stuff that's bothering me about my eleventh brew so far

[Buzzing]

My 11th brew is my 4th AG brew and was done in a Brew-In-A-Bag style.

I attempted to brew a Steam beer, after tasting one at a local micro craft brewery. (In South Africa, this is not a common beer at all as I've only come across the one, so I called my brew the uncommon common)

I used :

5.0 kg Pale Malt
0.3 kg Roasted Malt
0.2 kg Crystal Malt

I used local hops (Southern Brewers @ 60 & 15 and SAB @ 1) to get to a 34 IBU.
My OG was 1.053, so no problems on the efficieny side.

I used a German Alt yeast to ferment this, as the special hybrid (San Francisco ?) yeast is not available locally. The Alt yeast was made into a bit of a yeast starter using a bit of DME.

The concern is that after about 10 hrs, this yeast starter seems to have not really "started" as of yet. There were a few signs of a bit of a creamy / frothy foam ontop, but collectively about half the size of a beer cap. The yeast starters that I normally make like this would be very foamy and frothy to the extent where the complete surface is foamy.

The yeast was pitched in the primary at a slightly higher temp than optimal (24`C), in an attempt to wake those yeasties up a bit. Overnight the temp dropped to 19`C, the bubbler is not bubbling (where normally it already is at this time) but the water has been pushed up a bit. No signs of crausen yet, as there normally is at this stage.

Is this the right yeast to use ?
Is this just a slow start or would I need to re-pitch yeast ?

 

[pittsy]

different yeast , different results , its prob just a slow starter . Wait till tomorrow morning and i'd bet it will have taken off good by then

 

[Buzzing]

Yes, it was a slow starter, but is bubbling away nicely at about 16`C.

Would the Alt yeast at 16`C give the slight fruity / estery character that is needed for a steam beer ?

What would the optimum temp be if a steam beer is to be made with an Alt yeast ?

 

[pittsy]

I would say around 21c is more ideal if eaters etc wanted

 

[Buzzing]

21`C even for an Alt yeast ?

I would have thought a conventional ale yeast would produce esters at that temp, but that it'd be excessive for an Alt yeast ?


Would it be correct to say that a steam beer should be crisp and clear with just a hint of fruity / esters ?

 

[Vossy1]

Which Alt yeast have you used, are there no guidance points on it :hmm:
It's very hard to give advice on using a yeast 'outside' it's stated use as very few folk will have tried it and have the experience to guide you.
Zainasheff says there is simply no replacement for using the real SF yeast and you're description is about right.
If you look here at WLP008 it too is recommended for Alt styles and the temp is 20 - 23 deg c.

EDIT Papazian says to use Lager yeasts at ale fermenting temps, so I'd agree with Pittsy, although hopefully there are some experience brewers on the forum who can give a decisive answer.

 

[Buzzing]

The Alt yeast used was a locally sourced Alt yeast, which the supplier confirmed was a Dusseldorf-Alt with a temp envelope of 17`C-20`C.

So this batch's temps have been all over the place as follows :

0-1 days ; 24`C
1-2 days ; 19`C
2-5 days ; 16`C
5-9 days ; 22`C
9-10 days ; 20`C
10-11 days ; 18`C

It seems fermented out and will be left in the FV for another week to 10 days.

My concern now is the effect of my horrendous temp controll during this brew. What could I expect ?

The temps are probably going to stabilize at about 16-17`C (it's winter here). If left at those temps for another week or two, would that be high enough for the yeasties to still "clear up" the nasties, or would keeping it close to the 20`C throughout be recommended ?

 

[pittsy]

a constant temp is always best but whats done is done , i would try keep it at around 18/20c but you've prob had long enough fermenting , i would try dropping the temp if poss to around 12/15c for 2 to 3 days then bottle

 

[Buzzing]

This brew has been in the Fv for 2 weeks now.

I have not been very successfull at creating an envoronment with stable temps for this brew, mainly due to a sudden cold spell, and partially for choosing the wrong style of brew for this time of year without having proper temperature controlls in place.

The brew is sitting at about 15`C, and has definately fermented out. FG = 1.009.

Would it be advisable to put a tiny amount of Lager yeast with my priming solution upon bottling, planned for sometime during this week ?

If I were not to supply additional Lager yeast and bottle as normal, would the Alt yeast still be available in the brew to carbonate the bottles, seeing that they sat on such low temps for the last 3-4 days ?

 

[pittsy]

even if you froze it then warmed it up there would be enough active yeast available , i would just prime as normal etc , let us know how this tastes etc when ready , i am interested in doing an Altbier :

 

[Buzzing]

I bottled this brew at age 19 days.

The odd thing was that the brew tapped from the bottom seemed "thicker" than my initial Gravity sample (bailed from the top). A quick Gravity check confirmed this and I was sitting with about 1.015/6 at the bottom and with about 1.009/10 at the top of my FV.

The brew did not taste sweet at all, and infact tasted very good. The brew was a bit cloudy, but not normal cloudyness due to yeast. I used the last of my grainbag's stock for this brew and it contained alot of fine "malt flour". I suspect some of this "malt flour" went through the apertures of the grainbag (this was a BIAG style AG) and ended up in the brew. This concerns me as in effect I would have boiled some (even if it's a small percentage) of the grain in the form of this "malt flour, would this have any ill-effects ?

I put my cloudy sample in a glass container in luke warm water for 24 hrs to see if any further fermentation would occur. I sealed the top with some cling-wrap, as I normally do with my yeast starters, as one can normally see the cling-wrap bulging at the top as the CO2 builds up. With my sample after 24 hrs in luke warm water, it showed no signs of further fermentation. This in conjunction with no sweet taste of the brew indicates that all the fermentables have been fermented ?


Could this "cloudiness" by the "malt flour" affect the Gravity readings to this extent ?

Once the brew clears in the bottle and the solids settle out, would the remaining clear beer be negatively affected in any way ?


If a 3 Tier AG system was used, would it have "filtered" out this "malt flour" and prevented it getting in the kettle ?


Any advice / comments ? Having nightmares about me needing to chuck this one down the drain :evil:

 

[pittsy]

hi, batch priming will help slove this problem for next time , by racking into a 2nd vessel (or 3rd if you've already racked it in fermentation period) this will mix it all up and add diluted sugar after a few liters of brew . best to relax have a homebrew :

 

[Buzzing]

So I tested the first sample after a week's carbonation. I understood that a proper steam beer is carbonated med to high.

I went for a 2.5% Co2, which should be fully there in a few days.

The steam beer taste was hoppy and malty with a relatively clean and crisp finish. The fruity notes do appear in the aroma, predominantly, but very much less so in the taste.

I think it basically did achieve a "hybird" scenario between an Ale and a Lager, with a good hoppy character and a crisp malty aftertase with a hint of fruitiness. Is this what a steam beer should be ? I hope so.

This steam beer has an excellent creamy / velvety mouthfeel with a good head. The steam beer is actually quite rich and I would imagine only a few would be consumed in short succession. My AG Bohemian Pilsner also came out very "creamy / velvety", much more so than I expected from a Pilsner. Is this the AG factor kicking it there ?


Anyway, none of this brew would go to waste. :drink: