dry hopping darker ales

[Braufather]

Is there any point?

i find it take at least 3 months for these beers and their complex malt backbone to develop into peak flavour, by which time any aroma will be long gone. Thinking maybe just chuck more in the whirlpool instead. ( ive have another 5am saint clone planned and that uses crazy amount of dry hops)

Thoughts?

 

[Slid]

I doubt there is much to be gained from a big whirlpool of expensive hops in a 3 month old dark beer.
But it is your money.
If I wanted to experiment, I would blend various proportions of a complex malty beer with an over hopped pale ale and decide on what you want to aim for.
You could age the dark beer in a Carboy and blend with fresh, hoppy beer, bottle and drink when carbonated?

 

[The Baron]

I would do the same as Slid with aged beer, age it first even in a corny then hop a week or 2 before you want to drink it.
That way you should get the best of both but do not forget you will need to drink it within a few weeks of hopping so I would be careful of doing it with a high ABV beer as it will not be easy to drink a full batch of High ABV beer on your own

 

[Braufather]

it will not be easy to drink a full batch of High ABV beer on your own

sounds like a challenge!

 

[Braufather]

my only concern with adding hops ( we talking about 150g) to a 3 month old brew is oxygen ingress. Is that why you suggest drinking it quickly out of interest?

 

[The Baron]

No the reason I said to drink it reasonably quick is for the same initial reason of hop fade.
Re oxidisation I am going to give you my opinion only as many will say that you can not do it without risk which I agree with but if you take care the risk is minimal.
People have been dry hopping for many years before the newer ideas came in with no problem so I would keg the beer with co2 over it for whatever length of time you want to age it then just dry hop in a bag or hop tube carefully and quickly you can always squirt some co2 in when you open it up to pacify yourself and purge again once the lid is back on same when you remove the dry hop.
I have never had a oxidised beer in all my years of brewing and dry hopping so its up to you, there is too much scare mongering about this issue, pressure transfers are definitely the absolute especially if it is a NEIPA but not at all essential with good practice

 

[DavidDetroit]

If hops are a preservative, as I've read, it seems ironic that there is so much attention to freshness in an abundantly hopped batch.
I suppose the goal is to keep the preservative preserved.
Just having fun here.

 

[Braufather]

No the reason I said to drink it reasonably quick is for the same initial reason of hop fade.
Re oxidisation I am going to give you my opinion only as many will say that you can not do it without risk which I agree with but if you take care the risk is minimal.
People have been dry hopping for many years before the newer ideas came in with no problem so I would keg the beer with co2 over it for whatever length of time you want to age it then just dry hop in a bag or hop tube carefully and quickly you can always squirt some co2 in when you open it up to pacify yourself and purge again once the lid is back on same when you remove the dry hop.
I have never had a oxidised beer in all my years of brewing and dry hopping so its up to you, there is too much scare mongering about this issue, pressure transfers are definitely the absolute especially if it is a NEIPA but not at all essential with good practice

I used to dry hop late on all beers sometimes after 2 or 3 weeks in keg but found since i started dry hopping and kegging much earlier my beers have become cleaner, but thats mainly pales. i guess as you say i can still transfer, purge but dry hop later ( after 2 months say) and purge again then carb.

 

[The Baron]

You will get what you are looking for with that a aged beer and fresh dry hop
Ps draw a pint before the dry hop to taste for the difference in Dry hopped versus non Dry Hopped

 

[peebee]

Is there any point? ...

Sam Saint, Saint Samuel, or 5AM Saint, never figured what they're going on about. But it is, and has been for many years, my favourite of my tried published Brewdog recipes. Actually, the only Brewdog recipe I bother to make these days. The last one (the sixth), brewed in June 2021, kept me going until November though there were other creations to distract me last year. So certainly aged! "Lychee" dominates the hop flavours, though by the end it was, perhaps, getting a bit tired "hoppy-wise".

You did say darker; it's not particularly dark in my book (the recipe says 60EBC! That would be dark but it's more like 30EBC), and not "bitter" by Brewdog standards.

I stick fairly close to the recipe but fiddle with the quantities to get the targets (OG 1.050 and a moderate 30 IBU). It still needs about 3x the boil hops to get 30 IBU; their recipes never meet their own targets. But all the "end" hops were translated as "steep" hops (30-40 minutes at 85°C ± 5°C) and all the dry hops get stuffed into the fermenter after fermentation (a lot less hassle). Kegged 2 weeks after starting making it (from fermenter straight to keg) with no farting about with CO2 transfers (though I always purge the headspace before sealing).

"BBC" pelleted hops mainly 'cos they have keeping qualities miles better than ordinary American hop offerings. The Amarillo hops are kept as "whole" to provide some filtering capability (Amarillo have much better storage capabilities compared to the "C" hops).

So, I can't suggest steep or dry hop, 'cos I do both anyway! But maybe you can take away something from my gabbling?

 

[Braufather]

That’s good to know. First Time I did it it was the Brew dog official all grain pack and I came out great after about 3 months. Didn’t taste anything like the commercial beer( big fan) but had a chewy, nutty richness that was lovely.

second attempt I ordered the stuff myself as a self build recipe and it wasn’t great. so this will be attempt 3! I always have to up the grain bill by 10 per cent as well.

 

[Braufather]

BBC" pelleted hops mainly 'cos they have keeping qualities miles better than ordinary American hop offerings. The Amarillo hops are kept as "whole" to provide some filtering capability (Amarillo have much better storage capabilities compared to the "C" hops).

Have not tried those yet , ive had good results dry hopping with the lupomax hops( Citra and equanot) the couple of times of used them but there is a limited choice of hop varieties

With the BBC is the AA the same as regular pellets and you just getter better aroma and flavour? or are they concentrated so you have use less in boil to hit same AA?

Also thinking of simplifying the hop schedule as i will be buying in 100g- any thoughts here? I make you the 5am expert!


edit - just found this thread of yours- gonna read through that now!
https://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/threads/bbc-pure-hop-pellets.80858/