit to make 30l

I have some campden tablets, but I don't really see why I would want to use them? I'm not going to bother unless someone thinks I should?

If anyone has any suggestions for my recipe, then speak now or forever hold your peace :)

Thanks

EDIT - ****, forgot the sweetener. +10tbls of splenda.

 

[Tim_Crowhurst]

You might want to add some malic acid.

 

[Gambler]

Its now made :)

Deviated from my recipe somewhat though lol.

Morisons had princes juices half price @79p per L. So I thought I splash out and spend the extra 14p a carton on those instead of the el cheapo stuff.

They didnt have much apple juice though, so ended up with something like;

12x princes apple and raspberry juice (94% AJ, 6% rasberry puree)
8x Princes AJ
8x Morisons cheap AJ

Chucked it all in apart from 5L of the cheap stuff, Ill add that in a week, added the Lowicz stuff, and it looks like bloody red wine lol.

They were out of splenda, so ended up with canderell, which I guess will work just the same...

I think I may have overdone the raspberry lol. Time will tell :)

Really couldn't be bothered to measure OG. It is what it is.

 

[evanvine]

Really couldn't be bothered to measure OG. It is what it is.

So you're not bothered about its ABV then!

 

[Gambler]

Not really lol

Ill use the old method of how many until you can't stand up

 

[Gambler]

I racked this bad boy yesterday at 3 weeks old

I started the syphon off with my mouth (I know I know) and purposly took in a good mouthfull to try it.

Its rather nice :)

Good points

Nearly perfectly clear already.

Very very smooth even at this early stage. I could hapily drink it as it is now, flat and warm.

tastes like cider!

the sweetness is a good level and it in no way tastes of sweetner

Despite being on the strong side thanks to the syrup (I guestimate 7-8% based on the sugar that went in), There is no alcohol taste if you know what I mean.

I lost very little volume to the crud at the bottom when racking. not even 1L.

Not quite as good points.

It in no way, shape or form tastes of raspberries??? I thought 4 bottles of lowicz and 720ml of "rasberry puree" (from the AJ and rasberry juice) would be raspberry overkill, but aparently not lol. Its a nice colour if nothing else.

It hasnt really got a massive amount of any kind of flavour to be honest. The apple cider taste is there, but not as strong as a shop cider.

It completly lacks acidity. This isnt nessacarily bad as such, just different.

All in all, I'm very happy with how it tastes. Its certinly very pleasent, and I dont think I'm going to leave it in secondry for more than a week or two, as its very drinkable how it is now.

My question for you guys is, What, in your experience, changes in taste as the TC matures?

I'm hoping flavours are going to start coming out, not dull down...

Bonus question. beer kit I did before had rock hard, white, soap like yeast cake at the bottom of the FV at the end of fermentation. This however, had non compacted brown stuff suspended at the bottom that looks like what you might produce the night after a mutton vindaloo, and was very easily disturbed. Is this typical of TC?

Thanks for the help you have provided :)

 

[oldbloke]

A lot of the raspberry flavour/aroma will have been lost either through the airlock or through the chemistry of the ferment. Flavourings are best put in near the end.

I pretty much only use Suma AJ concentrate now to get more apple into the brew - it helps.

 

[Gambler]

Flavourings are best put in near the end

hmmmmm thats contrary to the advise that I was given at the start of this thread!

Whatever, I'm happy with a non flavoured cider. I'm sure the raspberry has helped flavour the cider even if it doesnt taste of it as such. It looks awsome if nothing else :)

next time, I think I'll add a little bit more tannin, and also, Id like to add some acid.

I have no interest in MLF cider, and would like to activly aviod it really (no offence to those who like it of course). So, what acid should I add next time? And in what quantities? (I tend to suffer from heartburn the next day after drinking too much cider, so would like to stay on the lower end of the acid scale, even so, theres clearly somthing missing from this batch....)

EDIT

I pretty much only use Suma AJ concentrate now to get more apple into the brew - it helps

I'll look into this more when I next feel like doing a plain apple cider (soooo many things to brew when your new to this game lol :)

 

[oldbloke]

The raspberry will definitely have helped broaden the flavour - straight apple can be a bit boring, especially with the amount of apple you get in normal juice. Even with the Suma, where I get 24% more apple, I add cranberry at 500ml/gallon - it doesn't taste of cranberry at all, but makes a much better drink.
I've tried a few of the commercial flavoured ciders and I'm personally not keen, except maybe for ginger, but I don't brew straight AJ anymore.

Your recipe comes to 28l plus 4 bottles of Lowicz, which is I think about 0.4 the Lowicz concentration the guy who puts it in at the start recommended. Or I may have mis-read his post. But maybe that's why you can't taste it - OTOH if you'd used enough, how stupidly strong would it be?

 

[Gambler]

An update on this

I bottled this yesterday after two weeks in the secondary @14c (at least that's what it was yesterday)

Due to bottling issues, I had 3 flat bottles to taste after a day in the fridge.

Interestingly enough, Everything I listed as good points two weeks ago are now bad points, and all the bad points points are now good points :shock:

Its now VERY acidic, and much closer to dry than medium (though not bone dry, this is with the bottling sugar not used up by the yeast however)

The raspberries are now there to be tasted. They don't dominate the cider taste though.

I wonder what has happened here? I've got a feeling the *Splenda has given up and been broken down (into methanol lol). I saw a few warnings against using it for brewing when I was googling.

I hope the acidity drops down a notch or two, then it will be lovely. Its a little sour at the moment.

On the plus side, sour raspberry works well enough.

*EDIT - I mean canderell not splenda. I wanted to use splenda but morisons were OOS