Milton to steralise?

[beebrew]

I am new to home brewing and this site for that matter... can I use Milton to steralise my kit. I have made one brew so far (st peters golden ale) and its good stuff, really surprised me.

 

[krazypara3165]

you can indeed. if its good enough for babies its generally good enough for brewing!

 

[Swift Pint]

Milton is diluted sodium hyperchrorite, so is just a weaker version of thin bleach, so it would probably be cheaper to buy supermarket value thin bleach.

You can use it to sterilise, but you will need to rinse. I know that milton claims to be no-rinse, and from a safety point of view it is, you will want to rinse to make sure the smell / flavour does not come through in your beer.

 

[graysalchemy]

Using chloride based sanitisers need to be rinsed also because the chlorine reacts with the phenols in the hop oils to form TCP. Not a nice taste in your beer.

If you are using a thin bleach of any kind make sure you give it a good rinse before you put your beer kit (or beer for that matter if you are using it to sanitise bottles)

Have a look at this thread hereand in particular Alemans advice.

Use and throw, it really is quite simple.

Stuff like VMP is expensive to use this way so people like to reuse it. personally I think you are playing with fire if you do . . .you may get away with it for some time, but it is just that gettinga way with it.

There are alternatives to Home brew cleanser / disinfectants that are much cheaper

Thin diluted household unscented bleach is superb for disinfecting (after all it is the active ingredient in VMP and the like)

Application              Available Chlorine	     Quantity@ 4·5%       Quantity@1%
Heavy-duty cleaning         2700 ppm                 60 ml/l              270 ml/l
Medium-duty cleaning	     1125 ppm                 25 ml/l	           112 ml/l
Light-duty cleaning	       540 ppm                 12 ml/l               55 ml/l
Standard Disinfectant	     200 ppm                4.5 ml/l               20 ml/l

Thick domestos has ~4.5% chlorine, while thin supermarket bleaches are only around 1% . . .hence the different usage rates . . . You may find that Baby bottle sanitising fluid is also considerably less . . .I bet they don't print what the concentration of chlorine is when made up on the packet . . . just that it is no rinse - for babies bottles )

Remember that all chlorine based disinfectants must be rinsed . . . and then rinsed again. To cut down on the amount of rinsing a wash out with a 5% sodium metabisulphate solution will neutralise any remaining chlorine.

If you can still smell chlorine after rinsing then you haven't rinsed enough.

 

[nobyipa]

its ok i used to use it
but by eck what a pain to rinse and rinse again to get rid of the swimming bath smell
and if not rinsed properly will taint your beer
for 15 quid if your brewing lots buy some
star san no rinse sanitiser
and save loads of water and time
:thumb:

 

[Swift Pint]

Interesting table very useful. :thumb:

Miltons website says the following, but not sure how that would map across to Aleman's table.

Milton Fluid is made of an aqueous solution of sodium hypochlorite and 16.5% sodium chloride. The Milton Fluid that is available to buy is a strength of 2% sodium hypochlorite.

Whilst researching recently, I stumbled upon this Basic Brewing Radio podcast with the inventor of StarSan.

He recommends the following:
Using 5% bleach, add 1oz of the bleach to 5 us gallons of water, then add 1 oz of vinegar, which improves the effectiveness of the bleach due to the PH. He claims this gives a 80ppm solution which is a good no rinse sanitizer after 30 seconds contact time.

NEVER MIX THE BLEACH AND VINEGAR TOGETHER DIRECTLY


Has anyone tried doing this? Interesting that they don't mention any issues related to smell in the final beer.

 

[Aleman]

I've used the hypochlorous acid approach described on BBR, it works well, Chlorinated caustics (ie Bleach) are hampered in their effectiveness as the caustic prevents the formation of a decent level of hypochlorous acid (the disinfectant) . . .so you have to use a stronger concentration of it. Using an acidified solution of bleach you have much more hypochlorous acid, so use much less bleach . . .this means that the hypochlorous acid approach is no rinse . . .even if it is chlorine based. the residual level of chlorine even if it was to be combined is with chlorophenols is way below the ppb taste threshold of TCP

I just can't get on with recommending it as a method, as you know that someone will mix the undiluted solutions together.

 

[Aleman]

IMiltons website says the following, but not sure how that would map across to Aleman's table.

Milton Fluid is made of an aqueous solution of sodium hypochlorite and 16.5% sodium chloride. The Milton Fluid that is available to buy is a strength of 2% sodium hypochlorite.

Then you would use half the amounts from the final column which is for a 1% free chlorine bleach

 

[Swift Pint]

I've used the hypochlorous acid approach described on BBR, it works well, Chlorinated caustics (ie Bleach) are hampered in their effectiveness as the caustic prevents the formation of a decent level of hypochlorous acid (the disinfectant) . . .so you have to use a stronger concentration of it. Using an acidified solution of bleach you have much more hypochlorous acid, so use much less bleach . . .this means that the hypochlorous acid approach is no rinse . . .even if it is chlorine based. the residual level of chlorine even if it was to be combined is with chlorophenols is way below the ppb taste threshold of TCP

I just can't get on with recommending it as a method, as you know that someone will mix the undiluted solutions together.

Thanks for the reply Aleman, lots of really useful info. Fair enough about the last part too :thumb:

 

[beebrew]

Thanks to you all, there is obviously more than one way to skin a cat and some ways are cheaper! Great site and it works, cheers.

 

[Pjam]

I used Miltons when I started and it worked OK but it's a lot of work rinsing and you can use some very large quantities. Much easier is Star San, and in the long run inexpensive too. In many cases Stan San in a spray bottle works well.

 

[Andysbrew]

I use Milton and didn't rinse when I did my Wherry....oops hope its not ruined.......

 

[Pjam]

I use Milton and didn't rinse when I did my Wherry....oops hope its not ruined.......

I'm sure your not the first to do that and it'll be interesting to see what happens .......... when will you try a bottle? you could post your findings in this thread :geek:

 

[Aleman]

I use Milton and didn't rinse when I did my Wherry....oops hope its not ruined.......

I'm sure your not the first to do that and it'll be interesting to see what happens .......... when will you try a bottle? you could post your findings in this thread :geek:

may not be, it does depend on if the kit is made within a couple of hundred yards of a real hop, or they just use pre isomerised, chemically treated hop resin. if it's the latter then you can get away with it, but beer made with proper hops . . .that can be a serious issue.

 

[micky1882]

I've used Milton to sterilise my FV and siphon hose for years without rinsing and never had an issue, I sterilise the FV and let it drain on the sink for 10 mins or so then do a kit in it.

 

[graysalchemy]

As Aleman says above it is more of an issue for AG BIAB and extract brewers or if you are using hop additions in your kit.