Stout vs. Porter

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Thumper

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I've never drank a huge amount of stout or porter, but as I get older I find myself liking it more and more.

Since getting into home brewing I've done some reading about the history of beer and beer styles, so I've learned a lot about the origins of stout and porters and their evolution over time. I understand that these days, there isn't really any stylistic difference between porters and dry stouts.

And yet despite that fact, I have noticed over the years that I have a marked preference for those beers marketed as porters, and recently I think I've worked out why. In my experience, beers marketed as stouts tend to be served cold and full of nitrogen, whilst those marketed as porters tend to be served cellar cool from a handpump or keg. I'm wondering if it's the serving method I dislike, rather than the beer.

This is a rule of thumb, of course, but I'm wondering if I might be on to something, and was interested to hear what wiser heads had to say.
 
I think your right about very little stylistic differences between stout and porter but having said that I've read that some brewers consider a stout to be brewed with roasted barley and a porter to be brewed with black malt.
I'm sure you've you've come across the the fact that historically there actually isnt anyway between stout and porter anyway. 'Stout' just meant stronger in ABV% so a stronger porter would be known as a 'stout porter'.

As to the carbonation I think that is just consumer expectation. Because of Guinness and it's 'nitro-head', I expect some (many?) consumers expect all stouts to be the same. As for porter, well that's a 'proper' craft style so therefore has to be a bit diffrent to the usual beer a consumer might drink are willing to accept the low carbonation levels
 
So I could have just been relatively unlucky and picked nutrogen-fuelled stouts? Is there such a thing as nutrogen-fuelled Porter? I've never seen one myself, but as I said I don't drink a lot of either.
 
The part I find amusing is that because porters are almost entirely "craft brews" the ones I see come with the higher abv that craft beers often have. As such the few stouts common in the supermarket are all 4 - 5 % like the rest of British beer but the porters are often 6% or more.

One difference I've come across or maybe I concluded it myself is that stouts often lead towards the coffee flavours where porters stay more chocolatey? End of the day since the porter style all but died it's modern "style" seems more of a constructed entity for competition judging.
 
Stouts and porters are my favourite cooler month beers and I tend to do at least one or the other each year, sometimes both. Homebrew stout is a different matter to commercial stouts though, being able to serve them in your preferred method helps, I liked my stout best from mini keg last year. The big brand commercial stouts aren't great although I was partial to them in my youth. I love porters too though, Samuel Smith's Taddy Porter got me hooked. Their Oatmeal Stout is great too. Now when will my porter be ready to drink... :drink:
 
Although the Porter style did disappear, it is possible to see beers in the Graham Wheeler book that are very much in that sort of genre, to me:

Gales Festival Mild
Black Sheep Riggwelter
Exmoor Beast,
and even Sarah Hughes Ruby

I have made these, roughly speaking, as clones and they all have the same sort of look and mouthfeel as the "blueprint" for the style, if I can suggest it so, the gorgeous Brown Porter recipe copied from Greg Hughes (p 169).
 
Although the Porter style did disappear, it is possible to see beers in the Graham Wheeler book that are very much in that sort of genre, to me:

Gales Festival Mild
Black Sheep Riggwelter
Exmoor Beast,
and even Sarah Hughes Ruby

I have made these, roughly speaking, as clones and they all have the same sort of look and mouthfeel as the "blueprint" for the style, if I can suggest it so, the gorgeous Brown Porter recipe copied from Greg Hughes (p 169).

Any tips on the Riggwelter? That's one I have planned. Found an podcast by Jamil doing a Riggwelter - can you brew it where they interviewed the brewer at Black Sheep.

My Greg Hughes Brown Porter got bottled last night, looking forward to that one.
 
Any tips on the Riggwelter? That's one I have planned. Found an podcast by Jamil doing a Riggwelter - can you brew it where they interviewed the brewer at Black Sheep.

My Greg Hughes Brown Porter got bottled last night, looking forward to that one.

Here is an outline of mine for 25L:

Maris Otter 5kg
Wheat malt 500g
Crystal 300g
Chocolate 200g
Dark sugar 500g

50g of English hops @ 60mins and
25g English hops @ 15mins

EKG / Fuggles etc, etc- will make little difference in a malt forward beer.

Strangest thing is the yeast - I pitched the Danstar ESB English dried yeast, got poor attenuation, so added some US 05 (almost certainly re-used). This odd yeast mix made for a very good beer, but it did take some time.
 
Any tips on the Riggwelter? That's one I have planned. Found an podcast by Jamil doing a Riggwelter - can you brew it where they interviewed the brewer at Black Sheep.

My Greg Hughes Brown Porter got bottled last night, looking forward to that one.

If you want to use a liquid strain use Wyeast 1469 as I've read blacksheep use the timothy taylor strain and that's supposed to be 1469. Even if what I've read is complete BS WY1469 is a really nice yeast and makes a cracking beer
 
Thanks guys, glad to hear that the specific hops don't make too much difference since the recipe (I have the BYOBRA book) has about 3 types which is a pain for storage. Something that caught me in the podcast interview is the brewer says they use pale chocolate malt (Thomas Fawcett's), if using the standard stuff like the book says does it come out any roastier than the commercial beer?

Slid: When you say dark sugar, I take it you mean something like dark soft brown / muscovado? I'd been temped to do a mid-dark invert sugar for the dark beers in that book.

MyQul: Thanks, that's what I was thinking too, I even have that yeast in storage from an overbuilt starter for the Brown Porter, which apparently tasted really good at bottling.
 
Thanks guys, glad to hear that the specific hops don't make too much difference since the recipe (I have the BYOBRA book) has about 3 types which is a pain for storage. Something that caught me in the podcast interview is the brewer says they use pale chocolate malt (Thomas Fawcett's), if using the standard stuff like the book says does it come out any roastier than the commercial beer?

Slid: When you say dark sugar, I take it you mean something like dark soft brown / muscovado? I'd been temped to do a mid-dark invert sugar for the dark beers in that book.

MyQul: Thanks, that's what I was thinking too, I even have that yeast in storage from an overbuilt starter for the Brown Porter, which apparently tasted really good at bottling.

Dark sugar means any unrefined sugar that is by definition dark. The two you suggest are going to be fine. Invert sugar saves you like 12 hours if you are a commercial brewery and makes a difference of exactly zip to us homebrewers.

Here is an example - ASDA is just closest

https://groceries.asda.com/product/...oft-natural-unrefined-cane-sugar/910002231420
 
Thanks guys, glad to hear that the specific hops don't make too much difference since the recipe (I have the BYOBRA book) has about 3 types which is a pain for storage. Something that caught me in the podcast interview is the brewer says they use pale chocolate malt (Thomas Fawcett's), if using the standard stuff like the book says does it come out any roastier than the commercial beer?

Slid: When you say dark sugar, I take it you mean something like dark soft brown / muscovado? I'd been temped to do a mid-dark invert sugar for the dark beers in that book.

MyQul: Thanks, that's what I was thinking too, I even have that yeast in storage from an overbuilt starter for the Brown Porter, which apparently tasted really good at bottling.
Making your own invert isn't rocket science.Easy enough to do on the stove. Golden syrup and mollasses.
here-Making Brewers Invert | half a cat
 
Thanks guys, I've made my own invert sugar before in the form of a dark candi syrup for my Belgian Brunette. I went with the method of boiling with DAP to create Maillard reactions as well as the usual caramelisation. Yes the inversion isn't a big deal for homebrewing but the flavours created will be different from brown sugar, not necessarily better, but different. I've got a pot of blackstrap molasses to try out after reading that blog Chub, not got round to it yet.
 

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