E-Petition "Drop the October Beer Tax" Unfair Beer Duty

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Franklin said:
I hope you all read the Kate Fox piece on alcohol - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-15265317
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A lot of her chat goes round in circles and she wouldn't get teenage boys drinking coffee to get out there banger. In saying that a lot of decent well made points.

Though I better post here again seeing as I've now actually signed the petition
 
signed

I think one of the key points here is:

Why does anybody think that taxing strong beer specifically will have any impact on alcoholics or binge drinkers?

Issues of what exactly causes antisocial behaviour when drunk aside, does anybody seriously think that alcoholics and people out to get drunk won't either find the money from somewhere, drink more lower strength beers, or drink something with less tax on it. When I lived in Hungary for a bit you could see that the pissheads all drank wine as it was cheaper, lovely purple vomit :sick:

Assuming that you want to use taxation as a disincentive to drink alcohol. Wouldn't a simple and fair method to be to tax all alcoholic drinks in direct relation to their abv? That way if you consume more alcohol you are taxed more regardless of your preferred drink, simple and fair. That way one industry and one set of preferences isn't unfairly picked on.

Does anybody know how the tax breaks down for cider, wine, spirits and beer? I am fairly sure the taxation isn't uniform.

350ml of vodka (37.5% abv) at asda is 5.25 while 330ml of Chimay Blue cap is 1.90, so you can buy 2.73 bottles of chimay for the same price. Call it 3, if those 3 bottles were concentrated into one which was was 3 times as strong and you got 1/3 of the volume that would be 1 330ml bottle at 27%abv so you are getting more alcohol for your money per ml in the vodka (and another 20ml) should you be concerned about getting ******. Now obviously the price difference isn't just about tax but still...

One 2l bottle of westons scrumpy at 7.5% is 4.22 while less than 1l of Chimay blue is 5.70. Now the blue cap is a bit stronger but the price difference is massive, you are paying more than twice as much ( 0.575 vs 0.211p per ml) for the Chimay but it is only 1.2 times as strong.

As a measure for reducing how much people drink it just doesn't add up.

edit to get my maths straight
 
Well he seems to be saying something similar to what I was. It is hard to know without the detail on how the taxation breaks down. He quotes a figure for all cider under 7.5% and another for beer at 7.5%. This seems like an unfair comparisson potentially, depending on how the tax breaks down. The tax for wine and alcopops is higher per 100l but of course wine is typically stronger than beer, alcopops I'm not so sure about as I never touch them. The same pattern can be seen in spirits which must have a much higher average abv than beers. To be honest all those figures make me a touch distrustful of the piece they are very hard to pick apart. If he is making a cost/benefit argument then we need to know how much each costs to manufacture per 100l.

I really think that the fair way to do it is proportional to abv, it is simple fair and transparent. We have the technology to do the sums these days (voulme x abv x tax rate) isn't exactly hard to figure out. It also sidesteps that bizarre cut off which says that a beer at 7.4% is apparently hugely different from one at 7.6% in terms of how drunk it will get you.

Similarly the different tax bands for different engine sizes baffles me. If the issue is fuel consumption then why not just levy all the tax on the fuel, not the engine. That way if you use a lot of fuel you pay more regardless of what kind of car you have. A bigger engine will consume more fuel and therefore pay more in tax. Why complicate things.

Wine at under 5.5% is a wierd one to quote, I don't think I've ever seen wine in that range other than alcohol free ones.

edit to correct a typo
 
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