Forum polotics.

[chrig]

pick up your pen and write out an A4 page of 'i must use the multi quote function' so you don't forget again :lol:

 

[graysalchemy]

No Smiley Tony but I do have a photo for you

 

[marksa222]

That's me done around here. Bye

Dear me... The internet's a funny place...

I'm sure he'll be missed.

 

[anthonyUK]

...I should have quoted the other posts I was referring to, or done it in a separate post.

It's not too late :whistle:

 

[BrowserUk]

Absolutely ridiculous. I see no personal insults in that thread by Aleman. There is no defending required in my opinion.

The funny thing is that I actually feel a lot of remorse for the fact that a new member has left. Still I did apologise for having a rant at other posters in the same post that I actually answered his question first, yeah I should have quoted the other posts I was referring to, or done it in a separate post.

Now where is the sackcloth and fcuking ashes smiley?? :evil:

The best bit is: YOU WERE WRONG!

Here are a couple of quotes from the bible of home wine makers: FIRST STEPS IN WINEMAKING by C. J. J. BERRY.

Indeed, these are the first two paragraphs after the preface.

AEROBIC FERMENTATION: A fermentation conducted in the presence of air. Usually the
first part of the fermentation process.

ANAEROBIC FERMENTATION: A fermentation from which air is excluded; the second part
of the fermentation process.

I could -- and was going to, but I got bored with the cuttin' 'n pastin' -- quote innumerable other (definitive) sources that show your closed, colloquial, uninformed and self-important diatribe on the meaning of the terms: (an)aerobic; to be utter, hogwash.

**** the "sackcloth and ashes"; fiddle-de-dee to your "you misunderstood me" defence; How's abou' a simple apology?

Don' bovver. I'm gone for good this time. Cos thes meny ovver places, and meny ovver 'xperts, mostly whom don' feel d'need to ass-**** newbies for sport n'order to bolster their fragile egos.

See ya suckkers.

 

[joe1002]

f**k the "sackcloth and ashes"; fiddle-de-dee to your "you misunderstood me" defence; How's abou' a simple apology?

Don' bovver. I'm gone for good this time. Cos thes meny ovver places, and meny ovver 'xperts, mostly whom don' feel d'need to ass-**** newbies for sport n'order to bolster their fragile egos.

See ya suckkers.

:rofl: :rofl:

 

[ryanshelton]

Absolutely ridiculous. I see no personal insults in that thread by Aleman. There is no defending required in my opinion.

The funny thing is that I actually feel a lot of remorse for the fact that a new member has left. Still I did apologise for having a rant at other posters in the same post that I actually answered his question first, yeah I should have quoted the other posts I was referring to, or done it in a separate post.

Now where is the sackcloth and fcuking ashes smiley?? :evil:

The best bit is: YOU WERE WRONG!

Here are a couple of quotes from the bible of home wine makers: FIRST STEPS IN WINEMAKING by C. J. J. BERRY.

Indeed, these are the first two paragraphs after the preface.

AEROBIC FERMENTATION: A fermentation conducted in the presence of air. Usually the
first part of the fermentation process.

[quote:3lsudcd6]
ANAEROBIC FERMENTATION: A fermentation from which air is excluded; the second part
of the fermentation process.

I could -- and was going to, but I got bored with the cuttin' 'n pastin' -- quote innumerable other (definitive) sources that show your closed, colloquial, uninformed and self-important diatribe on the meaning of the terms: (an)aerobic; to be utter, hogwash.

f**k the "sackcloth and ashes"; fiddle-de-dee to your "you misunderstood me" defence; How's abou' a simple apology?

Don' bovver. I'm gone for good this time. Cos thes meny ovver places, and meny ovver 'xperts, mostly whom don' feel d'need to ass-**** newbies for sport n'order to bolster their fragile egos.

See ya suckkers.[/quote:3lsudcd6]



Hahaha been following this thread just for the laughs!

 

[BIGJIM72]

Issues. Definate issues. Never trust someone who can't use a spell checker.

I have never tried the aforementioned relations with a forum newbie, nor do I feel the need to bolster my ego.

Through my brewing career I have tried,& strived & occasionally failed to make a better beer or wine.I don't need to boost my ego-my end results speak for themselves.( Sure that goes for Aleman as well).

Again pal-if you get hung up about people using capital letters maybe don't use the internet,or Ceefax, or play Scrabble-you might get upset.

Never mind the sack cloth & ashes smiley, can we have a "learn to use the fecking search for FAQ you new member" & a "lager,it's lager-larger means bigger" smiley?

Can we close this thread & kick the bell end now?

 

[adomant]

Absolutely ridiculous. I see no personal insults in that thread by Aleman. There is no defending required in my opinion.

The funny thing is that I actually feel a lot of remorse for the fact that a new member has left. Still I did apologise for having a rant at other posters in the same post that I actually answered his question first, yeah I should have quoted the other posts I was referring to, or done it in a separate post.

Now where is the sackcloth and fcuking ashes smiley?? :evil:

The best bit is: YOU WERE WRONG!

Here are a couple of quotes from the bible of home wine makers: FIRST STEPS IN WINEMAKING by C. J. J. BERRY.

Indeed, these are the first two paragraphs after the preface.

AEROBIC FERMENTATION: A fermentation conducted in the presence of air. Usually the
first part of the fermentation process.

[quote:nds84tqp]
ANAEROBIC FERMENTATION: A fermentation from which air is excluded; the second part
of the fermentation process.

