Leaky kegs

[Fireside Ales Homebrewery]

So I brewed 25l of strong Suffolk ale (festival beer kit). It was my first attempt and so I made a few mistakes and it wasn’t the best beer I’ve ever tasted but I was oddly proud of it and felt that I had achieved something drinkable, even if it wouldn’t have won any awards.
I put it in a pressure keg, left it to mature and then managed to drink nearly half of it. I came home from work one morning to find the other half on my kitchen floor. It had leaked through the tap.
So much for cheap pressure kegs. My question is, is it worth buying a better one? And if so, which?

Hi,
I have had this happen also. Only with strong festival ales though. I think, unless the beer is done and finished and the FG confirms this. Then the ale might still be fermenting away in the keg. Fermentation can kick start again with an influx in temperature, or unfortunately, an infection. This might build up in a pressure keg and force your lovey beer through the tap. This is just a guess at one possible reason for a leaky Keg, based on my unfortunate experience. I suppose it is the same as a bottle bomb. Good luck with future brews..

 

[Wherrypuzzled]

Hi PhilBrew

No I sold the lot for £30 to £40 quite a few years ago.

Looking back a sad error to make - as I used to have 2 x FV on the go with same beer in them - transfer when ready to Pub barrel and have 3 on stock

Used to clean my lines with Pub supplied Beer engine cleaner etc - like a proper little pub it was !

Cheers WP

 

[kelper]

First, taps. There are several types, I’ve pictured the two most commonly supplied. If you use the tap on the left you can forget my comment about using Vaseline on the tap.

I have used vaseline on the type on the left. But I would not pull it apart too often.

 

[Wherrypuzzled]

Just bought a new Tap to replace the one like the right one. Barrel is getting on in years so going for an overhaul

Was staggered over weekend as I had moved Barrel (a few days earlier) into a fridge and was serving a nice few Pints when the Co2 "went". I gassed up with Co2 Bulb and had another 3 out of it for self and neighbour

Next day I went for one and not only had Keg gone totally flat but the beer was opaque after being totally clear for about half its contents. Its about 6 weeks old

I used another Bulb - and just waiting to see whether it has held Co2 charge overnight - and whether it has or not I am adding an S30 Valve so it will be completely revamped

When I poured a 1/4 Pint late last night it had cleared slightly - but I am "wherrypuzzled" as to how it suddenly went opaque - it isnt rational to me as it seems the only plausible thing is that someone opened Door, shook the Barrel and sneaked back off !

 

[kelper]

When you 'add' a CO2 bulb, the beer seems to 'leap'. I find I have to leave it overnight to settle. I can draw three litres into a jug before it slows to a trickle. It often 'recovers' by the following evening. A jug of beer stays fine for a few hours - plenty for a 'session'. The jug allows the foam to settle too and the foam is 50% beer.

 

[Wherrypuzzled]

Yes - that may be what has happened and for the last time.

My 2 KK are top taps and I recently swapped them to S30 to give more control over the input of Co2 and today I am getting another lid for the affected one. Its a Rotokeg bottom tap but I need an S30 valve so they are all the same

I can then ease the Co2 in as its more controllable instead of a massive "whoosh" with the Bulbs. So I will wait and see if it is still "gassed" this morning and whether it has cleared any more and if it is flat I will bite the bullet and open it to swap the Lid as quickly as possible then with the new S30 "gas it up" and drink the rest of the Barrel as quickly as I can

Thanks for the interest and help WW

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

Just bought a new Tap to replace the one like the right one. Barrel is getting on in years so going for an overhaul

Was staggered over weekend as I had moved Barrel (a few days earlier) into a fridge and was serving a nice few Pints when the Co2 "went". I gassed up with Co2 Bulb and had another 3 out of it for self and neighbour

Next day I went for one and not only had Keg gone totally flat but the beer was opaque after being totally clear for about half its contents. Its about 6 weeks old

I used another Bulb - and just waiting to see whether it has held Co2 charge overnight - and whether it has or not I am adding an S30 Valve so it will be completely revamped

When I poured a 1/4 Pint late last night it had cleared slightly - but I am "wherrypuzzled" as to how it suddenly went opaque - it isnt rational to me as it seems the only plausible thing is that someone opened Door, shook the Barrel and sneaked back off !

Hi Wherry,

You might be describing “chill haze” which is something that can happen if you chill your beer. Try pouring a glass and let it warm to room temperature - see if it clears as it warms.

 

[Wherrypuzzled]

Right - thanks again. In all my time brewing I have never come across this before - totally clear (I was really pleased how clear it was) and then having moved it to a Fridge (again first time I have ever done this - so that surely cant be a coincidence) it looks like Wheat Beer

I have just pulled a half and was please to see it was still gassed - so can leave the new Lid till its empty but then unfortunately I threw the beer away ! It tasted ok. Then I came in and read your post and it made sense so I will nip out get another sample and warm it up and let you know how I go on.

Cheers once again WW

 

[Wherrypuzzled]

Hi again HB - I'm persuaded already

Beer into house and within 20 minutes it is 95% clear. Wheat beer to nearly clear Beer in that short time

Moral of story - take it out of Fridge ? It was crystal clear before I put it in there but there is still a slight haze but that may go eventually if I give it chance. If not I will drink it myself reserving my next brew Admirals Reserve for guests.

Thanks again - its nice to know a) there are people who know these things and take the trouble to share them AND b) that after 40 years of brewing I am officially still a beginner

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

Hi again HB - I'm persuaded already

Beer into house and within 20 minutes it is 95% clear. Wheat beer to nearly clear Beer in that short time

Moral of story - take it out of Fridge ? It was crystal clear before I put it in there but there is still a slight haze but that may go eventually if I give it chance. If not I will drink it myself reserving my next brew Admirals Reserve for guests.

