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Ok so a few points which need to be definitively decided:

1. How many bottles are required?
2. Should entries be anonymous, and if yes how?
3. Should judges have recipe or other info on the beers?
4. Should scores be on feedback sheet?
5. How is judges address supplied to entrants?
6. Should kit beers be judged along with AG/extract?

Anything else I'm missing?

This is Doctor Mick's original idea so I'll go along with what he feels best.
 
Right, here's a suggested definition of styles that people can pick over. I've tried to keep them generic and to work as guidelines rather than hard and fast judging criteria. I think because of the wide range of beers that can fit into some of the categories that any tight definitions will just become stumbling blocks for many, especially newer brewers.

Writing them up did highlight a few things for me.

The first is that Mild and Brown Ale are very similar (okay, calm down until I've finished) and as someone who is old enough to remember when both were fashionable (along with Babycham), I'm buggered if I could definitively decide whether a beer was one or the other. Also, do enough people brew Milds and Brown Ales for them not to be lumped together?

The second is that Lagers and Belgian ales do cover so many different styles that both could be confusing. They could be split into Light Lagers and Dark/Malty lagers. Belgian Ales could also be split into Trappist/Abbey ales and Belgian ales (Strong, Blond and Pale) which would require Belgian Pale Ales being moved from the Pale Ale category.

The third is that we have no 'experimental' beers section. Okay, you can experiment in every style if you like, but if the guidelines are used for general guidance, it does tend to push people into a definable style, which is the point. We really could do with a maverick round for everyone to produce something different.

Well, with that said, here's the general style guidelines. I've done them in the order of the proposed calendar.

HBF Competition Styles Guidelines

Styles for the HBF Brewing Competition are general and encompass a number of sub-styles. As such, some variations from the following will exist. However, submitted beers should always adhere to the core principles of the style.

IPA
(Includes British IPA, American IPA, Black/Brown IPA, Rye IPA, Speciality IPAs. Does not include Double IPAs)
IPAs should have an OG of between 1.050 and 1.070 and an IBU of 40+. Beers should exhibit a hop-forward flavour/aroma typically (but not limited to) using spicy or citric hops. IPAs should be drier with a light to medium body. British IPAs can exhibit fruitier malt flavours. IPAs should be light in colour (Black and Brown variants accepted). Darker IPAs should not have a burned or astringent flavour but should be balanced with enhanced malt character.

Pale Ale
(Includes Pale Ale, Golden Ale, Blonde Ales, Belgian Pale Ales. Does not include IPAs or Double IPAs)
Pale Ales should have an OG of between 1.035 and 1.055 and 20-50 IBUs. Beers should exhibit a medium hop flavour/aroma with hops of any type, and malt should be medium and balanced. Some degree of fruitiness is acceptable. Pale Ales should be drier with a light to medium body. They should be light in colour.

Wheat Beer
(Includes Weissbier, Dunkel Weissbier, American Wheat Beer, Witbier. Does not include other styles with lower percentages of wheat, Saisons or Wild/Lambic/Sour brews including Berliner Weisse)
Wheat beers should have an OG of between 1.040 and 1.055 (exceptions exist such as Weizenbock which is generally 1.060-1.090) and 5-30 IBUs. American What Beers may have higher IBUs. Wheat Beers typically exhibit flavour/aroma created by yeast and fermentation processes. Malt intensity can be enhanced via decoctions or other methods. Hops are usually noble and in the background (American Wheats aside). Some degree of fruit or spice tones is acceptable, as is tartness, sourness and sharpness, dependent upon the style. Wheat beers should be dry with higher levels of carbonation.

Stout/Porter
(Includes Sweet Stout, Dry Stout, Oatmeal Stout, English Porter and variations of these such as Chocolate, Coffee, etc.. Does not include Imperial Stout or Baltic Porter)
Stouts/Porters should have an OG of between 1.040 and 1.065 and 20-50 IBUs. Stouts/Porters typically exhibit a malt based flavour/aroma with a roasted element more prominent in stouts and a bready/biscuit quality in porters. Hop intensity is generally low to medium, although some use higher amounts to balance the roast elements. Stouts/Porters range from sweet to dry, have medium to full body, and generally have lower levels of carbonation.

