The Right Time to Dry Hop

[davidgrace]

Some advice I receive says only dry hop when fermentation is complete to get the best results. However, my current recipe says dry hop at 5 days. I find that usually fermentation has slowed down at 5 days, but is still not complete. What is the right time to dry hop?

 

[Agentgonzo]

This is a question that will get you many conflicting answers.

* NEIPA says to do it at peak fermentation because of 'biotransformation' which is not well understood and a lot of people believe is snake oil
* A lot of people say towards the end of fermentation so that the fermentation outgassing doesn't "blow off" a lot of the hop flavour aroma (again, a lot of people are unconvinced by the science of this).
* If you have to open the lid to put the hops in, you will introduce oxygen which then risks oxidisation. Again, a lot of people verge on hysteria/paranoia with anything that could introduce oxygen, whereas a lot of people will say that the yeast (provided there is enough sugar left to ferment) will metabolize the oxygen introduced - NEIPA seems to suffer from oxygen a lot more than all other styles
* Some people will tell you if you leave the hops on the beer for "too long" (>3-5 days) you get grassy vegetable flavours. Others have left hops in for 10 days and had no complaints.
* Almost everyone agrees you need at least 24-48 hours of dry hopping.

Personally, I think you can pick any schedule you like and it'll be fine, and a lot of the "suggested schedules" are based on heresay and superstition rather than science and genuine understanding

 

[The Baron]

All that Agent gonzo suggests is the difference of opinions that brewers have. I am not from the paranoia group but from the straight forward it has worked for me group.
Right now the correct time is deffo up for debate and has been done to death on hear but IMO I have always dry hopped after about day 4 just as the ferment is dropping from its height and dry hop for the relevant days you want. The reason behind this is that the wort is still producing co2 and when you open the lid after dry hopping it expels any oxygen that may have got in, bear in mind that the co2 is heavier so sits a blanket on the beer. Leaving it later means that you will have to be extra careful re oxygenating the beer as it is not really producing enough co2 to keep a blanket fully across the beer and expel any oxygen that has got in.
Now as Agent has said doing a Neipa is even more fraught with that fear of oxygenation and although I have done quite a few and am not a exponent of using pressure fermenting and transfer I would recommend that you look at that just for that style of beer if you are doing a large majority of that style

 

[davidgrace]

All that Agent gonzo suggests is the difference of opinions that brewers have. I am not from the paranoia group but from the straight forward it has worked for me group.
Right now the correct time is deffo up for debate and has been done to death on hear but IMO I have always dry hopped after about day 4 just as the ferment is dropping from its height and dry hop for the relevant days you want. The reason behind this is that the wort is still producing co2 and when you open the lid after dry hopping it expels any oxygen that may have got in, bear in mind that the co2 is heavier so sits a blanket on the beer. Leaving it later means that you will have to be extra careful re oxygenating the beer as it is not really producing enough co2 to keep a blanket fully across the beer and expel any oxygen that has got in.
Now as Agent has said doing a Neipa is even more fraught with that fear of oxygenation and although I have done quite a few and am not a exponent of using pressure fermenting and transfer I would recommend that you look at that just for that style of beer if you are doing a large majority of that style

Based on my previous brews, that may mean keeping the hops in for approx 5-6 days. Would that risk grassy vegetable flavours? Or does that fit into the "paranoia group rather than the straight forward it has worked for me group?"

 

[Braufather]

Once I put the hops in I don’t take them out again I just keg 3 days later.

With the massive dry hop ones this means hopping on day 6 and kegging day 8 or 9 and leaving keg at room temps for a few days to make sure fermentation finishes.

For more standard styles I’ll dry hop maybe day 10 and keg day 14

 

[The Baron]

IMO the paranoia group I have dry hopped for longer and never had grassy notes.
I also to give you more paranoia take mine out after usually 4 days ish depending then let it settle for a day or two to let the yeats clean up then cold crash with gelatine.
My best advice is wait for other members to answer and see what they say then take a view on it.
Just be careful with very large hopped IPA's/Neipa's.
I do not do large dry hops anymore and do my large hopping in whirlpooling with a smaller dry hop sometimes not at all so that I can add plenty of hoppage, it keeps the IBU's down to a lower level.

 

[Paul7189]

Some advice I receive says only dry hop when fermentation is complete to get the best results. However, my current recipe says dry hop at 5 days. I find that usually fermentation has slowed down at 5 days, but is still not complete. What is the right time to dry hop?

