Partial mash vs kits?

[Beerlover]

Been off the scene for a couple of years and got a couple of kits back on the go, keep wondering about these “Partial Mash” clone kits though, I like the sound of these as some of my favourite beers can be cloned, Proper Job, Punk IPA etc, I understand that there’s a little bit more work involved obviously with the stove top and SS vessel, I was just really wondering how they compare quality and taste wise to the kits, obviously different beers will differ but generally are they worth the extra effort?
Cheers...

 

[Sandimas]

Absolutely - the step up from kits to partial-mash is way more then the step up from partial-mash to full AG. In fact, as an AG brewer, I'd say the only real advantage of AG is infinite variety, maybe a bit more quality.

I've made the partial-mash clone of Proper Job and done an A/B with the real thing outside a St Austell pub, I couldn't tell the difference. Well worth the extra effort and time over kits.

 

[Beerlover]

Absolutely - the step up from kits to partial-mash is way more then the step up from partial-mash to full AG. In fact, as an AG brewer, I'd say the only real advantage of AG is infinite variety, maybe a bit more quality.

I've made the partial-mash clone of Proper Job and done an A/B with the real thing outside a St Austell pub, I couldn't tell the difference. Well worth the extra effort and time over kits.

Thanks for the reply Darrellm, think I might have to give them a go as Proper Job is one of my all time favourites! Would I be right in thinking the only extra equipment I’d need would be a stainless steel pot and a decent thermometer?

 

[Brew_DD2]

Thanks for the reply Darrellm, think I might have to give them a go as Proper Job is one of my all time favourites! Would I be right in thinking the only extra equipment I’d need would be a stainless steel pot and a decent thermometer?

You'll want a mashing bag too.

 

[Sandimas]

A 15L catering stockpot is what I use, off eBay. And yes, thermometer and grain bag.

I guess this is the one you're looking at?
https://www.shop4homebrew.co.uk/partial-mash-st-austell-proper-job-style.html

I've not done these kits so not sure what the ratio of grain to malt extract is, but it says a 15L pot should be OK. You do a reduced-volume boil compared to AG.

 

[Beerlover]

Yeah that’s the one I was looking at, is partial mash relatively straight forward or is there a lot more to it?

 

[terrym]

Yeah that’s the one I was looking at, is partial mash relatively straight forward or is there a lot more to it?

Looking at the 3.5kg of LME in the St Austell kit you linked, my guess is that it's not a partial mash kit it's an extract kit with steeping grains.
More on that here
https://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/threads/a-simple-guide-to-extract-brewing.75501/
You will still need a stockpot.
Stove top partial mash BIAB is relatively easy, but still takes a few hours. I use an 11 litre stock pot that fits on the largest ring on my electric hob, a 300 mesh bag off ebay and a cheap Wilko plastic bowl with holes drilled into it to drain and sparge the bag. I use several sinkfuls of cold water to cool the wort. All my recipes are built round 1kg Pale Malt plus smaller quantities of additional grain for either steeping or mashing, and 1.5 kg DME, with final volume adjusted to suit the target OG.
More on BIAB here although there is other stuff on the forum if you look.
https://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/threads/biab-guide-for-beginners.49766/
And I stopped using LME for extract and partial mashes since I sometimes got traces of the dreaded twang. I don't get that with DME.
My suggestion to you is to buy a stockpot and the basic ingredients for a SMASH and have a go at an extract brew or a partial mash. There are loads of recipes out there. And when you get into the swing of things you will find its much more fun trying to create your own recipes rather than buying the ingredients for a commercial beer which may or may not work, and its usually cheaper too.

 

[Sandimas]

I can recommend this one as a Project Job clone, it's a bit more pricey that the other one but has DME instead of LME so less risk of the twang
https://www.brewuk.co.uk/st-austell-proper-job.html

I think you're right terrym those shop4homebrew kits look like extract. Hard to work out exactly what's in them from the description, as if they include 3.5kg of LME what other grains can there be, as PJ is a pale brew.