I could -- and was going to, but I got bored with the cuttin' 'n pastin' -- quote innumerable other (definitive) sources that show your closed, colloquial, uninformed and self-important diatribe on the meaning of the terms: (an)aerobic; to be utter, hogwash.

f**k the "sackcloth and ashes"; fiddle-de-dee to your "you misunderstood me" defence; How's abou' a simple apology?

Don' bovver. I'm gone for good this time. Cos thes meny ovver places, and meny ovver 'xperts, mostly whom don' feel d'need to ass-**** newbies for sport n'order to bolster their fragile egos.

See ya suckkers.[/quote:nds84tqp]

It's taken you a whole week to come back - with that!

 

[artyb]

flouncing off twice....
thats a new one ... :grin:

 

[BIGJIM72]

He won't get on much better at Jims-they wanted to burn me at the stake for being left handed.

Thats a proper noob roasting.

 

[Jeltz]

<snip>
The best bit is: YOU WERE WRONG!

Nope he's not he's just being a lot more technical about it, those quotes are over simplistic as one might expect in a book called "first steps" in anything......

Good luck with the wine,

 

[keith1664]

CJ Berry eh.... cutting edge stuff!!

 

[oldbloke]

<snip>
The best bit is: YOU WERE WRONG!

Nope he's not he's just being a lot more technical about it, those quotes are over simplistic as one might expect in a book called "first steps" in anything......

When CJJB wrote that, anybody outside a lab specialising in the subject didn't really know much about how yeast works.

If Aleman could just expand on why we aerate the wort/must if the yeast doesn't need the oxygen to breathe (does it breathe? it's a not quite fungus not quite bacterium isn't it? Does it breathe, in a sense we understand?) or for reproduction, just for building cell walls (I think he said), is it just that we prefer it gets the oxygen for this directly rather than from other compounds in the brew? What are the effects if we don't bother aerating?

Maybe I want that "Yeast" book for my upcoming birthday...
Actually there's no 'maybe' about it!

 

[graysalchemy]

Sorry Browser I have to agree, your so called 'Bible' is just that............ an out of date book which was written in a time when science was not as well understood :lol: :lol:

If you are going to quote science make sure it is up to date and not something published 50 yrs ago. :lol: :lol:

 

[Hawks]

If Aleman could just expand on why we aerate the wort/must if the yeast doesn't need the oxygen to breathe (does it breathe? it's a not quite fungus not quite bacterium isn't it? Does it breathe, in a sense we understand?) or for reproduction, just for building cell walls (I think he said), is it just that we prefer it gets the oxygen for this directly rather than from other compounds in the brew? What are the effects if we don't bother aerating?

Maybe I want that "Yeast" book for my upcoming birthday...
Actually there's no 'maybe' about it!

Here's a good link from the Danstar website that explains the use of oxygen for creating lipids for cell walls http://www.danstaryeast.com/articles/crabtree-effect-and-overflow-metabolism

Would def recommend the yeast book as well :thumb:

This made me laugh a lot this morning... I love a good flounce off

 

[Aleman]

If we take the definitions in the loosest terms aerobic - in the presence of oxygen and Anaerobic - In the absence of oxygen, then yes I was wrong .

Going into a little bit more detail, we discover that yeast when put in the presence of sugar ferment the sugar into alcohol . . this happens both in the presence of oxygen and in the absence of oxygen . . . and does not require the presence of oxygen in any shape or form (perhaps bold is better than capitals for emphasis :sulk: :sulk: :sulk: ) . . . therefore the use of the terms aerobic and anaerobic fermentation is completely meaningless in terms of what is actually going on. . . .

C6H12O6 → 2 CH3CH2OH + 2 CO2 ( It's a bit more complex than this really . . . try . . . )

But does not involve oxygen in any shape or form and therefore distinguishing fermentation as aerobic or anaerobic is (am I allowed to do this) WRONG!!

It's meaningless in terms of yeast reproduction as well, because dried yeast contains enough sterol, ergosterol, and fatty acids to reproduce without any additional oxygen being supplied to allow it to make the compounds for further reproduction down the line. It is important to include oxygen at the start of fermentation to allow them to build these reserves if we want to reuse the yeast in another batch, and indeed brewers yeast can become quite lazy and decide to stop working if we have not aerated the wort/must at the beginning . . . mainly because they are not really 'designed' to work in the alcohol concentrations we are asking them to do so. The addition of oxygen to the must / wort encourages the formation of oxidative pathways producing compounds that are easily broken down later in fermentation, hence the what could be, incorrectly, called anaerobic fermentation proceeds to completion if we allow a period, of what could be, incorrectly, called aerobic fermentation to take place at the beginning.

Aleman signing off

 

[oldbloke]

Thanks, Aleman & Hawks

 

[Aleman]

The yeast doesn't need the oxygen to breathe (does it breathe?)

Breathing is the process of getting air into a body, in mammals accomplished by the diaphragm and intercostal muscles (insects use spiracles . . . and have some muscles that can 'pump' air in and out of them).

Yeast, and other single celled organisms do not breath, gaseous exchange take place across the damp cell membrane

it's a not quite fungus not quite bacterium isn't it?

It is a fungus . . . single celled but still a fungus . . .just like mushrooms . . . which are actually fruiting bodies of the fungus.

 

[Hawks]

He won't get on much better at Jims-they wanted to burn me at the stake for being left handed.

Thats a proper noob roasting.

:rofl: :rofl: missed this one last time around