Double IPA
(Does not include IPAs as identified in the HBF IPA style guidelines)
Double IPAs should have an OG of between 1.065and 1.090 and an IBU of 60+. Beers should exhibit a hop-forward flavour/aroma typically (but not limited to) using spicy or citric hops. Double IPAs should be drier with a light to medium body. A degree of alcohol warmth is acceptable, but beers should balance the additional strength and hop forwardness with drinkability. If a Double IPA needs to be sipped, it is not a balanced DIPA!

Belgian Ale
(Includes Trappist and Abbey Ales, Biere de Garde and Belgian Strong Ales. Does not include Belgian Pale Ales, Witbier or Saisons)
Trappist and Abbey Ales ate typically Singles (1.045-1.055),Dubbels (1.050-1.075) and Tripels (1.070-1.085), with low IBUs of around 20-40. Flavours/aromas vary but are usually complex malt with overtones introduced by the yeast and fermentation process. Adjuncts such as Candi Sugar are often used, but this is fermented out to add alcohol warmth and fruity (raisins and plums) backnotes. Clove or pepper hints are also acceptable. Trappist ales are typically medium to full bodied and medium to high in carbonation. Strong Ales are typically 1.060 to 1.090, again with low IBUs of 15-35. Spicy hops are typically used to balance malt; while sweetish variants are available, many are medium to dry. Fruity esters are common. Biere de Garde is typically 1.060 to 1.080, and shares many of the flavours/aromas typical of other Belgian Ales. However, it is lagered to deliver a cleaner taste and lighter body with medium to high carbonation.

Bitter
(Includes Bitter, Best Bitter and Strong Bitter. Does not include beers as identified in the HBF IPA or Pale Ale style guidelines)
Bitters are typically 1.030-1.050, although strong bitters do run to 1.060, with IBUs of around 30-60. Flavours/aromas should have a degree of hop bitterness, but this should not override the malt character. Typical hop choices are earthy or spicy variants. Bready and biscuit tones are acceptable, as is a floral hopiness. Bitter should be light to medium bodied, and should typically be easy to drink, or ‘sessionable’. Caronation is low.

Mild
(Includes Mild and Dark Mild. Does not include Brown Porter, Bitter or Brown Ales of any type as identified in the HBF Brown Ale style guidelines)
Traditional Milds are low in alcohol, with OGs of between 1.030 and 1.040, although variants do exist up to 1.060. The flavour is malt-based with a degree of moderate bitterness. IBUs are low, typically 10-20. In some milds, especially darker versions, a small degree of roasted or toast-like flavour is acceptable. Carbonation is traditionally low.

Saison
(Includes Saisons, but not Brett-based Saisons or other beers made with sour wild yeasts)
Saisons should have an OG of between 1.040 and 1.065 for traditional styles, although modern variants can go up to 1.080. IBUs of 20-50 are typical. Hop additions should be used to balance any malt flavour. Saisons should be dry and well attenuated with a light body. Flavours typically come from yeast, although many saisons are flavoured with spices, fruit, herbs, vegetables, etc.. However, additional adjuncts should only enhance with background flavours and must not dominate. Saisons are highly carbonated.

Lager
(Includes all lagers, including lager-based beers which have not been ‘lagered’ as a full fermentation and condition process. Does not include any other beers which might use Pilsner malt but are covered in other HBF Compeition style definitions)
Lagers typically have an OG of between 1.040 and 1.060 and an IBU of up to 40. However, some derivations such as Bock will achieve OGs of 1.080. Lighter lagers typically have a well balanced malt profile, rounded and smooth, with minimal bitterness. Hop notes, usually spicy, should be balanced and in the background. Beers should be clean and well attenuated, and whilst many lager vary between sweet and dry, they should not exhibit extremes in body. Dark lagers exhibit a more malt-forward taste, but retain a clean and crisp finish. Lagers are typically light bodied with medium to high carbonation. The lagering process is not essential, but care should be taken to minimise the impact of yeasts on non-lagered lagers!