For a NEIPA I dry hop on day 2 (48 hours after pitching yeast) and then again on day 7. Then after 48 hours I cold crash to 0.5°C for 24 hours then keg on day 10. Never had any issues even though the original hop addition has been in for 8 days. I think that addition sinks to the bottom and as fermentation continues the dead yeast drops on to it and proves a barrier maybe because I’ve never had grassy hop flavours from doing it this way.

 

[Paul7189]

For something cleaner like a west coast I wait until fermentation has finished (around 8-9 days) then drop the temp to 14°C. Add the dry hops and same as above, 48 hours later I crash it to 0.5°C for 48 hours this time as I want a clearer beer then keg.

I also burst carbonate my kegs by upping the pressure to 30psi and rocking it for 3 minutes. The beer is already cold from the cold crash then I adjust to my target psi and leave it at serving temperature for a few days. I don’t know if this helps ward off any oxygen issues from dry hopping but it works for me.

 

[Clint]

On brews I "know" I'll dry hop on around day ten in a 14 day fermentation. On ones I don't I'll wait til it's calmed down and take a gravity reading,if it's virtually done I'll chuck em in. I have left dry hops in for a fortnight with no grassy tastes.
I've been getting some nice results increasing flame out hops adding at around 76c.

 

[Stuart Wilson]

First time I dry hopped I added hops for 4 days once fermentation ended.....there was a very definite grassy flavour, although this did fade as bottles were stored in unheated garage, it was still there.

Most recent attempts went a bit wrong.....used a different yeast for the 1st time and the kitchen was a bit cool. Although I thought fermentation was about to end, it actually carried on at a very slow rate for almost two weeks....thought it was never going to end! Various other things going on so didnt have time to bottle, so I ended up dry hopping for 3 weeks! Just sampled the 1st bottle of this batch.....thought it was going to be dreadful, but my brother in law voted it the best brew I'd ever made. That was with Citra hops, I've just bottled another batch made in exactly the same way but using Cascade hops. See how that turns out.

Short answer .... impossible to say how to dry hop!

 

[The Baron]

Sounds to me like you got some hop creep by adding hops later in the ferment thats why I am a advocate of adding hops after the first initial ferment has slightly subsided and there is enough action to see off any secondary fermentation quickly caused by this.
Hop creep is a common term that refers to the overattenuation of dry-hopped beer. One might otherwise describe it as a sneaky, unwanted secondary fermentation that can lower gravity, provoke a diacetyl spike, and create excess alcohol and CO2.
You may not get all these attributes but you will certainly get a longer fermentation which never seems to end IMO

 

[The Baron]

This may help you to understand how this happens
The enzymes in your dry hops have acted upon the starches and dextrins in your beer, breaking them down into fermentable sugars. The yeast that you have left in your beer has refermented those sugars. Yes, it's a secondary fermentation.

 

[fgoulding]

This question is at the core of my experimentation at present as I’ve been trying to recreate some of my favourite hoppy beers (in terms of taste and aroma).

One big complication is how certain yeast/hop combinations react differently when dry hopping, especially near the end of fermentation (biotransformation as mentioned).

Without trying to bore everyone, I’m getting my best results by double dry hopping. Once near the end of active fermentation and again during cold crashing.

Here’s an interesting article about biotransformation:

https://escarpmentlabs.com/blogs/resources/biotransformation-keep-hops-alive-with-yeast

 

[clib]

I think this is probably one of the most over thunk things in brewing. I've read about hopping til I'm blue in the face. I've never ruined a beer by hopping it badly, in very many attempts.

I think some of what commercial breweries do is governed by ease of production, and the equipment they have. And some is about marketing. So, there are lots of DDH beers in bars and shops now. Double dry hopped. During fermentation for biotransformation effects which transform the flavours, and post fermentation to get hop oils into the beer just before packaging, to minimize losses. Other breweries just do one or the other.

There isn't a right or wrong. You can add hops at any stage of the brewing process and people do. In the mash, in the kettle pre boil, start of boil, mid boil, end of boil, as it's cooling. In the FV at any stage. Some brewers simply make a hop tea and that's the entire hopping.

The duration of dry hopping varies enormously too. Consensus is that a dry hop needs 24 hours + but most people go longer. 2 to 3 days is ample, longer does not increase aroma, and may reduce it. 1 to 2 days is probably optimum I suspect.

But it's not hyper critical, the differences will be marginal and hard to detect in my experience. The hoppiness of beers is mostly affected by the quantity of hops used and the varieties used. On a tour of Cloudwater the head brewer told us that the beer in production was getting a 25g per litre dry hop with Citra, Mosaic etc, leaving little room for nuance or doubt! I've tasted those beers and they are very hoppy!

