little brown pump

[Newtons Shed]

Hi all finally got a new pump sorted after my dog chewed the last one solar project pump got it from eBay looks similar to the other one for £13 Inc del. Last night I looked at how to power it up and dug out an old model train power controller which seams to work OK and enagles me to control the flow but not sure if its at the right voltage or doing any damage, also not sure if when the controller is on full power the pump is actually on full power

 

[Darcey]

I have a solar project one and a cheap 'Hong Kong' Ebay one. The solar project one is much more reliable and appears to transfer faster than the cheaper one. I think they are worth having but I am going to buy another solar project one and use the cheap one for a back up!

I have not tested them side by side but that is my opinion from using them a few times.

D

 

[Newtons Shed]

For info as per my other post, forgot about this one!
I tried the cheaper ebay pump one first unfortunatly it isn't powerful enough to get it through the herms coil and out the other end, so I took the head off it and tried the chewed solar project pump this has the 3m head and just about works it has a slow flow by the end so trickles into the mt and it keeps on stopping I have wait a bit and try it again and seems to start for a min then stops again, I can't see any air pockets on the in flow but I could hear air on the reducer that is welded on to the 8mm copper further down the outflow. I t has just occurred to me this morning whilst sober that I only put 10 liters in to test it and it could be that it had got to the tap level which is at about 8 liters up on the side.
So the solar pump seems more powerful than the cheaper one but for my system either something is wrong or it's not powerful enough as so far Ive just tested with water so once resistance is introduce with grain I think its going to struggle so might look for a better proper brewing pump that self primes ie March 809 which of course isn't available for UK? What would happen if I imported one what's the issue with using them in the UK?
Thanks
Andy

 

[rpt]

They are distributed by March May Ltd.

 

[Newtons Shed]

Yeah I contacted march may and got this reply;

"Hi Andy,
Unfortunately, we have recently discovered that the 809-PL-HS is not CE marked so it's illegal for us to sell it in the EU for homebrewing."

I'm not sure as well though if it is worth spending £150 odd + postage and import on a pump that is similar in spec to the cheaper lBP, I'm not sure if it is how I have designed my set up ie too big a herms coil (aprox 5m coil wound round a WD40 can and sits inside a domestic kettle with the pump just under the brewery stand) with about 3 or 4 meter head plus the 5m coil to get round and return to the MT so for argument sake 8 or 9 meter of head (not sure how to calculate the curve up round the coil) when max pumps even the more expensive ones do about 6 meters and everyone else seem to be able to use the small cheap pumps for their herms so why can't I?
Just had a quick look at more beer and tescopumps.com just to see what other options there are.

 

[t0m]

5m is quite long, perhaps longer than necessary. Or maybe your coil is too narrow or kinked which is making it hard to push the wort through.

Another possibility is that your grain bed is getting compacted - are you leaving 10 minutes before starting to recirculate?

Perhaps other people can throw out some suggestions. I reckon the 14W solar pump at 5m head should be good enough.

 

[rpt]

"Unfortunately, we have recently discovered that the 809-PL-HS is not CE marked so it's illegal for us to sell it in the EU for homebrewing."

You'd think they'd take it off their website then!

 

[Newtons Shed]

5m is quite long, perhaps longer than necessary. Or maybe your coil is too narrow or kinked which is making it hard to push the wort through.

It's 8mm bore so quite narrow (cheaper option than 10mm) there is only one or two places where the coil has kinked, thought I'd done a good job coiling it around a wd40 can, I think I have some coil left so might look to make it again at say 3m long?

Another possibility is that your grain bed is getting compacted - Only tested with cold water so far, so no grain bed so far just trying to go from HLT to mash tun through the herms coil with cold water.

I reckon the 14W solar pump at 5m head should be good enough. so far I've spent around £45 on pumps and would need another £35 ish inc postage for the 14w 5m head one and if still not reliable would still need another perhaps... On the same token spend lots on a pump like the march nano and have similar issues as the max head is 6m however I suspect at 0.125 HP 230v at 60 herzt pump would perform better than the 14w solar pump? 17gpm flow rate at 1ft and 27ft max head.

The thing I don't get though is it seem to work for a few minuets doesn't seem to be struggling or making any noise or smell or feel hot but then just stops, so then I turn it off leave it a few minuets and it starts to work again and then stops again...

You'd think they'd take it off their website then - you would, unless they are exporting or something? Interestingly some of the American companies will allow me to import them in, not sure of what the issue would be though with it not being CE certified? I have also been looking at more beer pumps either the chugger or the march AC-5B-MD Beer Pump which is £212 + Postage and any duty!
I know someone awhile ago said about the cornlius flow pump that was about £70 but not sure on spec (the only ones I've seen are for fermented wort as low temp threshhold)

 

[t0m]

You may have spent 45 quid but what you have is a small cheap pump with a 2m head. I don't think you can expect too much in the way of performance. If you don't want to keep spending money on pumps maybe you should get rid of the dog.

 

[Newtons Shed]

Lol the Mrs wouldn't have it. Just to clarify I have 2 cheapish pumps one at 2 m head and one at 3 m head the 2m head one doest work at all the 3m head one works a bit than cuts out. Just a case of do I risk a 12v cheap pump with 5 m head or try a more expensive pump that may have same performance

 

[Newtons Shed]

Think I might have found the problem I opened the lid in the kettle and found some water not loads but made me look at my coil and it is quite kinked that yeah me to try and put the return on the inside, just making another coil wrapped around a wd 40 can but this time the return pipe on the outside not the inside how big should I make it 3 or 5 m ? The origanal must have actual been 3 m if that as I had a 10 m pipe wasted about 3 m ad made aother coil and still got enough left over to make a 3 rd coil

 

[t0m]

It might be the pipe you are using. 10mm water pipe is bloody difficult to coil without kinking, even with a bending spring, and even if you anneal it. Refrigeration coil is the way to go, it is way softer. The technique for winding without kinking is to really pull down on the pipe as you wind it, and as soon as it look like kinking back off and anneal the section you want to bend. And I would try shorter I reckon 3m should be enough for good heat transfer.

 

[Newtons Shed]

Wasn't too clear in my last post, the copper pipe I'm using is 10 meter length at 8mm bore already annealed. My last attempt was me trying to be clever as I tried putting the upright end piece at the bottom of the coil on the inside of the coil, so when I was coiling round the wd40 can I was pinching it around the upright piece as its on the inside, which is where the kinks are. This time the upright piece is on the outside so the coil isn't kinking now when I'm wrapping round the can. Still not sure though if it will stop the pum from cutting out as it has been