Imperial Stout
(Includes Imperial Stout and Baltic Porter. Does not include Stouts/Porters as identified in the HBF Stout/Porter style guidelines)
Imperial Stouts and Baltic Porters should have an OG of between 1.065 and 1.115 and 20-50 IBUs. Imperial Stouts typically exhibit a deep and complex malt based flavour/aroma. Roasted, fruity and warm alcohol tastes are usual. Some degree of burned malt is acceptable if balanced. Hop intensity varies but should balance the roast elements. Full bodied, and even chewy! Baltic Porters are smoother and less roasty than Imperial stouts, but should have good malt complexity. Biscuity or fruity overtones are acceptable. Both have lower levels of carbonation.

Brown Ale
(Includes Newcastle Brown Ale, Southern Brown Ale, Nut Brown Ale and American Brown. Does not include Brown Porter or Brown IPAs)
Brown Ale can have an OG of between 1.040 and 1.060, with strengths increasing from Southern, through Newcastle, with American at the higher end. The flavour is malt-based with a degree of caramel, toffee or even chocolate sweetness, although some bitterness is acceptable. IBUs are low, usually around 20-30, although American Browns using US Hops do go up to 60 IBUs. Body is usually medium to light.

Barleywine
(Includes English and American Barleywines)
Barleywiness can have an OG of between 1.080 and 1.120, and between 40 and 80 IBUs. Hop additions serve to balance the malt content. The flavour is dominated by malt and can be rich and complex with elements of caramel, toffee, treacle and fruitiness. Depth of flavour increases with aging. Some degree of alcohol warmth is expected. Body is full, and sipping is general accepted as the way to drink these beers.


(Includes Bretts and Brett-based Saisons , wild yeast beers, Lambics, Berliner Weisses, Oud Bruin, Gueze, etc.. Does not include Saisons or Wheat Beers as identified in the as identified in the HBF Saison or Wheat Beer style guidelines)
Sours can have an OG of between 1.020 and 1.065, with Berliner Weisse beers at the lower end. IBUs of up to 20 are typical. The flavour generally comes from the yeasts, although some styles do have a degree of maltiness. Flavours typical of sours range from fruits and spices through to sweaty horse and barnyard funk. However, these flavours should not be too dominant. Sour ales are usually tart and slightly acidic, dry with medium to high carbonation. Some styles may be sweetened with fruit syrup when poured to offset the sourness. If this is the case then a fruit syrup should be included but not added to the bottle.

Scottish Ale
(Includes Scottish Light, Scottish Heavy , Scottish Export and Wee Heavy)
Scottish Ale can have an OG of between 1.030 and 1.065, with Light being 1.030-1.040, Heavy being 1.035 to 1.050 and Export being 1.045 to 1.065. The flavour is malt-based, with a degree of sweetness and caramel. IBUs are low, usually under 20 or 30 for Export, with hops used to balance the malt only. Scottish Ales are typically medium bodied with low to medium carbonation. Wee Heavy has an OG of 1.070 to 1.115 and IBUs of up to 35. The beer is sweetish with caramel tones and is rich and malty, with a full to chewy mouthfeel.

Strong Ale?

Strong Ale
(Includes styles such as Winter Ale, Christmas Ale, Old Ale. Does not include any Strong beers that would be identified as lagers or Belgian styles)
OG= 1.055 to 1.080. IBU 30-60. Malty-sweet with fruity esters, often with a complex blend of dried-fruit, caramel, nuts, toffee, and/or other speciality malt aromas. Some versions could have spice and/or dried fruit additions. Added sugars such as treacle can be present in the flavour. Some alcohol notes are acceptable, but shouldn’t be hot or solventy. Some examples may have been aged for an extended time and display oxidation characteristics. Hop aromas can vary widely, or can be absent, but should typically have earthy, resiny, fruity, and/or floral notes. The balance can vary widely, but most examples will have a blend of malt, fruit, hops, and alcohol in varying intensities.

