Temperature question.

[Mr Majik]

Hi everybody

Id love a quick answer for the time being but also a link to other discussions people may be aware of that might go in to more detail.

Heres the story so far...

Generaly i do my little "biab" in 4 to 8 liter batches. This weekend though i got adventurous and did a 23l (it took 3 brews as i only have a 10l stock pot, 12 bloomin hours it took me!!)

Today the yeast really kicked in. The wondeful glug glug of the bucket, the lovely, though slightly stronger than a 4l, smell of fermentation. Two of the many joys of this brew malarky.

Mrs Wife has other ideas. Her being Pregnant she get the BotD. "Urgh whats that smell" she said. Long story short i have had to move the bucket to to workshop which is 11/12°C. i'm gussing it will take longer but is that an acceptable temperature. Its just a basic ale recipe with a wilko ale yeast.

So for me, and other noobs like me reading, can someone give us a brief, with links to detailed... Or in fact go full hog here... Details on te effects of temperature, how low is too low & inverse.

Merci

MM

 

[ryanshelton]

Hi everybody

Id love a quick answer for the time being but also a link to other discussions people may be aware of that might go in to more detail.

Heres the story so far...

Generaly i do my little "biab" in 4 to 8 liter batches. This weekend though i got adventurous and did a 23l (it took 3 brews as i only have a 10l stock pot, 12 bloomin hours it took me!!)

Today the yeast really kicked in. The wondeful glug glug of the bucket, the lovely, though slightly stronger than a 4l, smell of fermentation. Two of the many joys of this brew malarky.

Mrs Wife has other ideas. Her being Pregnant she get the BotD. "Urgh whats that smell" she said. Long story short i have had to move the bucket to to workshop which is 11/12°C. i'm gussing it will take longer but is that an acceptable temperature. Its just a basic ale recipe with a wilko ale yeast.

So for me, and other noobs like me reading, can someone give us a brief, with links to detailed... Or in fact go full hog here... Details on te effects of temperature, how low is too low & inverse.

Merci

MM

Someone more experienced will be along soon but im certain at that temp your yeast will go to sleep.

You would be better using a heatbelt of some sort to get the temp up :smile:

 

[ScottM]

Most ale yeast will start to drop out around 15 degrees. They will happily ferment as low as 18 degrees but once you get below that sort of level they will start falling into hibernation. Dangers from this include your ferment stalling, even when bringing the temperature back up.

General rule of thumb for an ale yeast is 18-23 degrees.... unless otherwise stated on the packet.
General rule of thumb for lager yeast is 8-12 degrees.... unless otherwise stated on the packet.
General rule of thumb for turbo yeast is 20-25 degrees... unless otherwise stated on the packet.

Best results for clean flavour are found at the lower end of the limits (18 degrees in your case), fruity ester flavours are found at the higher end.

In your position I would be getting that brew back up to temp ASAP or things may go badly wrong for you.

HTH :)

 

[winelight]

Your options are probably:

a. Brewbelt (easiest but most expensive)
b. Aquarium heater (cheapest but fiddly and risky, you have to clean and sterilise it and drop it in the beer - it's OK if you do it from the start)
c. Put the FV in a builder's bucket of water into which you dangle an aquarium heater

Don't see the point of c, by the time you've bought the bucket and the heater you may as well just buy a brewbelt, it's a lot easier.

 

[morethanworts]

Your options are probably:

a. Brewbelt (easiest but most expensive)
b. Aquarium heater (cheapest but fiddly and risky, you have to clean and sterilise it and drop it in the beer - it's OK if you do it from the start)
c. Put the FV in a builder's bucket of water into which you dangle an aquarium heater

Don't see the point of c, by the time you've bought the bucket and the heater you may as well just buy a brewbelt, it's a lot easier.

Can you set brewbelts to lower than 15C if you want to do a lager? Maybe you can. With an aquarium heater connected to probe/controller of some sort (if the OP ever wanted to go a stage further), you can set it how you want...and if it's in a water bath, which distributes the heat over a wider area of the FV, you also don't have to put the probe in the FV. It's a valid option, at least.

 

[Andyhull]

The brew belts are either on or off.
You could controll one through a PID (STC etc)
The aquarium heater has an internal thermostat so self controlls (not too accurately)

 

[winelight]

Can you set brewbelts to lower than 15C if you want to do a lager? Maybe you can.

Not really... you set the temp by how far up or down you put it, it's a bit hit and miss. I suppose you could have a temperature probe in the FV and use that to switch the belt on and off. You could also do that with a flat heating mat (they sell these for reptile tanks) and sit the FV on top of that, probably give better temp distribution than the belt, since heat rises. You can actually get the kit (mat plus digital controller) at a reasonable price.

