Fruit wine, working out how much sugar I need?

[Mikes1992]

I'm trying to make wine from 2kg mixed frozen fruit (30% strawberries, 30% blackberries, 20% red currents, 20% black currents) for the first time, it's currently in a straining bag inside the 5L fermenter, yesterday I put a campden tablet in to sterilise the ingredients, this morning I put in the pectic enzyme which reading the recipe should be left in for 24 hours.

So tomorrow I will be adding the yeast. The recipe I'm following says to leave the bag in for 5-7 days of fermentation. The only thing I can think is to give the bag a good squeeze and add sugar till the juice measures a SG of 1.09-1.1 and after removing the bag of fruit after the 5-7 days mix the sugar/water I need to fill to fermenter to the same 1.09-1.1 before it is added. I'm just not sure how the fruit in the bag will effect the sugar content over the course of the fermentation? I haven't taken a SG reading yet as I was going to wait for the pectic enzyme to do it's work on the fruit.

 

[trummy]

If you get it right that should make a very nice wine. I have made a very similar one from frozen fruit. Red current on its own is very nice.
I only squeeze the bag very lightly. Heading for a 1.090 reading works for me but I have had the hydrometer off scale and still got a decent result.
If you get the reading right at the start with the bag of fruit removed then just ferment it out. Its not an exact science, depends on how ripe the fruit is that you are using e.t.c - you could add a 200ml of red grape juice to give it a bit more body but its not essential.
Don't over think it. For years I made wine without the benefit of a hydrometer.

 

[Mr_S_Jerusalem]

I think you need to add approximately 1.1kg sugar to the fruit to reach 14% wine.

 

[Mikes1992]

Thanks guys. Hopefully it all goes to plan

I only just got a hydrometer, the last time I made my own wine (from grape juice) instead of a using a kit it was a bit crap and got used mostly for cooking. I didn't take any of the steps I did this time though (like using pectic enzyme) and my sugar addition was guess work.
I suspect it was more down to the fact that the grape juice was sweet drinking juice though and not the bitter/tart/acidic juice usually used in wines. The juice I've extracted upto now does taste tart and acidic, I was thinking of adding citric acid but I don't think it needs it.

 

[johncrobinson]

Non of the fruits you mention are particularly rich in sugar.So about 1kg to the gallon sounds about right.
But its best to check with the hydrometer.
I was also going to recommend a pectic enzyme but i see you have that covered as well.

Full marks for getting/using a hydrometer.I have been making wine for over 50yrs and still use a hydrometer to check my starting and final gravity rather than rely on following a recipe.

The only things i would do different is mash the fruit to a pulp at the start and not bother with the bag.Then leave the fruit in until primary fermentation is finished.
This would give a stronger colour to the wine
I would also add a bit of grape tannin.
Some winemakers substitute this with a cup of very strong black tea.

As regards adding acid if you have hard alkaline water (limescale) a bit of acid might be needed.
Wine that tastes or smells like glue is a sure indication of lack of acid,Once this happens its too late to do anything about it.

Welcome to the forum and the best of luck with your wine this time.

 

[Mikes1992]

Does it matter if my tannin expired over a year ago?

There's nowhere nearby that sells wine tannin (the only brew shop local to us closed down a couple years ago). I wish I had realised this when I ordered my stuff online last week xD

I've just checked the gravity of the juice after mixing it and it came out to 1.06, I added 200g to bring the base 2L upto a measurement of 1.09 and then added my Yeast (it's already foaming)

I've got 500g mixed to 2L measuring at roughly 1.085 on the hydrometer (taken at 48c so it may drop closer to the 1.09 target) and just waiting for it to cool before adding

 

[johncrobinson]

My tannin same one as in your photo expired 22/02/2007
that's nearly 14yrs out of date and is still perfectly fine.
Honest.!!!!!!

 

[Mikes1992]

The only things i would do different is mash the fruit to a pulp at the start and not bother with the bag.Then leave the fruit in until primary fermentation is finished.

