Short measures

[Nottsbeer]

Interesting read on short measures in pubs etc.

The bit about people's perceptions regarding if the head on a a beer should be included as part of a pint is interesting.

https://www.theguardian.com/money/a...inkers-115-a-year-each-trading-standards-says

 

[jof]

Foam on the top is not part of a pint of liquid.

 

[Caramel Ox]

Would people prefer to be served the drink flat then? Seems like a ridiculous survey of something consumers will instinctively deal with themselves.

 

[Twostage]

Me and the Missus were talking about this a couple of days ago and remembering the days when pint glasses had a pint marker below the rim so you could have a full pint and decent head.

I remember when the pint to the rim beer glasses came in when I was working in a pub. Not popular, split the drinkers between accepting the situation and sacrificing beer for head and those that wanted beer to the top and no head.

I wonder how asking for a pint with a head and the rest of the pint in a half glass would go down ?

FWIW I'm 'happy' to sacrifice quite a bit of beer for a decent head as I think that topping up makes the beer go flat. I like it as a single pour.

 

[Brew_DD2]

My local has the oversized glass with the pint to line. Means you get a pint, and a decent head.

I'd rather be served a pint with good amount of foam and less liquid than some insipid-looking pint of liquid with no foam though. We seem to have an odd conception of beer foam in the UK.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Me and the Missus were talking about this a couple of days ago and remembering the days when pint glasses had a pint marker below the rim so you could have a full pint and decent head.

We used to have those at the sports club where i used to work.

I checked on a recent picture i posted in the drinking tonight thread and neither glasses have a mark to be honest i am not bothered as said above i would rather have a nice head on the beer than it filled as close as they can get it to the rim.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

I searched google images it seems marked pint glasses are as hard to get hold of as hens teeth -

 

[An Ankoù]

I think all the glasses given at beer festivals have a line on them. Or used to.

As for head v full measure, I must check my tank next time I top up with petrol to see whether there's a head on it.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

As for head v full measure, I must check my tank next time I top up with petrol to see whether there's a head on it.

Petrol pumps have to give an exact measure and are regularly checked you cannot get a short measure.

 

[An Ankoù]

Petrol pumps have to give an exact measure and are regularly checked you cannot get a short measure.

I know, Chippy, I was being sarcastic.
Petrol is very much like beer in that duty is paid, and is paid accurately not give or take, say, 10% Duty on beer is paid on the volume of liquid, not on any "head". Make no bones about it, we're being ripped off.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Duty on beer is paid on the volume of liquid, not on any "head". Make no bones about it, we're being ripped off.

We are but that mouth full of beer taken from every pint may mean the difference between a pub staying open or closing i am never going to know for sure if i am getting a full pint so dont give it any thought when paying for my beer.

As for being ripped off a fan phoned 5 live to tell them while they were waiting for news about Nicki Minaj at the Co-Op arena they went to the bar to get a drink only to find a bottle of wine was £35, they didn't buy anything

 

[An Ankoù]

We are but that mouth full of beer taken from every pint may mean the difference between a pub staying open or closing i am never going to know for sure if i am getting a full pint so dont give it any thought when paying for my beer.

That's not a good argument, Chippy. A petrol station has to put up it;s prices if it;s overheads rise, it doesn't have the option of short measures, as you say. So should the pub. In grocery, there is the pernicious practice of reducing the size of a product and charging the same price, but the new size has to be clearly and accurately marked. While I sympathise with publican, I'll go elsewhere, and indeed pay at bit more, if I feel he's taking me for a fool by ripping me off. Who gains there?
Consider this. I pay £5 for a pint and am served 10% short of liquid beer. I move on to the pub next door and pay £5.50 for exactly the same pint, but get a full measure. I've paid exactly the same per ml or cc of beer and I can enjoy my beer knowing that the barman isn't laughing up his sleeve at me

 

[Chippy_Tea]

That's not a good argument, Chippy.

I have no way of knowing I may be getting a short measure so i dont let it ruin my night, if i had not read this thread i would be blissfully unaware this may be going on and now i have i simply dont care.

 

[An Ankoù]

It's an interesting philosophical point. Is it better to be happy or grumpy about these things? Can a Yorkshireman, or a Scot for that matter, be anything but grumpy in such circumstances. I suppose if things were equal it would be OK: if I were short of a bob or two* would the barman say "don't worry, that's near enough."? It's the same reason why pacifism is ultimately doomed to failure. But, as beings, we strive for happiness and if you're happy then you could argue you're closer to that goal than the likes of me. Yet I feel there's some fallacy in this argument, somewhere.
* in fact on arrival in Blighty in March, I withdrew £150 from a cash machine so we could do the town a bit. Ten days later, I returned with £125 and some change. Nobody would take my money. I had to pay for most things, no matter how small, by card.
Don't recall having any sort measures, though, so maybe Chippy's right. I'll be more vigilant next time.

Missing the obvious answer here: maybe most of us are not getting ripped off and most publicans are honest men or women. Maybe such things only happen in London.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Missing the obvious answer here: maybe most of us are not getting ripped off and most publicans are honest men or women. Maybe such things only happen in London

I guess its all down to trust, take the the two pint glasses below from my last night out neither have marks both are a different height and width we have no way of knowing how much beer is in either so have to assume its a full pint and that publicans are honest men or women.

 

[matt.]

Interesting read on short measures in pubs etc.

The bit about people's perceptions regarding if the head on a a beer should be included as part of a pint is interesting.

https://www.theguardian.com/money/a...inkers-115-a-year-each-trading-standards-says

I saw that bit about including the head.
Is that true / law?

 

[Twostage]

I guess its all down to trust, take the the two pint glasses below from my last night out neither have marks both are a different height and width we have no way of knowing how much beer is in either so have to assume its a full pint and that publicans are honest men or women.


View attachment 99915

They look well short of a pint to me .


(Couldn't resist )

 

[Chippy_Tea]

They look well short of a pint to me .


(Couldn't resist )

I had a sip out of both

 

[Stu]

Me and the Missus were talking about this a couple of days ago and remembering the days when pint glasses had a pint marker below the rim so you could have a full pint and decent head.

I remember when the pint to the rim beer glasses came in when I was working in a pub. Not popular, split the drinkers between accepting the situation and sacrificing beer for head and those that wanted beer to the top and no head.

I wonder how asking for a pint with a head and the rest of the pint in a half glass would go down ?

FWIW I'm 'happy' to sacrifice quite a bit of beer for a decent head as I think that topping up makes the beer go flat. I like it as a single pour.

It was very much a northern thing in the 90s. I say that as a southerner who moved to Lancashire in '93 and married a local (my current wife is also from Greater Manchester).

Carbonated beer came measured - bar staff would literally press a button for a half, then again to fill it. So they had to have oversized glasses.

Just asked the wife. She doesn't remember the pre-measures, but very much used to serve beer in oversized glasses.

I ran a pub around 1996 and we certainly didn't.

 

[WillFrites]

This is just a lack of training/knowledge coming through.
As a longtime barman/waiter I have seen people who have no idea about weights and measures act etc.