Pressure barrel priming.......under pressure

[Corbières]

As you will obviously be able to tell, I’m VERY new at this. After watching too many YouTube videos, i have ended up with a standard pressure barrel, S30 pin valve cap and also with added pressure gauge. Also has a schrader valve . First EVER brew Evil Dog Double IPA finished fermentation and transferred to barrel with priming sugar. I the pressurised barrel with CO2 bulb to 5psi on the gauge - after venting back from 8psi. I can vent further with the schrader valve. Now sitting sealed in a warm place. Problems ??

 

[Buffers brewery]

Not that I can see. Secondary fermentation should start in a day or two. You’ll see the pressure gradually increase. Depending on how much sugar you’ve added the pressure might rise sufficient to blow the relief valve but that’s what it’s supposed to do. I tend to bleed off any pressure over 10 psi to avoid stressing the PB and the gauge but not essential. You’ll know when fermentation is finished as pressure will stop increasing, usually a couple of weeks. Then move your PB to somewhere cool to condition for a couple of weeks or more, if you can wait.

 

[Corbières]

Not that I can see. Secondary fermentation should start in a day or two. You’ll see the pressure gradually increase. Depending on how much sugar you’ve added the pressure might rise sufficient to blow the relief valve but that’s what it’s supposed to do. I tend to bleed off any pressure over 10 psi to avoid stressing the PB and the gauge but not essential. You’ll know when fermentation is finished as pressure will stop increasing, usually a couple of weeks. Then move your PB to somewhere cool to condition for a couple of weeks or more, if you can wait.

Thanks very much for your response. As I pressurised to 8psi and then vented back to 5psi out the schrader valve, did I purge the head space oxygen? And if I did, can fermentation happen if there isn’t any oxygen for the remaining yeast and newly added sugar (150g btw as per kit instructions). Thanks in advance.

 

[Buffers brewery]

It's unlikely that you've purged all the oxygen. In the past I've injected gas with the cap loose in an attempt to purge oxygen before sealing the lid. Hasn't affected the secondary fermentation.

 

[dbuchanan]

I’m doing my first pressure brew too. I am not sure even after 14 days if the fermentation is finished. After drawing off some (tastes great) the pressure drops (obvs) but then rises again. This suggests it’s still active to me - yeah? Also if I bottle do i still add carbonation tabs to the bottles?

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

You are likely to have vented most of the oxygen because CO2 is heavier than air.

You don’t need oxygen for the yeast to produce CO2 during secondary fermentation. Yeast needs oxygen only at the start of primary fermentation in order to grow more yeast. Right now you *really* don’t want oxygen anywhere near your beer or it will spoil.

Secondary fermentation can continue for several weeks if you store your beer somewhere cool (eg garage). The rate of production of CO2 will be quite slow so you may find you have to inject CO2 if you pull several pints in quick succession. This will be more likely at the start of the barrel because there’s not a lot of gas in that small head space and toward the end of the barrel because the head space is so much bigger and the production of CO2 is quite low by then.

If the pressure in your barrel falls to the point that opening the tap is likely to glug and suck air in - STOP. Wait for pressure to build or inject CO2, if you allow air to glug in you will allow oxygen in and again risk spoiling the beer. If this does happen, purge the head space again and you should get away with it as long as you don’t do it too often!

Good luck!

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

After drawing off some (tastes great) the pressure drops (obvs) but then rises again. This suggests it’s still active to me - yeah? Also if I bottle do i still add carbonation tabs to the bottles?

That’s right, secondary fermentation is still producing CO2.

Carbonation of bottles from the barrel is tricky to advise on because the beer has an unknown level of carbonation. Because of this there are several factors from safety to personal taste. If you’re bottling into glass I’d say you are best to not add carbonation drops or, if you do, use half the amount. If you are bottling into plastic (PET) bottles then I’d say go for it but recognise your beer may become over-carbonated. With plastic this is not a safety concern, with glass it is because glass can shatter - quite explosively in the worst case.

 

[Scottyburto]

That’s right, secondary fermentation is still producing CO2.

Carbonation of bottles from the barrel is tricky to advise on because the beer has an unknown level of carbonation. Because of this there are several factors from safety to personal taste. If you’re bottling into glass I’d say you are best to not add carbonation drops or, if you do, use half the amount. If you are bottling into plastic (PET) bottles then I’d say go for it but recognise your beer may become over-carbonated. With plastic this is not a safety concern, with glass it is because glass can shatter - quite explosively in the worst case.

All this above & open up your PB and bottle at room temperature. Co2 is less likely to stay in the beer at a higher temp. Therefore the amount of existing co2 in the beer will be lower.

 

[Andy44]

You are likely to have vented most of the oxygen because CO2 is heavier than air.

