Maris otter

[scrap iron]

I recently brewed an English Strong Bitter. [ cat 11C in the BJCP 2021 guidelines] It came out well and I used Simpson's Maris Otter as that's what my LHBS carries along with their Golden Promise. I also used a small amount of Simpson's DRC and some invert sugar made with demerara sugar. The shop carries some Simpson's base and crystal malts and Crisp's crystal malts. What are opinions on the brands of Maris?

 

[peebee]

... What are opinions on the brands of Maris?

"Maris Otter" (as with most others, like Golden Promise) is a strain of barley, but most maltsters do treat Maris Otter much the same (slightly higher roast than "normal" pale pale malts). Crisp and Simpson's have very much moved into the "contemporary" lines, such as the one you mention (Simpson's "DRC", they've also recently introduced a very interesting "Imperial" which at 45EBC and still diastatic and seems to be from the same "mould" as their "Amber" which is indispensable for Fuller's 1845 clones - Crisp also churn out "Munich" malts and "Vienna" malts from British barley). The likes of Warminster and Fawcett's seem to be more traditional British. And there are others, but not that I remember using.

These assessments are how they appear to me ... others may disagree!

 

[scrap iron]

Thanks for the reply. I think I've seen Fawcett's malt for sale on a few internet homebrew sites and will give it a try next time.

 

[The Baron]

The perception is that MO gives a more Maltier taste than basic Pale Malt but that is my opinion.
Fawcetts are a well respected malt used more by Pro brewers more than homebrewers but is supplied by some homebrew outlets too,
The one that is best is the one that suits your taste.

 

[Obadiah Boondoggle]

My view is that there are so many other factors that will affect your final beer (e.g. mash temp, hop utilisation, water profile, yeast strain, fermentation temperature, the colour of your underpants) that the fine detail of how one malster processes it vs another is a bit of an acedemic question unless you have everything else controllled to an exact degree

 

[SMP Brewery]

the colour of your underpants

Since I changed to yellow with blue spots my beer has drastically deteriorated.

I’ve just got some Crisp MO and haven’t used it yet so can’t answer your question.

So far in the few brews I’ve done I’m starting to prefer golden promise. Which was from Simpsons, but re the above that might change.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

So far in the few brews I’ve done I’m starting to prefer golden promise. Which was from Simpsons, but re the above that might change.

Simpsons are the Plant Variety Rights holder for Golden Promise so are pretty much the only source of it, they "rescued" it in a similar way to Robin Appel and Tony Banham rescuing Otter in 2002.

the fine detail of how one malster processes it vs another is a bit of an acedemic question unless you have everything else controllled to an exact degree

The human brain works on differences, and if you taste them side by side then the differences can be quite striking.

The shop carries some Simpson's base and crystal malts and Crisp's crystal malts. What are opinions on the brands of Maris?

It's always Otter, not Maris - Maris is the "house" name of varieties from the old Plant Breeding Institute on Maris Lane near Cambridge so doesn't help to distinguish between very different crops. They tried to start the second word with a letter indicating the crop, so eg Maris Wigeon is a wheat and Maris Piper is one of the most famous varieties of potato. But beans got to B before barley did with eg Maris Bead, hence barley getting Otter.

Personally the best Otter is from Warminster - you pay for the floor malting but it does come through in the complexity of the flavour. There's also the lingering suspicion that Warminster being owned by Appel means that they get the pick of the harvest - and since they effectively specialise in malting Otter (it's 70% of their total sales) they probably know it better than others.

I also like the versions from the northern maltsters like Simpson and Fawcett, but the East Anglian industrial maltsters like Crisp and Munton just come across as just that - industrial and not as interesting. To be fair I've not tried the Crisp floor-malted malts, marketed under the No 19 brand.

Here's a nice presentation from the man himself :
https://www.warminster-malt.co.uk/my-story-of-maris-otter-by-robin-appel/

 

[Stan's Brew]

I've tried most varieties, Warminster is great - currently sampling Crisp Heritage Chevalier 100% brew with this and it's really good (colour, flavour, mouthfeel, English hops), but pricey, also need to try much cheaper varieties such as Bairds & Muntons for comparison as the price difference is huge, Simpsons Golden Promise is about middling price wise and I like beer styles using this malt.

German malts for authentic wheats, but these are getting out of price range and TBH Golden Promise fills the gap.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

also need to try much cheaper varieties such as Bairds & Muntons for comparison as the price difference is huge

Some of the difference at the moment will just reflect when retailers bought their stock and when the maltster put up their prices to reflect current energy costs - which makes a big difference, some won't be putting up prices until New Year but you probably want to get in before then if you can.

I've only had one sack of Bairds, Craft Pale that I got from a local brewery just before lockdown. Not a fan - it's super-floury. Now maybe that's just how Bairds do it, maybe the brewery chose an extra-fine crush, or maybe I was just unlucky with a sack from the bottom of the silo. But even after filtering BIAB wort through 300 microns it still has loads of gunk that doesn't respond much to Protafloc and/or gelatine.

 

[peebee]

... Here's a nice presentation from the man himself :
My Story of Maris Otter by Robin Appel - Warminster Maltings Limited

And a very nice presentation it certainly is! Clears up some misunderstandings I had.

But it does contradict something in your (@Northern_Brewer) own post, and in the scribblings of thousands of others. "Maris" was a bloke! We must forget all that stuff about "Maris Lane" (or perhaps not "forget" ... more like "take sides"?): Warminster Maltings | It’s All In The Name

I never realised Maris Otter barley was endangered.

I still prefer "Chavallier" barley malt. But better appreciate why it's so expensive and why it's not universally liked (far from it).

 

[RichK]

...
I still prefer "Chavallier" barley malt. But better appreciate why it's so expensive and why it's not universally liked (far from it).

I'm trying Chevallier for my next couple of batches. At my LHBS it was just 15p/kg more than MO!

 

[MrRook]

I'm trying Chevallier for my next couple of batches. At my LHBS it was just 15p/kg more than MO!

I recently brewed a porter with a little more than 20% chevalier and I think it turned out better than the last time I brewed it without.

 

[Braufather]

I order brew by brew and generally use that as an opportunity to try different brands as research for I when I eventually start to mill my own grain and buy n bulk. Think I’ve settled on fawcett for Maris Otter, Simpson’s for golden promise and weyerman or crisp for regular pale. Still trying to work out a favorite extra pale.