Excessive lag time?

[timtoos]

Hi all,

I brewed the MM clone of Siren Soundwave yesterday. Cracking brew day, hit all numbers - must be a first for me

I rehydrated the yeast in water at 25C and pitched the yeast, (Lallemand New England yeast 2 packets of 11g each) at about 14:00. The yeast looked happy and raring to go.

Nice steady temperature at 18C. Anyway, there is zero activity still. I dont know why but I always end up worrying when fermentation doesnt start quickly. On the Lallemand website it does say that the lag phase is longer than usual at 24-36 hours. I did expect to see something though.

What are folks thoughts? Get more yeast or ride it out?

Thanks

 

[Dutto]

Patience is a virtue in brewing!

Wait at least 48 hours.

The yeast was rehydrated at 25*C and now it’s expected to work at 18*C! Give it time.
:hat:

 

[Agentgonzo]

Double check your airlock is topped up. I had a brew a few months ago where there was a tiny gap at the top of the liquid in the airlock. Imperceptible to the eye, but allowed gas to escape. After 3 days of fretting, I gingerly opened the fermenter and saw a full krausen. I Topped the airlock up and it started bubbling straight away

 

[The Baron]

The producers say it has a lag so lets give it the chance.
Ps they are always over optimistic in there claims too
Patience is a virtue- where have I just read that

 

[An Ankoù]

Patience is a vice and tantamount to moral cowardice in my book.
While you're sitting around watching paint dry, all sorts of nasty things could be going on in your beer: noxious bacteria multiplying, a thick slime of mould thinking of making its appearance, chemical changes in the composition of the wort, quantum events in parallel dimension, etc, etc. Nothing you can do about it, but you could at least worry and fret to show that you care.

 

[The Baron]

There is something in what AA has said it is not good to have long lag times and maybe another choice of yeast with less lag would be better in the long run next time, or does the yeast people recommend re-hydration or a starter that may quicken up the process. That I do not know as I do not know that yeast

 

[An Ankoù]

There is something in what AA has said it is not good to have long lag times and maybe another choice of yeast with less lag would be better in the long run next time, or does the yeast people recommend re-hydration or a starter that may quicken up the process. That I do not know as I do not know that yeast

It does seem a bit much after two packets have been rehydrated (near the bottom of the temp range for rehydration, 18C would be too low). I haven't used that yeast either and I don't know Siren Soundwave so I'm going to look them up.

EDIT
OK Lallemand New England doesn't take longer than 24-36 hours, it can take between 24 and 36 hours. The optimal temperature is 15-22C so why not ramp it up to 22 until it gets going and then attemperate it down a bit. If you only brewed it yesterday then you've hardly given the yeast enough time. When did you pitch the yeast?
On the other hand, you're right to be worried. this Siren Soundwave appears to be one of those "beers" that are under-bittered and over-hopped so they taste like Juicy Fruit pop. I've never made this style, but I've read quiite a bit and it seems they're very susceptible to oxidation. You've got a lot of late and whirlpool hop products hanging around in oxygenated wort and the wort continues to dissolve oxygen from the air and will continue to do so until the yeast gets going and flushes both the liquid and the headspace with CO2. Let's hope it gets going sooner rather than later. By the way, gases are less soluble in warmer water than they are in cooler. Another reason to warm up the ferment.

 

[timtoos]

Thanks all for the advice

 

[timtoos]

Ive ramped up the temperature to 20.0C

 

[timtoos]

Forgot to mention, Im fermenting in a SS brewtech bucket with blow-off tube so no leaks. Had a quick sneaky look earlier and nothing at all on the beer, no krausen at all. I pitched at about 14:00 14/5/22. Fingers crossed it kicks off soon

 

[An Ankoù]

Forgot to mention, Im fermenting in a SS brewtech bucket with blow-off tube so no leaks. Had a quick sneaky look earlier and nothing at all on the beer, no krausen at all. I pitched at about 14:00 14/5/22. Fingers crossed it kicks off soon

It'll be there in the morning, chugging away like a chap trying to be polite after a night on the Guinness and vindaloo.

 

[timtoos]

It'll be there in the morning, chugging away like a chap trying to be polite after a night on the Guinness and vindaloo.

Brilliant

 

[WonkyDonkey]

Forgot to mention, Im fermenting in a SS brewtech bucket with blow-off tube so no leaks. Had a quick sneaky look earlier and nothing at all on the beer, no krausen at all. I pitched at about 14:00 14/5/22. Fingers crossed it kicks off soon

My latest batch (dry hops are in now) was with the same yeast, pitched 2 packets the same as you at it took just shy of 36 hours to get going. Once it did go it took around 6 days from pitching to ferment out. Sounds like you're just coming to that point so it should get going some time tonight

 

[timtoos]

Hi WonkyDonkey,
Did you also increase the temperature or stick with your initial value? My initial plan, as per MM recipe was to initially ferment at 18C then up the temperature to 22C.
Ive just upped my temperature to 20.0C
If this is just lag Ive never had such a laggy yeast

 

[Dutto]

Hi WonkyDonkye,
Did you also increase the temperature or stick with your initial value? My initial plan, as per MM recipe was to initially ferment at 18C then up the temperature to 22C.
Ive just upped my temperature to 20.0C
If this is just lag Ive never had such a laggy yeast

STOP IT!

I’ve “bolded” why so please leave it alone; and that includes opening it up to see if there’s a Krausen!
:hat:

 

[timtoos]

Point taken. I'll walk away from it now.
This is the issue with tilts. Waiting for activity from a distance. The brews in the shed and I'm sat in the house watching Brewfather.

 

[WonkyDonkey]

Point taken. I'll walk away from it now.
This is the issue with tilts. Waiting for activity from a distance. The brews in the shed and I'm sat in the house watching Brewfather.

I'm exactly like you! SS Brewbucket, Tilt, Brewfather, always looking for any sign of anything. I only have the ability to heat at the moment, I pitched around 19 and once it got going it took itself up to 21.5. As it started to slow down I kept it at 22c until it finished off.
I'd leave it alone, have confidence in it and let it do it's thing

 

[Dutto]

I find it hysterical that people with one of these tilty things spend so much of their time:

1. Looking at the machine read-out.
2. Complaining bitterly that it’s either inaccurate, a beast to calibrate or covered in gunk.
3. Looking in their fermenters “just to check” their brew.

In the meantime, being “old school”, I do what it says on the kit, take an OG, bang in the yeast, shut down the lid of the FV and then leave it to ferment for at least two weeks! (I check that bubbles appear in the blow-off bottle after about two days.)
:hat:

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

leave it to ferment for at least two weeks!

AMEN to that.

 

[timtoos]

I find it hysterical that people with one of these tilty things spend so much of their time:

1. Looking at the machine read-out.
2. Complaining bitterly that it’s either inaccurate, a beast to calibrate or covered in gunk.
3. Looking in their fermenters “just to check” their brew.

In the meantime, being “old school”, I do what it says on the kit, take an OG, bang in the yeast, shut down the lid of the FV and then leave it to ferment for at least two weeks! (I check that bubbles appear in the blow-off bottle after about two days.)
:hat:

Absolutely right. I can’t help it though. However, even before I had the tilt I was on edge until I saw some bubbles. My ferment usually almost always happens the morning after pitch so when there’s no activity, I start climbing the ceiling.