Feel free to change or disregard.
 
I think that looks pretty good, though I have a few thoughts.


Maybe as mentioned above, all this info, other than beer name, should be in a sealed envelope which is to be opened only after judging is complete to avoid any bias.

I think one is enough, even if you have 2 or 3 judges, only a small amount should be required to properly assess a beer.

Not sure about this, personally I don't think kits should be excluded. Also lots of people use recipes from books, online, clones etc. Should they be disqualified?

Not sure about this either, in BJCP comps the judges have no additional info about the beers, not even a recipe. The only styles where any info is given are the specialty ingredients such as flavourings or alternative fermentables.

I'm a bit uneasy about the judge's address being posted on a public forum. We would either need to ensure that the competitions forum can not be accessed by non-members or circulate the address by PM to those who have confirmed they wish to enter.

Ok so a few points which need to be definitively decided:

1. How many bottles are required?
2. Should entries be anonymous, and if yes how?
3. Should judges have recipe or other info on the beers?
4. Should scores be on feedback sheet?
5. How is judges address supplied to entrants?
6. Should kit beers be judged along with AG/extract?

Anything else I'm missing?

This is Doctor Mick's original idea so I'll go along with what he feels best.

Here's my 2 pence:

1. I think 3, but 2 works as well.
2. I don't think this can work, and it doesn't need to be. Bearing in mind feedback needs to be constructive and positive.
3. Recipe can be provided post competition once winner is announced, and it should be provided to share with the rest of the forum. I also think there should be some information provided on the bottle, and any optional information can be provided as mentioned previously
4. I think so, going back to feedback should be constructive. If the beer smells like wet cardboard this should be addressed.
5. Could be a private message board, or if there's some way to click "send address" for members only which automatically PMs the address if a member clicks it.
6. Yes.
 
This all seems pretty much there, all it needs is to get the ball rolling, once that happens as things arise changes can be made to deal with it
I would say that as things stand get it underway and tinker with it over time, name a starting beer and a date then get brewing
 
Here's my 2 pence:

1. I think 3, but 2 works as well.
2. I don't think this can work, and it doesn't need to be. Bearing in mind feedback needs to be constructive and positive.
3. Recipe can be provided post competition once winner is announced, and it should be provided to share with the rest of the forum. I also think there should be some information provided on the bottle, and any optional information can be provided as mentioned previously
4. I think so, going back to feedback should be constructive. If the beer smells like wet cardboard this should be addressed.
5. Could be a private message board, or if there's some way to click "send address" for members only which automatically PMs the address if a member clicks it.
6. Yes.

My tuppence:
1. My concern is that the extra cost of p&p for 2 or 3 bottles might put some off entering.
2. The idea of knowing who brewed what before judging just doesn't sit quite right with me, I'm thinking more of positive bias than negative :lol: I think it'd be more fair and interesting for kit beer entries also if the judge was unaware.
3. Maybe some info like ABV or suggested serving temperature but keep it short.
4. Yes
5. Yes

Anyone else have any thoughts?
 
Ok so a few points which need to be definitively decided:

1. How many bottles are required?
2. Should entries be anonymous, and if yes how?
3. Should judges have recipe or other info on the beers?
4. Should scores be on feedback sheet?
5. How is judges address supplied to entrants?
6. Should kit beers be judged along with AG/extract?

Anything else I'm missing?

This is Doctor Mick's original idea so I'll go along with what he feels best.


