Diluting a High Gravity Beer

[bones]

Hi Guys,

If i was to make a high gravity brew say 1070..

How much water can i dilute by with out spoiling the brew?

If i dilute too much what will happen?

Can i dilute with water treated with campaden table?

Or should i use boiled water?

i intend to add the water to the cooled wort prior to pitching with yeast.

:

 

[unclepumble]

The problem with adding water to a finished brew is oxidisation by the free oxygen suspended in the water.

Therefore if you can get hold of some de aerated liqour, (water that has had the free oxygen knocked out of it), then you can liquor back as much as you want, water is de aerated by treating it with nitrogen gas, and is not really an easy thing to do at home.

You could in theory, put an air stone connected to a gas bottle of nitrogen in the bottom of a sterilised FV full of water and run an amount of nitrogen through the water, a couple of minutes worth should do it.

However without an oxygen analyser its a bit hit and miss, as using to much nitrogen will knock all the suspended CO2 out of your brew, when you back liquor.

Good luck

UP

 

[garwatts]

The problem with adding water to a finished brew is oxidisation by the free oxygen suspended in the water.

Therefore if you can get hold of some de aerated liqour, (water that has had the free oxygen knocked out of it), then you can liquor back as much as you want, water is de aerated by treating it with nitrogen gas, and is not really an easy thing to do at home.

You could in theory, put an air stone connected to a gas bottle of nitrogen in the bottom of a sterilised FV full of water and run an amount of nitrogen through the water, a couple of minutes worth should do it.

However without an oxygen analyser its a bit hit and miss, as using to much nitrogen will knock all the suspended CO2 out of your brew, when you back liquor.UP

Err.... I think you're correct in what you say Shane, but bones said

i intend to add the water to the cooled wort prior to pitching with yeast.

and at that stage oxygen is essential for the yeast

:

 

[unclepumble]

The problem with adding water to a finished brew is oxidisation by the free oxygen suspended in the water.

Therefore if you can get hold of some de aerated liqour, (water that has had the free oxygen knocked out of it), then you can liquor back as much as you want, water is de aerated by treating it with nitrogen gas, and is not really an easy thing to do at home.

You could in theory, put an air stone connected to a gas bottle of nitrogen in the bottom of a sterilised FV full of water and run an amount of nitrogen through the water, a couple of minutes worth should do it.

However without an oxygen analyser its a bit hit and miss, as using to much nitrogen will knock all the suspended CO2 out of your brew, when you back liquor.UP

Err.... I think you're correct in what you say Shane, but bones said

i intend to add the water to the cooled wort prior to pitching with yeast.

and at that stage oxygen is essential for the yeast

:

Sorry must have been speed reading, and my brain missed the last line, I had just woken up from my slumber in front of the TV!

You can back liquor with tap water, usually with no noticeable effect, it is however preferable to add water that has been de-chlorinated with campden, or boiled.

Adding water will directly effect body and colour, therefore the more water you add the thinner tasting and liqhter colour your finished beer, Its only the same principle as a glass of orange squash.

I Take it you want to make up to 25ltrs after loosing a few ltrs in the boil, adding 2-3 ltrs won't make much difference, My best advice is to place the hydrometer in the pre-pitched wort, and add de-chlorinated water to your desired gravity.

UP

 

[evanvine]

Bones, if your tap water tastes ok to you just add it as it is.
You are past the mashing stage so chlorines no longer matter.
For many years I only had a boiler that could manage 5 gall brews.
10 gals can be achieved by doubling the grain and then adding 50% water or to what ever gravity you want.

 

[Aleman]

You are past the mashing stage so chlorine no longer matters.

Not correct I'm afraid, the wort contains polyphenols, tannins and prototannins (more complex polyphenols) that any chlorine will react with to form TCP . . .The taste threshold for TCP is in the order of 1 to 2 parts per billion, so if you water has 3ppm chlorine and you add 3L you are adding 9000ppb of chlorine in 23L that's 391ppb chlorine . . . which will take you well above the taste threshold of TCP when it reacts.

Brewing may be a craft, but knowing some of the science behind what's going on is helpful and often stops you spouting the wrong advice

 

[evanvine]

You are no doubt perfectly correct AM, but empirically I found it didn't make a jot of difference.
The beer still tasted and matured ok.

 

[jamesb]

You are no doubt perfectly correct AM, but empirically I found it didn't make a jot of difference.
The beer still tasted and matured ok.

Well everybody's water is different. I can get away with it here, but there's no way I could get away with it in another part of the county - the water is far too heavily chlorinated.

Remember differences in your taste buds too, I seem to be very sensitive to phenolic tastes.

 

[evanvine]

I don't brew anywhere else, but at home JB.
This makes it very subjective, so I can only comment on my own findings.
I wonder if this is a basic cause in differences of opinion?

 

[jamesb]

I don't brew anywhere else, but at home JB.

That's my point, it might work for you, but it might not work for anyone else.

 

[evanvine]

That's my point, it might work for you, but it might not work for anyone else.

I whole heartedly agree with you!
Isn't the point of the Forum to discuss what you do and what results you get from doing it?
Maybe someone else will think, that's a good idea, I'll try it!
I am all for experimenting with different ideas, they don't all work for me.

 

[unclepumble]

Well everybody's water is different. I can get away with it here, but there's no way I could get away with it in another part of the county - the water is far too heavily chlorinated.

I do need to de-chlorinate my water as on certain days my ringtons tea can have a real TCP flavor.

Another thing I would consider if you live in parts of london, which to me would be a higher consideration than TCP flavours, are the high levels of estrogen in the water, I read somewhere that some drinking water in london could have been consumed and repurified by up to 5 people before you get it out of the tap, and some blokes have grown ****s through drinking large amounts of tap water in this area.

Shoot me if this is wrong, I read it a good few years ago.

UP

 

[Tony]

consumed and repurified by up to 5 people before you get it out of the tap, and some blokes have grown ****s through drinking large amounts of tap water in this area.

UP

I heard up to 7 people.

Now .. growing ****s may be a problem when you're trying to look like a bloke walking along in a tight tee shirt or on a beach, but just imagine the fun you can have at home!

Hold on .. I live in London :cry:

Does boiling neutralise estrogen?

 

[bones]

Thanks everybody for your advice.

Heres my point i think :wha:

I would like to be able to produce batches in the region of 22 gallon.

Using a 100L boiler and a grain bill in the region of 20kg i guess my gravity will be 1065ish (not calculated i tend to guess some what).

With loses from hops and stuff ..

I will make up to 22 gallons with water

The point made about thinning out the beer... i only want to produce a beer in the region of 4-4.3%

My therory is double up on grain and hops as used in my 11gallon brews; then boil with 100L boiler and then dilute to my required OG before pitching yeast.

It seems pretreated water with campaden table would do the job.

Thanks again for your in put Guys :