You don’t need oxygen for the yeast to produce CO2 during secondary fermentation. Yeast needs oxygen only at the start of primary fermentation in order to grow more yeast. Right now you *really* don’t want oxygen anywhere near your beer or it will spoil.

Secondary fermentation can continue for several weeks if you store your beer somewhere cool (eg garage). The rate of production of CO2 will be quite slow so you may find you have to inject CO2 if you pull several pints in quick succession. This will be more likely at the start of the barrel because there’s not a lot of gas in that small head space and toward the end of the barrel because the head space is so much bigger and the production of CO2 is quite low by then.

If the pressure in your barrel falls to the point that opening the tap is likely to glug and suck air in - STOP. Wait for pressure to build or inject CO2, if you allow air to glug in you will allow oxygen in and again risk spoiling the beer. If this does happen, purge the head space again and you should get away with it as long as you don’t do it too often!

Good luck!

Hi, sorry to high jack this post, I had a problem with too much pressure and the tap started leaking, managed to seal the tap but had to remove it and lost all the carbonation. Is there gauge out there that fits directly on to the s30 valve?

Regards
Andy44

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

Hi, sorry to high jack this post, I had a problem with too much pressure and the tap started leaking, managed to seal the tap but had to remove it and lost all the carbonation. Is there gauge out there that fits directly on to the s30 valve?

Regards
Andy44

Not directly, the S30 valve doesn’t allow gas out (to measure) other than to vent excess pressure.

You can buy a pressure gauge and cap with a Schrader valve. Here’s one from Baliihoo...

https://www.balliihoo.co.uk/barrels...-with-hole-no-valve-pressure-test-point-gauge
Here’s one in use, I’ve just taken a photo of...

You can buy digital tyre pressure gauges and Schrader valves from loads of places.

 

[Andy44]

Not directly, the S30 valve doesn’t allow gas out (to measure) other than to vent excess pressure.

You can buy a pressure gauge and cap with a Schrader valve. Here’s one from Baliihoo...

https://www.balliihoo.co.uk/barrels...-with-hole-no-valve-pressure-test-point-gauge
Here’s one in use, I’ve just taken a photo of...
View attachment 44151

You can buy digital tyre pressure gauges and Schrader valves from loads of places.

Thanks for your quick response I will get straight on to buying one.

 

[dbuchanan]

That’s right, secondary fermentation is still producing CO2.

Carbonation of bottles from the barrel is tricky to advise on because the beer has an unknown level of carbonation. Because of this there are several factors from safety to personal taste. If you’re bottling into glass I’d say you are best to not add carbonation drops or, if you do, use half the amount. If you are bottling into plastic (PET) bottles then I’d say go for it but recognise your beer may become over-carbonated. With plastic this is not a safety concern, with glass it is because glass can shatter - quite explosively in the worst case.

Thank you. I will try both I think

 

[Garmostripel]

Not directly, the S30 valve doesn’t allow gas out (to measure) other than to vent excess pressure.

You can buy a pressure gauge and cap with a Schrader valve. Here’s one from Baliihoo...

https://www.balliihoo.co.uk/barrels...-with-hole-no-valve-pressure-test-point-gauge
Here’s one in use, I’ve just taken a photo of...
View attachment 44151

You can buy digital tyre pressure gauges and Schrader valves from loads of places.

Hi I’ve bought one of these and tried using it on my PB for the first time today (40 pints Woodefords WHERRY), but I couldn’t get the digital gauge to fit the valve properly it seemed too big, am I missing something or just being really stupid?

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

The digital gauge just presses on the top of the Schrader valve, it doesn’t fit over the valve. When you press it onto the top of the Schrader valve it will display the pressure.

 

[Garmostripel]

The digital gauge just presses on the top of the Schrader valve, it doesn’t fit over the valve. When you press it onto the top of the Schrader valve it will display the pressure.

When I try , it just goes flush on top of the valve and doesn’t touch the pin. I can press the pin a little with my finger and it hisses so I know there is pressure in the barrel, which is something. But I’m baffled

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

Here’s a picture of what mine looks like at the business end, a picture when held to the valve to show the fit of the Schrader valve into the gauge, and fitted over the valve in order to take a reading. Does your gauge look the same and is the Schrader valve able to fit into the gauge like mine?

 

[Garmostripel]

That’s exactly the same gauge as mine, but the valve won’t fit into it. I’ve pressed down as much as I dare but it won’t have it.

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

It sounds like the barrel on your Schrader valve is too big? If the valve and gauge were both supplied as part of a kit it might be worth going back to the supplier.

 

[Garmostripel]

My thoughts too, I’ll email Ballihoo.
thanks for your help
Gaz