Heat Source Pumps.

[johncrobinson]

Well done Barleylass for trying to create a comfortable enviroment for your family.

But please spare a thought for those who have no spare cash and live in rented hovels.
I am not asking for personal sympathty but please bear in mind not everyone is in a position to just do it.

 

[Benfleet Brewery]

I monitor my energy usage closely, partly because I’m a bit of a geek and partly because I’m a tight ar*e. My central heating and hot water run off a 2 year old A+ energy rated combi boiler and the gas bill ranges from £7 a month in mid summer (mostly standing charge) to £70 month in mid winter. I also have 2 air source heat pump units. a 3.2kw system upstairs and a 5.2kw system downstairs. Only ever used them for cooling in the summer until now and they have worked really well with the solar panels whereby hotter sunnier days is when they are mostly in use, the electricity is free. This year, I’m doing a bit of an experiment to see if it costs any less to run these on heating instead of turning the boiler thermostat on. It’s not ideal, the unit downstairs is in the lounge so that will get more heat than other areas but we’ll see how it goes.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

We are finally modernising next year and moving from a coal fire to a multifuel stove, i would have stuck with the open fire (love a good open fire) but the government have banned the burning of coal and smokeless coal is hopeless on an open fire until you get a good fire going which means using loads of kindling or coal (they didn't think that one through) we only have a small Livingroom so will probably go with something like the picture below.

 

[Sandimas]

we only have a small Livingroom so will probably go with something like the picture below.

That will be more than enough, looks like a 5kW stove? We've got one of those and it amply heats a 27ft snug/dining room. Most people over-spec the stove for the size of room and end up having to open the doors when it gets up to temp, which can be handy to heat the rest of the house though.

Can't see us getting a heat pump of any sort: 1820s property, stone walls, no cavity - needs a LOT of heating in winter.

 

[London]

My dad has one like that and burns wood in it not quite as nice as an open fire but it really throws a lot of heat out, you can get a fan for the top which help and you can boil a kettle on it.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

That will be more than enough, looks like a 5kW stove? We've got one of those and it amply heats a 27ft snug/dining room. Most people over-spec the stove for the size of room and end up having to open the doors when it gets up to temp, which can be handy to heat the rest of the house though.

We put the dimensions into a wood burner site and it came back with 5kw maximum so that's what we will aim for.

 

[An Ankoù]

That will be more than enough, looks like a 5kW stove? We've got one of those and it amply heats a 27ft snug/dining room. Most people over-spec the stove for the size of room and end up having to open the doors when it gets up to temp, which can be handy to heat the rest of the house though.

Can't see us getting a heat pump of any sort: 1820s property, stone walls, no cavity - needs a LOT of heating in winter.

Out here in the sticks, and in Normandy the old country houses are stone with no cavity. We invariably insulate and damp proof them with a steel or wood frame, rockwool and plasterboard on top. Warm as toast in the winter. Our heating consists of three of those stoves, but they're almost never all on at the same time. Convection ducting to the upstairs rooms is more than adequate. Electricity is just for water heating and lighting really. Gas comes in 13Kg bottles for cooking and brewing. I get through two à year for the stove top.
Heat pumps are common, they're ugly and noisy, but they're subsidised for installation and running as well, I think.
But this is old technology. Surely the UK can come up with something a bit more future proof.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

you can get a fan for the top which help and you can boil a kettle on it.

I have seen these before and will get one, no power required and reviews say they do make a difference.

 

[Barleylass]

Well done Barleylass for trying to create a comfortable enviroment for your family.

But please spare a thought for those who have no spare cash and live in rented hovels.
I am not asking for personal sympathty but please bear in mind not everyone is in a position to just do it.

We aren’t in a position to do that again either, it was quite a while ago and we have moved house since. I was only giving my opinion from experience on how useless they are unless they are for a new build! As I said, we will be relying on stoves more than central heating as oil is getting so expensive. I cannot see what everyone is going to do, they are already warning of electricity shortages and that is before all the electric heating and electric cars.

 

[trummy]

I would like a wood burner but the house next door makes our life a near misery with the smell of their smoke when the wind is in the wrong direction (for us) so I am holding fire (ha ha) at the moment.
What I hope will happen is the Government will eventually ban woodburners being used in day light hours at least.
I am sorry, but anyone that doesn't believe we have created this mess for ourselves is in denial.
Do not expect many likes for this post but it is what it is!
Whilst on about next door anyone any ideas how I can shut there dogs up without shooting them, or losing my voice shouting at them?

There is an online series of courses run by Future Learn on global warming/climate change its causes and ways of possibly negating its effects. If you can spare three hours a week well worth the time and effort, just google.

 

[jof]

Ok, we have 1 large fan assisted electric storage heater in our house that dates from its construction in the late 60's.

2 years ago I started down the route of replacing it with an air source heat pump, as the price differential between economy7 an day units had been erroded in the last 10 years & will only get worse as people want to charge their cars.

20k was the original quote for a big standard 3 bed semi!

Covid intervened & tried to resume where we left off.
But no, apparently we need all electrics upgrading & the water pressure isn't high enough. There are difficulties working out where to put the thing as it can't be within 1m of the boundary & our garden is small.

