STC 1000 temperature controller

[Springer]

The importance of a constant correct fermentation temperature has always but well up my priority list and I have built two temperature controlled cupboards. One pid controlled, to use it cos I bought the wrong one and one on a room stat.
It is nice to see the actual temperature inside.
I am in the process of converting a fridge for summer and put together a STC 1000, similar to ones supplied ready built by sponsor Cedaronics.
What a great piece of kit. I used it as a monitor for mash tun out temperature the other day. :thumb:
Also for various reasons, don't ask :lol: , I have 25 litres fermenting in the kitchen, on a heat mat, which does tend to put out to much heat.
So enter the STC 1000, second use in week, never mind what it was built for. Put the sensor on the tub, bit of lagging, kitchen roll and a patch of gaffer tape to hold it.
Will also be used for temperature control in the summer for honey processing

Highly recommended, buy or make on.
S

 

[Darcey]

My temp controller gets used in the HLT, Mash tun, FV control and kegerator... a very useful bit of kit. If I hadn't already started building a 3rd i would prob get one from the forum sponsors!

They are all in these plastic tub things but when the cellar build get done they are going to find a new home in a single large enclosure that controls all FV & Kegerator action! Also go a PID somewhere for the HLT.. Hmmm :hmm:

Also now note you can buy the empty case with glands ready cut from Cedaronics for the temperature controllers!? Not bad eh!

 

[Springer]

As you say Darc, a really versatile piece of kit. That pre done box should take some of the hassle out for some people, who are up to the wiring.
Tight ass here, folded up the box from an off cut of aluminum, :lol:
Myself I like the sockets fixed to the box like I did it and your first pic, instead of trailing sockets. :) With surface boxes at 60p or so you only have to drill holes for the mounting and cable entry.
The thing I am not keen on, but it does the job, is the NTC sender, I would sooner have something with a PT100
Will be building at least one other myself.
S

 

[Darcey]

I am yet to find something that a NTC can really 'penetrate' the beer. I am more than happy to fit thermowells to all my FV's but I cant yet find a supplier that will do what I want. I agree i'd rather have the sockets on the enclosure but you have to admit the Cedaronics are pretty good esp with the relay?

PT100... oh yes.. but I dont want to pay PID prices AND PT100s.. for FV control..

 

[Springer]

I am more than happy to fit thermowells to all my FV's but I cant yet find a supplier that will do what I want. .

Could this not be done with fitting, stainless presumably.
Do you not think my thermowell is giving an accurate enough temperature reading? I will use my 18 inch probe to investigate. Could then put any "error" into the STC, to keep it looking right and the jobs a good un. Not thermowell only gaffa tape. :lol:

I agree i'd rather have the sockets on the enclosure but you have to admit the Cedaronics are pretty good esp with the relay?

Sockets to me is a tidy option, nothing wrong with C equipment, excellent. :thumb:

PT100... oh yes.. but I dont want to pay PID prices AND PT100s.. for FV control..

You are spot on D, for the application it is fine.

S

 

[thedrayman]

Now that the STC-1000 from Cedaronics comes with a 40A relay fitted as standard does this mean I can now use it to regulate my HLT (like the many home-made PIDs in this Forum)?

What I’d like to do is replace the current NTC sensor on the STC-1000 with a stainless steel Thermistor Type NTC probe (like Vossy1 had made by Southern Temperature Sensors) so I can use it my HLT thermowell.

If I then set the sparging temperature required, would this set-up work and hold the sparge water at that? I currently have two kettle elements in my HLT so think that I would probably only require one plugged into the STC-1000 when the required temperature is reached.

Any help/advice gratefully received.

Cheers

 

[Springer]

Sounds like a plan to me D. You do need to stir up the water to get a constant temperature, some use a pump others a spoon.
I has forgotten about Vs, nice NTC probes. :hmm: Price looks ok even for me.
Are they meant to be secured with a compression fitting. :?
Vs thread to save others searching

S

 

[Morgan]

What is the point of a 40A rely when you plug the unit into a ring main (32A) on a 13A 3 pin plug?

 

[evanvine]

What is the point of a 40A rely when you plug the unit into a ring main (32A) on a 13A 3 pin plug?

You can run two elements, but you will need 2 plugs and 2 sockets.

 

[Aleman]

What is the point of a 40A rely when you plug the unit into a ring main (32A) on a 13A 3 pin plug?

You can run two elements, but you will need 2 plugs and 2 sockets.

:wha: :wha: :wha: I don't think so :nono: :nono: :hmm: :hmm:

No . . . I'm fairly sure you can't :hmm: :hmm: You definitely would need a dedicated 40A input circuit . . . two 13A plugs is not going to cut it!

The main reason, is for longevity, and to deal with high inrush currents . . . these are of very short duration, but can be 2 or 3 times what you would expect . . . as they are of such short duration they don't affect the fuses in the plugs or the MCB's, but can blow the triac stages in the relay . . . unless you fit an electronic fuse . . . which are frighteningly expensive

 

[evanvine]

You could well be right Tony, but 40A is more than man enough to run two elements.
Contary to views held by some forum members I run two elements from one double socket outlet.
2.7kW x 2 = 5.4kW = 22.5A or 11.25A per plug.