With an aquarium heater connected to probe/controller of some sort (if the OP ever wanted to go a stage further), you can set it how you want...and if it's in a water bath, which distributes the heat over a wider area of the FV, you also don't have to put the probe in the FV.

Good point - and probably gives better temperature distribution / stability than any of the other methods.. Personally I just don't want the huge bucket of water around, I make enough splashes and mess as it is...! And don't have room for it anyway.

 

[Andyhull]

Personally I just don't want the huge bucket of water around, I make enough splashes and mess as it is...! And don't have room for it anyway.

Thats why i don't use this method.
I find just using a hot water bottle gives the required amount of heat i need in my fermenting cupboard, just change it 3 times a day.

 

[LeithR]

There is another option, that of using a heating tray under the fv. I have a couple of these and they are 35W and 38W so they are not going to get too hot. I usually put an old towel on the pad and sit the FV on top.

Also useful if you make your own bread!

 

[artyb]

its always best to use a heat source that has a thermostat.... :thumb:
the water jacket with aquarium heater has that, and the large body of water will keep the temp stable

 

[Pearlfisher]

Can you set brewbelts to lower than 15C if you want to do a lager? Maybe you can.

Not really... you set the temp by how far up or down you put it, it's a bit hit and miss. I suppose you could have a temperature probe in the FV and use that to switch the belt on and off. You could also do that with a flat heating mat (they sell these for reptile tanks) and sit the FV on top of that, probably give better temp distribution than the belt, since heat rises. You can actually get the kit (mat plus digital controller) at a reasonable price.

With an aquarium heater connected to probe/controller of some sort (if the OP ever wanted to go a stage further), you can set it how you want...and if it's in a water bath, which distributes the heat over a wider area of the FV, you also don't have to put the probe in the FV.

Good point - and probably gives better temperature distribution / stability than any of the other methods.. Personally I just don't want the huge bucket of water around, I make enough splashes and mess as it is...! And don't have room for it anyway.

Have you a link please where these mats plus digital controller can be bought?

 

[winelight]

Have you a link please where these mats plus digital controller can be bought?

I've seen them on eBay in the past - can't find one now, of course... You can buy the parts separately for about £8 each if you don't mind waiting for them to come from China.

 

[Stu]

its always best to use a heat source that has a thermostat.... :thumb:
the water jacket with aquarium heater has that, and the large body of water will keep the temp stable

I agree. It's not that difficult to have a water bucket. I'm sure many people have suitable buckets or boxes to keep water in that they can then put the FV in.

Personally, I throw mine in the FV (and have modified 2 FVs to do this)

 

[morethanworts]

Even an unheated water bath will still even out temperature changes in the room. I find that on the rare occasion that I lift the lid and check the fv temperature directly, it is very consistent and the external probe in the trug works fine. I haven't been using this set up long but it seems to be working very well indeed.

 

[jonnymorris]

Get your priorities straight... move wife to workshop. Move beer to house. Sorted.

Otherwise, aquarium heater in a bucket of water.

 

[Mr Majik]

Ha ha jonnymorris, i hadn't though of that. That might actually solve a few issues

 

[Mr Majik]

some fantastic feedback there, thank you so much!

So heres the update for now...
First of all, it wasn't wilkos yeast, it was my last packet of safale s-04. The pack says 15c min temp.

i have sat the FV right in front of the small heater in that room over night. It really doesn't go high bit on checking the wort temp today i had 17c so fingers crossed i should be ok!

I'll still be investing in a belt though :thumb:

 

[graysalchemy]

As people have said temp effects the flavour of the beer, but it is also important what the temp is at the different stages of fermentation.

The most critical time is when the yeast is reproducing. This is when the precursors of the esters and the dreaded fusels are made.

For an english beer with plenty of fruity esters you want the temp between 18-21 I air on the 21c side. However if you go above this especially at the beginning then you don't get ester production but the precursors of Fusel alcohols the hot solventy flavours which give hangovers.

If you use a lower temp 15-18c then you are not going to get the esters produced, which is more appropriate to certain styles Scottish ales is a prime example.

As for heating waterbath and aquarium heater seem to be the thing or an insulated cupboard with a tube heater in it. Both can be controlled with a temp controller, an STC-1000 seems to be what most people use.


:thumb: :thumb:

 

[wezil]

Hi not sure if it's of help but I've just been using some Lavins k1-1116 wine yeast (gives florally esters below 16deg) in my latest ferment (melon wine) and had to put it outside yesterday and it was very chilly, but I have to say it didn't bother it that much!!! Obviously I don't know how it would go in an beer ferment but could be useful to somebody (not planning any beer for a while as no space left, otherwise id give it a try)!!!

 

[Mr Majik]

With all this talk on esters etc it got me thinking, has any one got a good book recommendation on yeast and the fermentation process.