Hand pull woes

[peebee]

Oops, I knew I was getting carried away ...

... (while about it remove the "flapper-valve" on the beer-out side - it has been made redundant too) ...

The "flapper valve" (or its equivalent) is mobile on the piston, so needs a working replacement. The pressure needed to "crack" the suggested check-valve on the nozzle should help firmly seat and seal the "flapper" ... or, make a badly defective "flapper" leak all the more!


[EDIT: And likewise: It may be a defective piston valve ("flapper") causing the inefficient pumping, not the piston ring. Or ... it's both!].

[EDIT2: And I've already pointed out in this thread these EWL pumps don't have a "flapper" valve! All pistons and O-rings. Geesh, I'm having one of those "lack of consistency" periods.]

 

[RoomWithABrew]

That's him! ^^^^^ (the red one).

Just got to find a source of them over here (@RoomWithABrew is in N.Z.). Failed a while back, may be better luck this time.

I got this second hand with a second hand beer engine.
It is not the land of cask down here. Suspect red sparkler came from UK.
I do highly recommend the stout creamer the black mushroom one, great pint with that of stout.
I'm getting some suck back on one of my beer engines when handle returning to upright.
I'll have to investigate once I've finished bar and brewery refurb.

 

[peebee]

Could not get one of those check valve sparklers. But could get some diddy (10mm) check valve off eBay:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/404275252530
I can fit those to my handpump nozzle (or in a threaded extension) and keep them in place with a sparkler or extension or both. (From Harry Mason's, those bits are interchangeable on other handpumps). Even though I've got solenoid valves on the outlets, I've always fancied check valves on the ends of the nozzles to prevent staling of any beer in the nozzle (I can remove the dependency on 24V lines and solenoid valves at a late date ... though they do keep the pump "locked" unless the gas is switched on ... that's getting complicated, it's just that this bar is designed by a paranoid Loonie - err, that'll be me!).

 

[RoomWithABrew]

Its sort of stoking your paranoia all of these questions.

 

[Andy_OC]

Just an update . My new hydraulic piston seal 63mm x 4mm arrived and fits a treat . Nice and tight . I am 99pc sure that the EWL beer engine is now 100pc.

I think alot of the issues I've had are also excess carbonation of the naturally conditioned keg. I haven't yet got a very low pressure regulator and it still seems to be foaming excessivoy as it is drawn off by the engine . This froth is less volume hence more strokes to draw a pint Vs plain water which takes 4 strokes on the nose .

 

[Gary]

Hi all , I’m so frustrated your help could be a lifesaver .whenever I hook my hand pulls up to a ball lock disconnect it causes a vacuum and the pull goes stiffyet when I run a line straight into the keg it pours perfectly, I have a demand valve and hooked it up to the gas so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated

 

[Mash Monster]

Hi all , I’m so frustrated your help could be a lifesaver .whenever I hook my hand pulls up to a ball lock disconnect it causes a vacuum and the pull goes stiffyet when I run a line straight into the keg it pours perfectly, I have a demand valve and hooked it up to the gas so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated

Have you checked the dip tube or ball lock isn’t blocked?

 

[peebee]

Hi all , I’m so frustrated your help could be a lifesaver .whenever I hook my hand pulls up to a ball lock disconnect it causes a vacuum and the pull goes stiffyet when I run a line straight into the keg it pours perfectly, I have a demand valve and hooked it up to the gas so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated

The "demand valve" should be connected to the beer not gas. Corny kegs? And suction will pull the lid in, "cracking" the seal to let air in (and your beer goes off a week later).

Read that essay linked in my signature below ... you'll probably find your answers in that.

 

[peebee]

As I've had this happen to me: I use flexible dip tubes and do fill my kegs via the disconnect/dip-tube. Dry hopping with hop pellets bunged the disconnect/dip-tube up with hop pellet debris after filling the keg. Hell of a job fixing it!

I should have thought of that one too!

(Replaced lid with one that had a dip tube attached to bypass the blocked one).

 

[RoomWithABrew]

Hi all , I’m so frustrated your help could be a lifesaver .whenever I hook my hand pulls up to a ball lock disconnect it causes a vacuum and the pull goes stiffyet when I run a line straight into the keg it pours perfectly, I have a demand valve and hooked it up to the gas so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated

Check no blockage using picnic tap dispenses from the ball lock, or push centre pin down and get small beer shower.
The tube from ball lock needs to be large diameter and also must not collapse.