Then we get an email 2 weeks ago saying they are cancelling because they can't get the parts to install it before the existing RHI scheme ends in march.

I think it's too hard to retro fit to existing homes & they have decided it's not worth their while.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

would like a wood burner but the house next door makes our life a near misery with the smell of their smoke when the wind is in the wrong direction (for us) so I am holding fire (ha ha) at the moment

They are probably burning wet wood or pallets with preservative which creates the stink.
We are getting a multifuel stove so we have a choice of what we can burn, smokeless coal is what we will mostly burn it's a bit more expensive than coal bit it burns hotter and lasts longer.

 

[Cwrw666]

We heat our house (smallish Welsh farmhouse) entirely with 2 woodburners - one running all day in winter, the other for a couple of hours in the evening. All the wood is free but we do use about 2.5 bags of coal a week just for a boost of heat when we first light them.
There again, we do have cavity walls despite them being stone and built in the mid 1800s.
So warm in winter and cool in summer.

Last year we had to fight off salesmen trying to get us to have central heating installed (gas!) along with government grants to cover it. The mind boggles...

BTW, any smell from peoples woodburners is most likely caused by downdraughts pulling the smoke down to where it can be drawn in through your ventilation.

 

[johncrobinson]

In 2008 I moved into a property with electric storage heating on a tarrif called THTC (Total Heating Total Control)
at first the price for "heating" energy was half that of normal electric. Similar to economy 7.

10 years later the price for my heating electric had risen so much there was virtually NO differance between my heating and normal use

What saved me.????
A GAS BOILER much,much cheaper and more cozy.

 

[johncrobinson]

Aye they are not slow in selling Cwrw666 when at the time there are savings to be made.
Fast Forward a few years and said savings will be gone.!!!

 

[johncrobinson]

BTW Barlylass I hope you dont think my comment to you was hostile, It really was not

 

[Druncan]

Our project has been to alter our house and build a brewery (200L) in part of it. It's a 1950's poured concrete bungalow. Planning and building conversion done during covid. The brewery space and infrastructure is also there now.

All the building now has 75mm framed insulation, vapour barrier and all double glazing refurbished. Loft has 600mm insulation. All pipework insulated. Then added a 8.5kw multifuel cooker stove in the main open-plan area. The house is toasty and we mainly burn driftwood + house coal. Water heated by Eco7 immersion.

The brewery will hopefully soon be fitted with a 1.9kw solar EvTube water array to a 450l HLT with 100mm insulation
and eco7 immersion (just icase we need it) I'm also fitting two 50Kw PHE's. One for brewery heat the other is a safety top-up to our domestic HWT in case the solar over-cooks the 450l tank in summer My grant application for this work is now with Zerowaste Scotland,,,, Fingers crossed. Binned Heat pump idea as locally they are unreliable, power hungry and servicing/maintenance here is really expensive.

 

[Shirley Bassett]

I’ve been fortunate enough to own two highly insulated houses.

My first was in North Wales. It was absolutely stuffed with tin foil wrapped insulation, to a point that we couldn’t get a 4G signal inside the house. It had an EPC rating of A. The house had oil fired underfloor heating that had digital thermostats to control the zones. In 5 years that I lived there I never used the UFH, except if I was away for a long period of time, when I left the UFH on its frost stat setting at 12C. The house was open plan and had a 8kW wood burning stove. I once came back from Holiday on a Saturday afternoon in March, in time for the England v Wales six nations kickoff. I lit the Woodburner and by half time the UFH controller temperatures in the main part of the house had gone from 12C to 26C. I then started opening doors to the rest of the house to heat elsewhere. Our wood supply was free, and I can honestly say I never spent a penny on heating, except to stop the UFH from freezing up.

My current house in Aberdeenshire, is also well insulated, with an EPC rating of B. It too has oil fired UFH which over the last 2 winters I’ve ran 24hrs a day for 5 months at 14C in all of the zones. Once the slab of the house has warmed up, which takes about 24 hours it’s comfortable in the house. Last winter I used around 1000L of oil at 22p/l purchased during lockdown 1.

We boost the house temperature, mainly on an evening by lighting the wood burning stove. Again wood source is free, but you have to be willing to cut and split your own logs.

In my experience it’s a well insulated house that is key to reducing your heating costs, and free supply of wood.

 

[Victor Churchill]

I am surprised that in the current discussion I have heard no mention, here or on the Media, of boiler replacements based on induction heating. Seems to me that you should be able to replace an obsolescent gas combi boiler with an electric induction unit that would immediately give you water at the right temperature without needing to re-plumb your radiators etc. Costly for sure, but so are heat pumps and inductionboilers shoud be a lot less hassle.
Induction boiler, 7 kW, for heating the surface of 120m² - 140m² | Lunares Store
Induction boiler

 

[johncrobinson]

Highland Council installed these Wet electric boiler systems a few years back Victor.

There was utter outrage at the cost of running them,Public meetings were held at which the attending Council officers were given a right roasting.

Over the next few years the council ripped them all out and replaced them with gas boilers.
In my case this amounted to nearly 70% anual heating savings.