I was thinking about doing this but wasn't really sure or confident that I could get rid of the debris left over from the fruit. Upto now though it seems to look very rich in colour, closer to one of the more premium wine kits we've tried. I did mash the fruit up inside the bag to increase the amount of fruit exposure to the pectolase.

I've use more fruit then the recipe suggested but I managed to get 2kg reduced from £6 to £3.

I am pretty excited to see how this turns out as we always have tons of surplus gooseberries (I'm sure we got about 8kg this summer) in the summer which generally get turned into jam and would love to try something different with them this year.

I think aiming to have all my sugar/water additions already at my target SG should be enough to get the correct sugar addition. I'm already at 820g of sugar which isn't far off the estimate of about 1KG

 

[johncrobinson]

Dont worry about the fruit residue as it separates out by itself.But there is no actual harm as such in using a bag.

To use more fruit in a wine than is suggested in a recipe is actually normally a good idea. Many published recipes especially older ones are printed with "economy" in mind.
I often add extra fruit or fruit juice to kits.

Your gooseberry surplus is indeed a blessing.They are one of the most highly prized fruits for winemaking.
To winemakers they are known as the hairy grape and make a truly excellent white wine.Can also be used as a "base" ingredient in red wines.

Adding sugar as syrup at either desired gravity or as strong syrup (gravity 300.) is the best way to go.
My late Father often added his sugar dry and got a volcanic eruption for his trouble,Also dry sugar can collect undissolved at the bottom of the fermenter,Which is not good for the yeast.

Since you are going to get into this big time i would also suggest getting some 5gal fermenter bins, This will allow you to jump to bigger batches.
It will astonish you just how much wine you will end up giving away to friends/family/neighbours.

 

[Mikes1992]

Once we get our own house we'll probably get a bigger 23-25L fermenter. At the moment we don't have the room,

I've just taken a gravity reading today, it's already at ~1.028, I promised my self I'd avoid drinking active yeast (since my stomach went crazy one day in a bubbling eruption of fermentation after eating pasta xD) but I couldn't help myself... And It tastes absolutely amazing. It's like kopparberg mixed fruit cider but 1000x better (which is good considering I don't really enjoy kopparbergs mixed fruit cider)... It should currently be around the 9-10% mark. I'll definitely make my own wine in the future if the finished product is anywhere near as good as what I just tasted!

 

[Mikes1992]

I just realised that I forgot to add that on the 16th I also added 1Tsp citric acid and 1/4Tsp of tannin

 

[johncrobinson]

Glad its turning out well.

 

[Mikes1992]

I've just put in the stabiliser and syphoned it off the sediment into a demijohn and just starting the degassing process. It was showing an SG of 1.0 on the hydrometer, using a ABV calculater its around 11.5-12.5%. I finished it a little early because I wasn't sure how it would effect the flavour profile if I let it keep going. It is actually very nice, very similar to a White Zinfandel rosé which is actually one of my favourite wines. I think if I was to make it again I'd probably opt to use a slower fermenting yeast as I felt like I was racing against time to get the next steps done on time, I'd maybe even experiment making a high alcohol cider as it was exquisite at the 8-9% mark with very defined citrus fruit and sweet fruit flavours.

 

[Mikes1992]

I've decided to do this recipe again, only I've used a slower fermenting yeast. It's been fermenting for 3 days and it's at 1.052 instead of the previous wines 1.028 at 3 days... I'm not sure if you'd class it as a cider but I'm aiming to finish it around 1.025 for an 8-9% ABV. I'm just hoping that it won't be too sweet in larger quantities.

 

[johncrobinson]

I have found this also
During my high abv period i found my wines needed lots and lots of maturing to be even drinkable.
Things like fruit notes were not even on the scale.

 

[Mikes1992]

Bit random, but it tastes good... Just wish I'd used a little less citric acid