Reusing Nottingham Yeast Cake

[DirtyCaner]

Hi Folks,

I'm planning on bottling my APA this weekend whils simutaneously knocking up another 23l of Citra Pale ale. I would like to pitch the new wort onto the existing yeast and use it to ferment. This will

1) Save using a new packet of yeast

2) Save me having to wash and sanitise my FV (I'm a lazy bar steward)

However, I hear that reusing Nottingham Ale yeast can be a tad unpredicatable, possibly volatile (GraysAlchemy any comment?)...

Anybody got any advice about the best way to do this, or at least one that isn't gonna redecorate my fermenting cupboard? I did wonder about maybe starting it off a a lower temp...

Cheers,

DirtyC

 

[danb]

im also interested in the answer to this, but just reading up at the minute on washing and putting into sample containers if I can get my head round it.

 

[graysalchemy]

I would seriously wash and sterilise your fv. How long is it going to take to get piece of mind? You wouldn't put normally in in an unsterlised Fv :nono: :nono:

You may also find that it will go off like a rocket and you may end up with a dirty fermentation, I don't need to post that photo do I. :hmm: :hmm:

I would consider taking half of it out and clean that FV whilst you are at it. :lol: :lol:

 

[PD]

I've just started to re-use my yeast cake when doing back to back similar styles of beers.
I just poured the complete yeast cake with a little of the remaining wort into a steralised and well rinsed DJ.
It went into the fridge overnight and was used the next evening, no washing rinsing etc.
The next brew was not an immediate starter and took overnight to get going...then it pushed thro the air lock and fermented like billy-oh. ( Edinburgh Scottish Ale Yeast WLP028 )

I was impressed.

 

[graysalchemy]

WLP028 is a slow starter :thumb:

Notty isn't be warned you may end up with this

 

[DirtyCaner]

Aye, that was the photo I was thinking of GA!

I too used the WLP028 straight off racking into bottling bucket. Ended up with another amazing 80/-.

I'm kinda looking to avoid the explosion thing, I don't reall mind pouring off yeast or even washing it. I dont want to waste my brew though. Just would be nice to reuse yeast if I could.

Has anyone else tried this without explosion? Or should I just go for small sample of yeast and a sterilised FV?

DC

 

[PD]

Put a large blow off tube on at the start, with lots of jugs handy.

 

[graysalchemy]

As I said you could remove half the yeast or look at Mr Malty for guidance on how much yeast to use.

 

[robsan77]

Leave about a pint of beer behind and use that to swill the yeast around before pouring into a sterilized container, taller the better.

Wash the fv and sanitize.

Ideally, let the yeast settle a bit in your container. This way you can decant the remaining beer and allow the trub to sink to the bottom allowing you to pitch the healthy yeast inbetween both.
You should only need about half the original quantity of yeast and you can save the other half for another brew.

 

[Cyclops]

When repitching yeast remember that it multiplies by about 4-5 time itself :)

 

[graysalchemy]

Over pitching also reduces the ester productions as this is made when the yeast is multiplying. If you over pitch then the yeast don't need to multiply as much hence less ester production.

May not be a problem with a hoppy pale ale but would be for an english bitter. :thumb:

 

[olriley]

I've pitched straight onto the trub before, no real issues, but last time I did it thus:
- a couple of days before, drop the beer from the primary into a clean, sterile secondary FV. Chuck the primary trub (usually large amount, mostly dead yeast etc) on the compost. Stand the beer in the secondary in a cold place to settle out.
- bottle from the secondary, and then pitch your new wort onto the last dregs of beer and tiny bit of trub in the secondary.
I got nice clean beer and a good start to my new batch.

Blow off tube is good idea though yes.

 

[PD]

I'm also thinking along those lines.
I usually leave my wort in primary for a good long time till its past fermenting. I'm now thinking of transferring to the seconadary earlier, disposing of the large trub in the primary and re using the smaller trub left in the secondary. Possibly growing it on with some wort and split into several small PET bottles to be fridged for future use.

 

[graysalchemy]

The primary trub actually has the better yeast than that you get in a secondary. The stuff out of a secondary tends to be the stuff which has not flocculated and stayed in suspension. What happens over subsequent generations if you follow this is a yeast which doesn't flocculate and thus settle out. Also doesn't compact as well in the bottle.

:thumb:

 

[PD]

food for thought. Cheers Alistair

 

[Cyclops]

The primary trub actually has the better yeast than that you get in a secondary. The stuff out of a secondary tends to be the stuff which has not flocculated and stayed in suspension. What happens over subsequent generations if you follow this is a yeast which doesn't flocculate and thus settle out. Also doesn't compact as well in the bottle.

:thumb:

Sorry I have to disagree with this, the primary trub will be the worst yeast as it will be made up of dead yeast that has sunk to the bottom and not stayed in suspension.

This is why they double drop, because the healthy yeast will be in suspension still and leaving behind the **** yeast.

 

[graysalchemy]

Yes but if you wash it and seperate it then the second layer will be the best layer. Double dropping is done early one to remove the break material primarily and also to introduce a bit of oxygen back in.

 

[robsan77]

The primary trub actually has the better yeast than that you get in a secondary. The stuff out of a secondary tends to be the stuff which has not flocculated and stayed in suspension. What happens over subsequent generations if you follow this is a yeast which doesn't flocculate and thus settle out. Also doesn't compact as well in the bottle.

:thumb:

And it will be more attenuative so you will get a drier, stronger beer.

 

[robsan77]

The brewstrong pod cast on repitching is well worth a listen regarding this topic. Some very experienced brewers talking about their views on the matter.

 

[DirtyCaner]

Thanks for all the replies guys!

Judging by the MrMalty calculator (great recommendation GA, not seen this before now!) I should probably use about 100ml of sludge from the cake. That's using the default settings.

So I think that's what I'll do. I'll let you know how it goes.

Cheers,

DirtyC