Thanks again - its nice to know a) there are people who know these things and take the trouble to share them AND b) that after 40 years of brewing I am officially still a beginner

The chemistry is quite complicated and I’m not sure I have much of a grasp on it all myself but essentially what’s happening is that proteins and polyphenols present in your beer but too small to see bind together at the lower temperature to form larger particles that you can see as haze. Those reactions reverse when you warm up the beer. If you keep the beer chilled one of two things will happen - I think dictated by the type of grain, the proportion of those grains, the temperature, and whether they are malted or unmalted. Either the particles fall out of suspension leaving a beautifully clear beer, or the haze becomes permanent and will not clear when the beer is warmed.

You say the beer clouded and then started to clear so if you leave it in the fridge it’s quite likely the beer will clear and be even more clear than it was.
...Probably!

 

[Wherrypuzzled]

Hi HB

I should have waited for your pearls of wisdom - but I rushed out took the Barrel out of Fridge and refilled with the Beers and Wines that I evicted to house it

Perhaps I will give it another go at some stage and see if it does chill / haze / clear. Bet it does (probably)

Cheers again WW (now persuading Mrs WW we dont need to change the big fridge in Kitchen any more - I had my eye on what would have been the "outgoing" one)

 

[Graz]

I also replaced the rubber band safety valve with a proper 15psi safety valve when I fitted a pressure gauge.

Hi @Buffers brewery , don't suppose you could post a link to the 15psi safety valves you use? I gave up on my King Kegs a while back switching to Cornelius kegs but I'm thinking I might re-purpose the King Kegs for storing / serving home made wine. CO2 pressure on these would be the absolute minimum required to keeping the wine coming out of the tap but I'd still like a safety valve in place in case of "user error".

Thanks in advance.

 

[Buffers brewery]

Hi @Buffers brewery , don't suppose you could post a link to the 15psi safety valves you use? I gave up on my King Kegs a while back switching to Cornelius kegs but I'm thinking I might re-purpose the King Kegs for storing / serving home made wine. CO2 pressure on these would be the absolute minimum required to keeping the wine coming out of the tap but I'd still like a safety valve in place in case of "user error".

Thanks in advance.

Hi @Graz . The valves I used were these..
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Low-Pres...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
However, I don’t use them anymore. I prefer a bleed valve..
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Radiator...var=552055893015&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649It means I have to keep a daily check on pressure (gauge fitted) during carbonating my beer but once that’s done the vent is there if, for whatever reason, I want to reduce the pressure. Less leaky option.
I gave up on the whole King Keg cap assembly and replaced it with my own design. No leaks anymore
Cheers.

 

[kelper]

Hi @Graz . The valves I used were these..

However, I don’t use them anymore. I prefer a bleed valve..

It means I have to keep a daily check on pressure (gauge fitted) during carbonating my beer but once that’s done the vent is there if, for whatever reason, I want to reduce the pressure. Less leaky option.
Cheers.

Does that mean you now have no automatic protection against overpressure? That is unwise to say the least!

 

[Buffers brewery]

Does that mean you now have no automatic protection against overpressure? That is unwise to say the least!

I appreciate your opinion, but having given the subject much thought I concluded that my approach was OK. I’m sure the majority on this forum would agree with you.
My thought process went along the lines...
The majority of gas production of my beers occurs in the FV that is vented to the atmosphere.
When my beer is transferred to my KK, I control the amount of priming sugar I add for carbonation that is done in my fermentation fridge set at 20 C, and check the pressure gauge every 12 hours during carbonation. If the pressure gets to 10 psi I vent it down to 5 psi. I repeat this procedure for 2 weeks when I reduce the temperature to 10 C to condition the beer. At this stage, gas generation has stopped. During dispensing, I may recharge with CO2 from an S30 Brewgas cylinder up to 5-6 psi.
To date, since changing to this approach, I’ve not actually had to use the vent valve, not even during carbonation.
While I accept that my approach may not be for everybody, indeed it may not be for anybody, it has been well thought through and considered, taking everything into consideration and the likelihood of different scenarios occurring.

 

[kelper]

A relief valve is there to cope with the unexpected. no one deliberately over-pressurises a pressure vessel. What if something causes you to miss a 12hourly check? Imagine the mess if the barrel bursts or the lid blows! But as long as you have no partner or children it is your choice. Another scenario is that your pressure gauge might stick or fail. Fairly remote, I know but the engineer in me is bound to caution you.

 

[Buffers brewery]

A relief valve is there to cope with the unexpected. no one deliberately over-pressurises a pressure vessel. What if something causes you to miss a 12hourly check? Imagine the mess if the barrel bursts or the lid blows! But as long as you have no partner or children it is your choice. Another scenario is that your pressure gauge might stick or fail. Fairly remote, I know but the engineer in me is bound to caution you.

Thanks for the concern. I consider myself cautioned :hat:
Cheers

 

[Graz]

Hi @Graz . The valves I used were these..
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Low-Pres...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
However, I don’t use them anymore. I prefer a bleed valve..
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Radiator...var=552055893015&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649It means I have to keep a daily check on pressure (gauge fitted) during carbonating my beer but once that’s done the vent is there if, for whatever reason, I want to reduce the pressure. Less leaky option.
I gave up on the whole King Keg cap assembly and replaced it with my own design. No leaks anymore
Cheers.

Thanks (and apologies for fuelling a whole different debate ).

 

[Buffers brewery]

Thanks (and apologies for fuelling a whole different debate ).

You're welcome. No probs. We all have opinions. Some we agree on, some we don't. Makes life interesting

 

[kelper]

I love an argument; I hate a quarrel. XXX