 

[Vandalay]

Could not get one of those check valve sparklers. But could get some diddy (10mm) check valve off eBay:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/404275252530
I can fit those to my handpump nozzle (or in a threaded extension) and keep them in place with a sparkler or extension or both. (From Harry Mason's, those bits are interchangeable on other handpumps). Even though I've got solenoid valves on the outlets, I've always fancied check valves on the ends of the nozzles to prevent staling of any beer in the nozzle (I can remove the dependency on 24V lines and solenoid valves at a late date ... though they do keep the pump "locked" unless the gas is switched on ... that's getting complicated, it's just that this bar is designed by a paranoid Loonie - err, that'll be me!).

You can make your own one-way sparkler with the ball found in liquor bottles and a stainless steel spring. It works perfect

 

[peebee]

You can make your own one-way sparkler with the ball found in liquor bottles and a stainless steel spring. It works perfect

That's ... that's ... (I've got to have a go at that!).

Don't know what the heck that "ball found in liquor bottles" is, but I'm sure I can come up with something.

 

[The Baron]

Only thing I can think it is PeeBee is those pourers you put on a bottle to give a measure I think some work with a ball inside them.

 

[Vandalay]

That's ... that's ... (I've got to have a go at that!).

Don't know what the heck that "ball found in liquor bottles" is, but I'm sure I can come up with something.

Many liquor bottles (tequila, ron, whisky, vodka) have dispenser nozzles. Inside them there are small (10/11mm) plastic or (sometimes) glass marbles. Glass marbles are way better but harder to find

 

[RoomWithABrew]

There's a little plastic ball for the non return in a Sankey coupler, seems to fit, assume the spring is on other side of ball pushing it up against the end of the spout.
I do have sparkler with non return valve already.

 

[jimmybeer2024]

Right , gave the pump a quick strip down to have a look at the internals again . This is the cylinder in pieces


I'll call the two valves inlet and outlet (bottom and top of cylinder respectively). I tested the valve function by sealing my mouth over the valves and sucking or blowing (ahem). The inlet valve worked as expected and no leakage against lung power . The outlet valve at the top (pictured in my hand and later dissasembled )was leaking somewhat . I stripped it and turned the O ring over . Seems solid now . Reassable the piston into the cylinder and the piston ring didn't look too circular in the cylinder with a signs of wear and scoring on the piston ring seal . That isn't as easy to replace or swap . I put the whole thing together and managed to draw a pint in around 10 strokes again . The back suck is minimal , only a tiny amount of any at all. The only thing that is untested now is the piston ring seal . If that is bypassing beer then the whole function of the outlet valve is bypassed to a degree in proportion to the leakage within the main cylinder (piston ring seal).

What I really want to know now if how many strokes of the pump to draw a pint from someone who has a similar comparable engine ?

I am using a demand valve close to the intake as you mention PeeBee.

Perhaps I will remove the cylinder ring seal and try to make a new one from some suitable rubber or neoprene .

Looking forward to hearing feedback of stroke numbers to pour a pint .

Cheers

Andy
View attachment 88392View attachment 88393View attachment 88393View attachment 88395

Hi there - I've just bought the same pot off of ebay and a seals kit from RBLS to replace all of them. How do you get these pieces out? On both the piston valve and the inlet valve there is what I'm going to call a 'holder' which has the four holes at 12, 3, 6 and 9. Do they just pop straight out?

 

[jimmybeer2024]

Hiya - I've just purchased the same 1/4 EWL from ebay. I've purchased the seal kit as they were all properly knackered. I'm getting some pull through but holding my finger over the spout and drawing a pint I'm getting some seepage from where the piston rod exits the barrel.

There is a small plastic piece with screw thread and inside sits a cork piece, rubber O ring and small plastic cover.

Can anyone advise the correct order these go into and around the piston shaft?

 

[peebee]

I'm a bit lacking on "EWL" maintenance. But someone will be along ...

 

[RoomWithABrew]

My EWL has a transverse cylinder, I don't remember any bits of cork in it, just O rings.
Some pictures might help the puzzle solvers.

 

[MashBag]

Yup 'tis a miniature well pump, how hard can it be.. send us the pics and the collective will solve the problem for you... in at least five different ways