Possible Hefeweizen fail...

[Nelson81]

Hi folks, just after some advice and thoughts! I am just in the process of brewing my third Weizen in as many months due to developing a real taste for the style! My previous two 14L batches were made with the Wyeast 3068 smack packs, and with great success. My latest attempt is a full 23L into the fermenter, so I decided on using some WHC Banana split yeast (2x 11g) packs from MM to save some pennies over liquid yeast. Now fermentation went off like a rocket in my brew fridge @23.5C (higher temp range to encourage banana esters) and after the usual offensive sulphur bomb subsided, fermentation seems to be completely over after only 5 days with an FG of 1.009.

Now the sample out of the FV is milky beige/grey, has zero banana aroma and is quite 'sour'. Could anyone perhaps advise on my next step? Cold crash? leave extra time in the FV? Bottle now and hope for the best? Just after some advice really as im pretty disappointed with how this one is looking/tasting!

 

[dad_of_jon]

I've never used WHC banana split but I do have a pack and it's down for my next brew. I normally use mangrove jacks bavarian yeast and have never had a sourness with that. The same applied to the wb-06 yeast. I've never needed more than 1 packet for 21 litres either, but I have fermented from 22-28 and its all been fine.

 

[Nelson81]

I've never used WHC banana split but I do have a pack and it's down for my next brew. I normally use mangrove jacks bavarian yeast and have never had a sourness with that. The same applied to the wb-06 yeast. I've never needed more than 1 packet for 21 litres either, but I have fermented from 22-28 and its all been fine.

I've used various WHC dried yeasts over the last few months with success, so I'm leaning more towards either an overpitch or an infection..

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

An “infection” (more accurately a colonisation of the wort by wild yeast or lactobacillus) sounds pretty unlikely, as you pitched a good amount of yeast and the fermentation got off nice and fast. So I’d lean towards it being more likely something to do with the fermentation conditions or wort composition.
If I were you I’d ping TMM via their ‘contact us’ as I’ve always found them very knowledgeable and helpful - and I know they have made quite a big ‘bet’ on WHC yeasts doing what they’re supposed to.

 

[MashBag]

Yup I am thinking infection.

 

[JockyBrewer]

A grey colour always suggests oxidation to me, but the sourness sounds more like infection.

I'd leave it a week and see if it improves. If not then the drain calls.

 

[MashBag]

grey colour always suggests oxidation

Really? What sort of grey are we taking about? Cloudynees?

 

[Deadhead]

Definitely sour and not heavy peppery/clove flavour?

Him. I'd give it a week or so and see if it's improved or worse.

 

[JockyBrewer]

Really? What sort of grey are we taking about? Cloudynees?

When you pour a really oxidised beer you’ll often see through the pour itself a grey/purple tinge in the normal straw/yellow/orange you’d expect of a beer.

In the glass the colour of the beer will look dulled and slightly grey.

It’s really difficult to capture in a photo though - here’s a heavily oxidised NEIPA. To the actual eye it was quite grey.

 

[Nelson81]

Ok folks, thanks for all your input and help, it’s very much appreciated. So a quick update, just took a sample a it seems to have cleaned up considerably over the last few days.

I’m still lacking any Banana notes, I’m putting this down to no chilling overnight in a plastic cube for the first time (have previously no chilled in the kettle). So I believe I may have pitched the yeast at around 12-14 degrees which may well be the reason for this flavour profile..

I also have a massive amount of trub in the bottom of the FV which could have influenced the first few samples.

Lastly I think the blow off tube may be a factor, I replaced this with a standard airlock once I knew the bulk of fermentation was complete, as I noticed large air bubbles in the tube, not escaping and releasing through the bottle of sanitiser (hope this makes sense), ie I could see lots of air bubble activity but no gases escaping…

So to summarise, I should really be more patient before posting on here in a panic and I shall bottle over the next day or so and embrace more clove/pepper notes and less banana!

 

[Caramel Ox]

When I used wb06 I noted that banana seemed to come and go and I wasn’t sure if in fact I was the variable. It’s an interesting taste as some people don’t get it at all? Came back in bottle though so maybe will come good.

 

[JockyBrewer]

When I used wb06 I noted that banana seemed to come and go and I wasn’t sure if in fact I was the variable. It’s an interesting taste as some people don’t get it at all? Came back in bottle though so maybe will come good.

WB06 is more of a wit yeast than a hefeweizen yeast. Much less expressive.

 

[Nelson81]

Well,4 days conditioning so the obligatory taster! Everything a weizen should be regarding mouthfeel, appearance, aroma.. with the previously mentioned lack of banana.. and a quite distinct tartness on the backend (possible Chemsan suckback from blow off tube?)… nevertheless it will be drunk, even with an element of moderately feigned enthusiasm

 

[starseeker]

Did you pitch two packs of yeast for any particular reason ?

 

[Nelson81]

Did you pitch two packs of yeast for any particular reason ?

It's a habit I've developed over my last few brews with other whc yeasts, largely in part due to the low cost and reading about problems with people under pitching. Also the Brewfather calculator suggests to use 2 packs. I am aware though that weizens need a stressed yeast to produce certain desirable esters, so will go for the single pack next time....