Old ale

[timbrew]

So I have just finished watching the gripping TV show "game of thrones" and have been inspired by the amount of ale drinking; to find out if there are any medieval brewing techniques to recreate some good ol original English ale. I found this, http://byo.com/hops/item/1357-searching-for-medieval-ale
although I don't have the time to make id like to hear if anyone has and learn of the outcome .
Happy brewing
Tim

 

[timbrew]

Anyone at all used an old recipe ?

 

[Covrich]

Not sure whether I would fancy that or not

I read they drank ale alot in the morning in GoTs like at breakfast but mostly they drink Wine from the Arbour or Dorne.

I wonder it must be pretty weak

 

[Grumpydev]

They drank "ale" and "wine" in ye olde days because it was safer than the water, but it had hardly any alcohol in it - you probably wouldn't even think it was alcoholic if you brewed one of those recipes.

 

[johnnyboy1965]

In days long gone beer was drank because the liquor was boiled, so making it safer to drink. Baer/ale was brewed exactly the same as we do now, but divided into two brews. The first mash runnings were fermented and drank as normal, but what they used to do then, is sparge to get all the sugars out of the mash. This was not as strong as the first runnings, but fermented the same. This was also known as "small" beer and later "breakfast beer"...but this is debateable...the wording "breakfast beer".
No hops were added, as hops became a later addition. I have brewed a beer using this method, and to be honest, didn't taste very nice, not the flavour, but because it didn't have any hops in it. I think we have conditioned our taste buds for hops in beer.

 

[johnnyboy1965]

Also, it was never carbonated, another recent thing.

 

[rodwha]

I'm certainly interested. I haven't looked too deeply into it but reading a book with origins of the IPA speaks of these various beers that were made (4 using partigyle)

 

[BeestonHop_John]

Hi Timbrew, i just finished reading a book, and it included some old recipes that you might want try. The book is 'Wisdom for home brewers' by Bruning & Sadler.
The recipes are: Gruit ale, brewed till the 1400s (OG 1080, abv 7.5%); Welsh spiced honey ale (OG 1070, abv 6%); Tudor table beer (OG 1055, abv 5%); Old ale, from about 1820 (OG 1085, abv 8%); Scottish stock ale, dates from1896 (OG 1098, abv 9.5%); and Ebulum, which they call a digestive (OG 1100, abv 10%).
The ebulum sounds really interesting, as its brewed with elderberries rather than hops (for their tannins) and requires 6 months maturing for a rich port-like ale.

 

[timbrew]

Hi all, wow a lot of interesting stuff here !breakfast beer now that sounds pretty good! I knew that the water wasn't as safe as the wine or beer, they are always portrayed as heavy drinkers ! But if the techniques where different due to lack or hops and fizz it may taste a bit odd!
Thanks @beestonhop_john I'll definitely have to look for it!!

Although it may have been different to what we are used to there must have been something slightly appealing to it!
Once again thanks for all your replies!

Tim

 

[MyQul]

I would also add to jb1965's post's that the reason we don't bother making different strength beers from more than one mash running is that malt today is very well modified so you don't need to bother as you can can extract most of the sugars out in one go.

Having said that, I understand that Fullers make their ESB beer with the first runnings then make London Pride with the second.

 

[johnnyboy1965]

I would also add to jb1965's post's that the reason we don't bother making different strength beers from more than one mash running is that malt today is very well modified so you don't need to bother as you can can extract most of the sugars out in one go.

Having said that, I understand that Fullers make their ESB beer with the first runnings then make London Pride with the second.

Not sure if this is true, Im not questioning it, but what I think youll find is they make ESB from the first and/or second runnings, then sparge again to use this as a base for their London Pride, it make commercial sense to extract as much sugar from the grains as possible. there does come a time when it cost more to heat the sparge water than you get sugars out.

 

[timbrew]

Ha , well I never! I'm still new to this and all the terminology , what is it to sparge? Excuse my ignorance.
Tim

 

[Slid]

Ha , well I never! I'm still new to this and all the terminology , what is it to sparge? Excuse my ignorance.
Tim

Hi Tim

Sparging just means running more mash temp water over your grains to try and dissolve more sugars. Sparging works because the grains have a tendency to clump together and this makes extracting the sugar from the middle problematic.

 

[rodwha]

johnny: They partigyle and get 4 beers from it from what I understand.

 

[timbrew]

Can I do that from a beer kit ?

 

[mrobinson]

Can I do that from a beer kit ?

No, the liquid in the kits is what comes out when you sparge ( although in the tins it's very concentrated so they don't have to send you a couple of gallons of liquid ).

The process is basically:

Mash the grains ( ie: soak them in water at around 70c depending on recipe ) for a while,
Extract the water
Pour more hot water ( this is sparging ) on to the grains and extract that too.

The sugary, malty water you got out is called the wort. This is then boiled and hops are added during the boil. The beer kit company then concentrates it to the goop that comes in the cans.

 

[johnnyboy1965]

Can I do that from a beer kit ?

If its a two can kit, yes its easy.
Take 1 can and make up to a OG of 1.090 ish (this will give you a 9% beer (approx.)
Take the second can and make up to 1.040 (this will give you a 4% beer (approx.).
Obviously you wont get the full 23li combined, but you should get 11li of 4%...and 5.5li of 9% beer

 

[timbrew]

How do I do that and og using hydrometer ?

 

[mirsultankhan]

So I have just finished watching the gripping TV show "game of thrones" and have been inspired by the amount of ale drinking; to find out if there are any medieval brewing techniques to recreate some good ol original English ale. I found this, http://byo.com/hops/item/1357-searching-for-medieval-ale
although I don't have the time to make id like to hear if anyone has and learn of the outcome .
Happy brewing
Tim

Anne of Cleves, Henry the eighths fourth wife had apparently two weaknesses, she liked to gamble and was addicted to English Ale! She used to ride around the country guzzling down copious amounts of the fine brew, what a lady!

 

[timbrew]

Amen to that what a classy lady! Original ladette!