 

[Slid]

My "take" on a Partial Mash was always a 10L AG done as a BIAB with a 15L stockpot and a large oven, plus a one can kit. This makes much better beer than any kit (IMHO) and the hop additions are your own. The kit gives you the bittering for most purposes, so it is fairly fool-proof. I did 27 of these, before going Grainfather AG. They are really good. A kit plus steeping grains and hops is a step up from "just a kit", but the real jump in quality comes from mashing some base malt.

 

[Duxuk]

Before AG I was very happy with my extract plus steeped crystal brews. You still need a decent stockpot to boil the hops but I used to boil it concentrated then dilute to get a bigger brew. I moved on to mashing some grain to mix with a reduced amount of extract but can't remember it being better. It was just a step towards AG, which isn't necessarily better but gives you loads more options. Extract brews have apparently won competitions! I have now done 146 modified BIABs! Who drank all that?

 

[ExpatBrewer]

I transitioned to partial mash brewing several years ago and it is now my usual approach to brewing. It gives you all the benefits of AG brewing but without the capital outlay and space and plumbing requirements that AG usually requires as they can be easily done at a stove-top level . And, a partial mash brew day, though much longer than an extract/kit brew session is usually a lot less time-consuming than AG.

When I first explored the idea of partials I replicated a favourite extract beer recipe, swapping out the LME for mashed pale malt. I brewed the extract version then a couple of weeks later brewed it again as a partial - essentially 50% extract (kit) and 50% mashed ale malt. When doing a taste comparison my initial reaction was they were pretty much identical! But after a bit of closer analysis it became apparent that the partial did have a somewhat cleaner and fresher aspect to it. The difference wasn't huge and I did wonder whether it was worth the extra effort but in the end I decided it was. Also, working with grains feels more like brewing compared to just simply mixing a bunch of ingredients together from cans!

I have a 20 litre SS pot and typically mash between 2-2.5kg grain. I generally build recipes around a 'neutral' base like the Coopers OS Lager can which is often sold cheaply at my local supermarket. It's essentially 1.7kg of pre-hopped light LME sold quite a bit cheaper than a can of unhopped LME form my local brew shop! From 2-ish kg of grain I usually end up with around 10-12 litres of fresh wort after sparging which I then bring to the boil on an induction cooker... which is not only much quicker, but also requires less energy compared to heating up full volume AG wort! I've also found that I can get away with 30 minute boils too if using a kit for the LME. As most of the base bittering is provided by the kit itself all I'm really doing is pasteurising the wort and boiling late flavour and aroma hop additions. All up my brew days are around 3 - 3.5 hours in duration.

Out of curiosity though, I did brew a 10 liter AG batch of a pale ale I'd just brewed a week before as a full-batch partial. Again I did a taste comparison and to be honest, this time there was no difference in terms of the clean, fresh aspect of the beer.... not that I could pick anyway. I think from this I reckon that once you get enough fresh wort into the mix, in my case around 50%, there really is no detectable difference between a partial mash and AG.

So, for me partial mash brewing seems a great 'best of both worlds' approach - has the same recipe design advantages of AG, can be done on a stove top (2.5kg of grain is far more manageable than 5kg!), there's minimal $ outlay and brew day is quite a bit shorter. And... in the end, same result.

:thumba:

 

[Sandimas]

I've never quite got to grips with the brewing terms but I probably do partial mash too: I do my brew in a 15L stockpot, BIAB mash 1.5-2.5L of grain then supplement that with 1kg DME so that I can brew 17/18L. For me it's the best compromise of cost, time and method. With this setup AG the most I could manage was 12L.

I think the biggest step up from kits is when you use un-hopped LME or DME and do a full 60min boil to extract the bitterness from the hops, rather than relying on pre-bittered extract in a kit. I think the kit manufacturing process takes something away, maybe it's the pasteurisation for canning? When I moved from extract to partial-mash I didn't really notice a change in quality but it was cheaper, offered more variety of gain combinations, and was more pleasurable than just emptying a bag of DME.

 

[terrym]

+1 on above post #12