I will enter when I can however it ends up but my opinion is:-


1. I can understand why 2 bottles is a good idea. As it allows for a 2nd round/opinion if there where lots of entries, or a 2nd chance if a bottle gets broken.
2. Anonymous entries would need an 'independent' level of admin between entrant & judges as far as I can tell, but this would be fairest way.
3. No, they are judging how good an example of a style a particular beer is, and may be unintentionally biased by their own likes/dislikes if given this info.
4. Yes please
5. Work address works well for me for bottle swaps, not that I'm worried about giving out my home address, just means I don't miss parcels while at work and have to go the sorting office. But I'd say - if you don't feel comfortable giving a delivery address don't volunteer to be a judge.
6. Yes. I think the comps should be as inclusive as possible and if someone else's beer tastes better than mine, then does it really matter if it was kit, extract or AG?
 
2. Should entries be anonymous, and if yes how?

Having read a few comments in answer to this question i would like to give my two penneth, surely even though this is a competition its also just a bit of fun between members, do members really believe fellow brewers would be biased in their scoring just because they knew the name of the person who made it?
 
Ok so a few points which need to be definitively decided:

1. How many bottles are required?
Ideally 2, but I appreciate the issues with additional postage costs etc and wouldn't be against 1 bottle. I think any more than 2 is overkill.

2. Should entries be anonymous, and if yes how?
I appreciate the reasons for anonymity but at the moment I don't think it's necessary. I can't see bias being an issue unless members are friends outside the forum (in which case they will probably share which is their beer regardless of whether they are anonymous) or after numerous competitions if there's a handful Brewers whose beer gets a good reputation. We could always revisit this one a year or so down the road.

3. Should judges have recipe or other info on the beers?
It would probably be easiest if the winner (or maybe the top 3) provide the recipes on the forum post-judging. No need to provide any other info, unless there's a potential for allergies.

4. Should scores be on feedback sheet?
Yes - As someone who is keen for feedback, I think it would be most beneficial to have the scores. Anyone who can't handle constructive feedback shouldn't enter!

5. How is judges address supplied to entrants?
PM. If we can't add a new forum then the only options are really the members announcement forum (afaik it's the only one that can't be accessed by non-member) or by PM. I fee very strongly that members addresses shouldn't be posted where it can be accessed by the public. Work addresses has been mentioned but I can't imagine my current employer (or any of my previous employers) would be too chuffed if I had 20 packages of bottles of beer turning up at the office!!!

6. Should kit beers be judged along with AG/extract?
Modified kits only
.
My feedback above
 
This all seems pretty much there, all it needs is to get the ball rolling, once that happens as things arise changes can be made to deal with it
I would say that as things stand get it underway and tinker with it over time, name a starting beer and a date then get brewing

I concur. Do it then change it (or not).
 
Having read a few comments in answer to this question i would like to give my two penneth, surely even though this is a competition its also just a bit of fun between members, do members really believe fellow brewers would be biased in their scoring just because they knew the name of the person who made it?

I'm with Chippy on this one. As I understand it, this competition is a bit of fun and it shouldn't be taken too seriously. I believe there are other competitions for the more serious brewer? I am a new brewer who is interested in this competition, but being a new brewer I don't expect to win. I still want to enter because it will be a bit of fun and more experienced brewers have the opportunity to give me feedback on my AG brews.

Thank you to everyone who is working to make this a reality, it could be a great competition for all levels of brewer.

Jas
 
I'm with Chippy on this one. As I understand it, this competition is a bit of fun and it shouldn't be taken too seriously. I believe there are other competitions for the more serious brewer? I am a new brewer who is interested in this competition, but being a new brewer I don't expect to win. I still want to enter because it will be a bit of fun and more experienced brewers have the opportunity to give me feedback on my AG brews.

Thank you to everyone who is working to make this a reality, it could be a great competition for all levels of brewer.

Jas

Agree with this completely. Same goes for for the scores. The reason I'm interested is that I want unbiased feedback which I don't think I get from my parents and friends/colleagues - I don't want people to be afraid of telling folk their beer is ****e!
 
