Dark Sours

[jceg316]

I'm really into my sour beers and I'm also into dark beers like stouts and porters. I've never seen a black sour though, I can make one but am wondering if there is a reason for this?

 

[strange-steve]

I had a sour stout once and it didn't work for me, I don't think sourness and bitterness from roasted grains go well together personally.

 

[Sadfield]

I agree with Strange-steve in that sourness and bitterness combined doesn't really work, whether it is bitterness from hops or roast malt. However, I have had a few dark sours that were really nice that didn't have any roasty bitterness, presumably from using a dehusked dark malt like Carafa Special. Chorlton Brewing Dark Matter Gose being a fine example. The Belgians do some great examples too, De Dolle Oebier, Rodenbach and Duchess De Bourgogne and I recall a Stout/Lambic blend by La Rulle and Tilquin.

 

[stigman]

+1 for the la rulles tilquin lambic stout blend. I had this at the weekend while I took my lad out for a drink,

and really enjoyed it.

COMMERCIAL DESCRIPTION
Beer of mixed fermentation, the Stout Rullquin is obtained from a blending of 7/8 of Rulles Brune (Stout de Gaume) and 1/8 of a blend of 1 year old lambics, which has matured for 8 months on oak barrels. Unfiltered and unpasteurized, this beer is refermented for 6 months in the bottle. Ingredients : water, malt, wheat, hops, sugar, inverted sugar, yeast.

 

[MickDundee]

+1 for the la rulles tilquin lambic stout blend. I had this at the weekend while I took my lad out for a drink, View attachment 12345 and really enjoyed it.

He looks like he enjoyed it a little too much!

 

[mabrungard]

Roastiness, acidity, and hop bittering are all used to balance the sweetness of malt. If you want to create a dark sour, you would need to rebalance those sweetness counters to produce an acceptable drink. Since bittering is often very minor in most sours, that leaves roast reduction as the only option. A very fine hand is required to find that balance.

 

[stigman]

He looks like he enjoyed it a little too much!

Yeah he's a bit of a light weight, two DIPA'S and he's had enough.:no:

 

[Sadfield]

Cafe Beermoth next to the fridges?

 

[stigman]

Cafe Beermoth next to the fridges?

You should be a detective sadfield. Spot on mate.

 

[strange-steve]

If the "dark" aspect is more fruity than roasty then it definitely works, like the Rodenbach mentioned above (particularly the Grand Cru) which has a sort of cranberry in balsamic vinegar flavour, or the Duchess De Bourgogne which to me, is like a fruit dipped in chocolate type flavour.

 

[jceg316]

Sounds like it's not a good idea to mix at this stage for me. I like my stouts filled with coffee, chocolate, roastiness and those sorts of flavours wouldn't really go well with a sour flavour unless I find a really good balance. TBH my stout recipes are about getting the most flavour from some of the ingredients as opposed to blending subtle flavours. One day I'll come back to this but there are other beers I want to make.

Thanks for your help.

 

[IainM]

As mentioned, balance. Didn't Guinness formally sour a portion of their beer then mix it back with the rest to give it it's subtle tartness? I guess this worked because it isn't a full-on roast monster.

 

[serum]

The ones I've had miss out the roastiness and I think that's key to it.

There's a Swiss beer called Abbaye De Saint Bon Chien (probably spelled wrong!) which is a very dark beer with some sourness. Liefmans Goudenband is quite dark as well.

 

[jceg316]

The ones I've had miss out the roastiness and I think that's key to it.

There's a Swiss beer called Abbaye De Saint Bon Chien (probably spelled wrong!) which is a very dark beer with some sourness. Liefmans Goudenband is quite dark as well.

Abbey of Good Dog? That's definitely what I would call my abbey if I had one!

 

[serum]

Abbey of Good Dog? That's definitely what I would call my abbey if I had one!

I know, I'm not sure what the story is with that name! Nice beer though. Took a few goes for me to get into it. It's 11% or so with tons of flavours going on. Only seen it in Belgium and France though.