 

[Aleman]

You could well be right Tony, but 40A is more than man enough to run two elements.
Contary to views held by some forum members I run two elements from one double socket outlet.
2.7kW x 2 = 5.4kW = 22.5A or 11.25A per plug.

No, the question was why have a relay rated at 40A in a STC1000 when it is more than likely going to be plugged in via a 13A fuse to a 32A Relay . . . thereby meaning that you will only be able to draw 13A (RMS) from the supply . . why not just have a 15A relay?

Running two devices drawing 13A from a single double sockets for an extended period of time exceeds the manufacturers specification significantly, (Even MK don't rate their sockets as capable of handling 26A). Yes you can 'get away with it' and it might be considered 'good enough' but it is not best practice, and following a fire questions may be asked by an insurance company.

 

[Vossy1]

Contary to views held by some forum members I run two elements from one double socket outlet.

Can you clarify that the cable supplying the socket is rated to 22.5A ev, or is it a punt based on experience :hmm: Even if it's not tripped the MCB do you know the other loads on the circuit and what your load total may be?
Only if you know the answers to these questions should you do it, and to give advice without substantiating should be avoided, or at least point out it's at your own risk.
IMO, unless you know for sure, use 2 different circuits or you're asking for a burn out in the walls/between cavities...is it worth it...no.

I has forgotten about Vs, nice NTC probes. :hmm: Price looks ok even for me.
Are they meant to be secured with a compression fitting.

Yep, or you could use a thermowell.

EDIT, beat me to it T :grin:

 

[evanvine]

It is fed by 2 30A cables + I sought professional advice re using the double socket outlet.
The garage is fed with a 60A armoured cable.
A dedicated 30A fuse ont the distribution board and a 25A trip in the garage.

 

[Aleman]

It is fed by 2 30A cables

As are my metal clad double outlets in the Shed

I sought professional advice re using the double socket outlet.

As did I, and I was told to use separate individual switched spurs for each 13A feed . . . as per the 17th Edition Electricians eh

The garage is fed with a 60A armoured cable.
A dedicated 30A fuse ont the distribution board and a 25A trip in the garage.

Pretty much the same as my shed, although the one thing I've noticed in the past is "good enough rarely ever is"

 

[Springer]

Has that heavy electrical issue now resolved :)

I used the right supply and wired the elements direct from a double pole switch, like they are in their really world as immersion heaters. Although, I can't cart the boiler away to make space, so I am planning to change to 16amp sockets and plugs.

I has forgotten about Vs, nice NTC probes. :hmm: Price looks ok even for me.
Are they meant to be secured with a compression fitting.

Yep, or you could use a thermowell.

:grin:

Now I'm confused again
If using a thermowell , piece of blanked off copper pipe soldered to a tank filling ? , could I not just pop one of those basic NTC sender down it and insulate the wire from the heat, just leaving the tip proud.

S

 

[Aleman]

Has that heavy electrical issue now resolved :)

Not Quite

All MK socket-outlets are manufactured to comply with BS1363 part 2: 1995 and are rated at 13A per unit. Double socket-outlets have been manufactured and tested to exceed this rating by margin that allows electrical safety and reduces the risk of heat and mechanical damage to components due to overloading. It should be noted that BS1363 part 2: 1995 does not allow double sockets to operate at twice the permissible maximum loading and it should be remembered that double socket-outlets are not manufactured to be able to withstand a 26A load for sustained periods of time.

But I think that covers it. :whistle: :whistle: :whistle:


















:rofl:

 

[Springer]

Lovely A, :clap: :lol:
bit what about the thermowell, :? :lol:
S

 

[Cedaronics]

Eek! :shock:

The 40A relay allows the maximum 13A to be drawn, whereas a bare STC-1000's relays will only permit 8A (might be 10, can't remember off the top of my head). The bigger relay helps preserve the life of the STC-1000's relay(s).

Please be careful with this. All our units ship with information that states that 13A is not to be exceeded.

Cheers,

Tim

 

[Morgan]

Right then. Never believe a word of what you read on the internet and do not take the following as gospel - if in doubt consult an expert (easier to sue of the worse happens!!

There is no such thing as a 30A cable. The cable rating is decided by the size of the core, 1mm2/ 4mm2 / 6 mm2 etc AND the length of the cable. However the maximum current capacity will be decided by the desgin of a cable run, for instance a cable in free air will be rated far higher than a cable that is surrounded by loft insulation, your cable is only as good as the weakest point.

Example of derating due to high ambient temps:

Current capacity of cable = 2 Amps
Cable in free air ambient 25c - rating factor of 1.03 (rated current x 1.03) = 2 x 1.03 = 2.06A
Cable in free air ambient temp of 50c rating factor of 0.71 (rated current x 0.71) = 2 x 0.5 = 1A

As can been seen if your ring main passes through the loft on a nice summers day then your 13a socket is really only a 6.5amp supply. Imagine what could happen if your running 2 elements off 2 ring mains (not spurs - a spur is a single main not a ring) so your maxed out on your ring mains, then the missus switches on the tumble drier, reloads the washing machine them put the kettle on for a nice cuppa - if your electrics are old or faulty then your run a real risk of burning down your house.