How about we say "at least 2 bottles". That way you can supply 2, or if you really want you can send 3, or even 4 if you want to go over board? If you send 1 it's up to the judges if they want to include it in the competition, and feedback may not be provided if something goes wrong with the bottle.*

I agree with the other comments that this should be fun and anonymity is not required right now. I think it makes life a lot easier for participants and judges to state clearly on the bottle who made it. If it turns out there is a lot of corrupt judges we can make these anonymous.

With all this in mind, on the bottle I think it should include beer name, brewer's name, forum alias, beer style & ABV%. Anything extra can be provided like OG, FG, IBU, serving temp etc but this will not score extra points. Judges are welcome to ignore anything else too and are not inclined to pay any attention.


*Would like to add a rule for judges that they should provide feedback wherever they can, even if an entrant is disqualified from the competition for whatever reason.
 
How about we say "at least 2 bottles". That way you can supply 2, or if you really want you can send 3, or even 4 if you want to go over board? If you send 1 it's up to the judges if they want to include it in the competition, and feedback may not be provided if something goes wrong with the bottle.*

I agree with the other comments that this should be fun and anonymity is not required right now. I think it makes life a lot easier for participants and judges to state clearly on the bottle who made it. If it turns out there is a lot of corrupt judges we can make these anonymous.

With all this in mind, on the bottle I think it should include beer name, brewer's name, forum alias, beer style & ABV%. Anything extra can be provided like OG, FG, IBU, serving temp etc but this will not score extra points. Judges are welcome to ignore anything else too and are not inclined to pay any attention.


*Would like to add a rule for judges that they should provide feedback wherever they can, even if an entrant is disqualified from the competition for whatever reason.

I'm happy to go along with the majority :thumb:
Perhaps if most of the details are sorted a new thread could be created with the rules, style descriptors, templates, calendar etc.
 
Ok so a few points which need to be definitively decided:

1. How many bottles are required?
2. Should entries be anonymous, and if yes how?
3. Should judges have recipe or other info on the beers?
4. Should scores be on feedback sheet?
5. How is judges address supplied to entrants?
6. Should kit beers be judged along with AG/extract?

Anything else I'm missing?

This is Doctor Mick's original idea so I'll go along with what he feels best.

I think this is very much a democracy. :lol:

My thoughts...

1. 2, I know I'll need 2 when I judge.
2. I'd prefer it but as others have said, I also trust people not to be biased and we don't have many conflicts on here.
3. Recipe no, but serving details shouldn't be prevented IMO.
4. The majority seem to think they should do we should go with that.
5. I think we should put a thread on the forum somewhere (in the comps section by the looks of it) for each months competition which includes the judge. Entrants can then PM the judge for the address.
6. Absolutely.

We can tweak these things over time so they don't need to be hard and fast.
 
At some point today I'll tweak the rules and post them back here and make sure everyone is happy.
 
I've created new threads for the calendar (http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=64346) and the October competition (http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?p=600763).

@jceg316 - can you create a new thread for the rules? We can keep discussion in this thread and you'll be able to Edit the post in the competition forum if any changes are made.

@The ***** - could you create a style guide thread in the same forum please?

@strange-steve - could you create a feedback form thread?

Do we need any other threads creating over there?
 
I've created new threads for the calendar (http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=64346) and the October competition (http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?p=600763).

@jceg316 - can you create a new thread for the rules? We can keep discussion in this thread and you'll be able to Edit the post in the competition forum if any changes are made.

@The ***** - could you create a style guide thread in the same forum please?

@strange-steve - could you create a feedback form thread?

Do we need any other threads creating over there?

Will do.

On another note, seeing as no one else is jumping in, can I also judge March's competition on Belgian ales? If someone else wants to do it I'll hand it over to them.
 
Rules are up. I'd like to add I hope everyone realises they are not set in stone and will probably change as the competitions get underway.

Do let me know if I've missed anything.
 
Nice to see this moving along. I don't mind being a judge if you are in need of any. If the correct packaging is used I don't mind sending some beer back in return.

I can do the pale ale?
 

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