 

[The Baron]

Thats the latest idea of dry hopping at lower temps which I have not tried as what I do works for me but I will at some time have to do it to see what it does.
I do not do massive dry hops anymore though as I am a big advocate of whirlpool/hopstand hopping which means you can shove loads of flavour in with less IBU's and a smaller dry hop if not at all

 

[The Baron]

I think this is probably one of the most over thunk things in brewing. I've read about hopping til I'm blue in the face. I've never ruined a beer by hopping it badly, in very many attempts.

I think some of what commercial breweries do is governed by ease of production, and the equipment they have. And some is about marketing. So, there are lots of DDH beers in bars and shops now. Double dry hopped. During fermentation for biotransformation effects which transform the flavours, and post fermentation to get hop oils into the beer just before packaging, to minimize losses. Other breweries just do one or the other.

There isn't a right or wrong. You can add hops at any stage of the brewing process and people do. In the mash, in the kettle pre boil, start of boil, mid boil, end of boil, as it's cooling. In the FV at any stage. Some brewers simply make a hop tea and that's the entire hopping.

The duration of dry hopping varies enormously too. Consensus is that a dry hop needs 24 hours + but most people go longer. 2 to 3 days is ample, longer does not increase aroma, and may reduce it. 1 to 2 days is probably optimum I suspect.

But it's not hyper critical, the differences will be marginal and hard to detect in my experience. The hoppiness of beers is mostly affected by the quantity of hops used and the varieties used. On a tour of Cloudwater the head brewer told us that the beer in production was getting a 25g per litre dry hop with Citra, Mosaic etc, leaving little room for nuance or doubt! I've tasted those beers and they are very hoppy!

I totally agree Clib what I have always said in whatever process you do is take in all the information that is thrown at you and then work a process out between it all that works for you.
I have found one that works for me which is when I do dry hop I do it at approx day 4 then remove after approx 4 days but as I have said this has evolved to smaller dry hops or none in some case and push it all into a whirlpool I do not even use bittering hops unless I am doing a traditional ale or bitter when I do the standard hop boils for that style.
So the moral is find out what works for you and by all means use the science but do not become a slave to it as it gets over thought and that applies to other processes in brewing too

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

A lot has already been said but I’ll make a few small points anyway

There is some science behind the duration and it was found that hop oils take hours to leech into your beer not days or weeks. A shorter timeframe of a couple of days is therefore all that’s needed.

Some hops are grassy, it’s part of their flavour profile. If you use hops with a grassy component in it’s flavour you’re going to detect a grassy note. I think most of us have often left beer on the hops for a couple of weeks without issue.

Oxidation is real. If you use large quantities of hops and use higher protein adjuncts like oats the visible impact of oxidation can be seen in days rather than weeks or months. You do need to minimise oxidation for the best quality beer. I experimented with multiple small dry-hop additions through fermentation and it was a disaster. Repeated exposure to air killed my beer.

On the topic of oxidation, pellets are likely to introduce less oxygen into your beer because leaf hops trap air between the leaves and this is free to dissolve into your beer if you use them in the dry hop.

One final point, aroma is volatile (it’s how it works!), warmer temperatures allow the oils to evaporate more quickly.

 

[Stuart Wilson]

Never heard of hop creep.....interesting! Just this minute added hops to another batch. If had reached 71% attenuation with yeast that usually manages about 78 - 80%. Would expect fermentation to be completed in about another 4 days. Probably bottle after 5 days. See how this goes!

 

[davidgrace]

Thanks for all the advice. However, the more I look into dry hopping the more confusing it all becomes as I receive Irreconcilable advice on dry hopping

1. Wait until fermentation is complete so that fermentation doesn’t interfere with flavour from the hops.

2. Don’t remove the lid after fermentation is complete to avoid oxidation of the wort. Best to add the hops when fermentation is almost complete. How can I do that without conflicting with (1) above? I.e. if fermentation has to be complete before adding the hops?

3. Don’t leave the hops in more than 3 days to avoid grassy flavours. How can I be sure to avoid that if I follow (2) above? If I dry hop just before fermentation is complete the hops may be in for more than 3 days

 

[The Baron]

I know David it is confusing that is why work out a method that you think will work for you and as long as throughout what you are doing you have a good clean sanitation regime you will be ok.
Re the lid lifting I prepare what I am going to do whether it be adding hops or removing them so that the lid is lifted for the shortest time possible as it is impossible to follow fully the advice of not lid lifting if you are dry hopping adding fruits etc.
Experience will tell you when you have got it right for you and you can always fine tune as you go along