Constant Ruined Brews - Oxidised?

[Rodcx500z]

Could be caused by not using enough yeast, you say in an earlier post you use a teaspoon of yeast is that enough for your brew

 

[Brew_DD2]

I had the same problem for ages and nearly jacked brewing in. My issue was so simple I the end. If I left my beer on the trub for longer than two weeks then the beer would develop those horrible sickly sweet oxidised characteristics very quickly. I tweaked absolutely all of my process until I tried to bottle and keg the beer after 10 days. Result... No more issues with oxidised beer. Remember getting the idea after reading an article about yeast cakes giving off acetaldehyde and other off-flavour precursors when in prolonged contact with beer.

I'm not saying it'll solve your issue, but it's got to be worth a try.

Do you keep those clear bottles in a dark place?

 

[Devlin]

Thanks Brew_DD2. Happy to also give that a try. Do you tend to use a particular yeast, say for IPAs? Also, is 10 days the absolute longest, so perhaps you bottle after fewer days?

@Rodcx500z

I have no reason to believe I am under pitching. The fermentation process always seems quite healthy and active. The temp inside does jump during fermentation and this is where I struggle to maintain a consistent temperature. However, I would have thought the higher temperature would manifest itself through higher diacetyl production

 

[Eight Ace]

Hello!

Fermentation temp is definitely something to keep an eye on as mentioned, but it doesn't sound like it's the issue as you say it seems to smell decent after fermentation. My last batch was hitting 25+ due to the high temps and it picked up a really harsh taste. But I could smell it too!

The main thing from your post was your use of tap water. Do you treat or boil it at all before use? If not I'm wondering if that's possibly to blame.

The other thing you haven't mentioned is how you sterilise your bottles. I've had batches where the beer goes wrong after bottling and part of it may have been down to sterilising with Milton and not rinsing afterwards. What you you sterilise with?

Hope this helps!

 

[Devlin]

Hi Eight Ace

I have used Milton before, I can’t deny it. But sure I rinsed thoroughly. Perhaps not enough. I bought some no rinse steriliser from an online home brew store. I’ll dig it out tomorrow. Again, happy to maybe try out something different.

I don’t treat my tap water. But let’s say the tap water was a little iffy - I’d have thought the boil would kill off any nasties in the water? At least enough to ward off the beer demon that is haunting me.

 

[Eight Ace]

If you're boiling the water before use and rinsing after using Milton, then it doesn't sound like either would the cause of your problems.

Keep on going though

 

[Nicks90]

I'm still going to put my money on oxidisation.
It's a classic sign, goin dark over time and tasting like sh#te after a few weeks.
Try using some coke bottles as a control next brew and see if those change in the same way.

 

[simon12]

Just a few thoughts as I don't know. You are using clear bottles are they kept out of sunlight? Did you give the beer a taste before bottling just to check what it tasted like then if not try it next time. If you don't get to the bottom of it I suggest next time get a small bottle of sparkling water any empty it then fill it without any sterilising as a control to rule out the bottles not being right.

 

[PhilBrew]

Hi Devlin

I guess butterscotch might be a good way of describing the taste.

...

However, I would have thought the higher temperature would manifest itself through higher diacetyl production

... but, diacetyl tastes of butterscotch

Have a read through the list of common beer off-flavours there (link) and think about which you think may be showing up in your beers ... bearing in mind, it's not unheard of for a beer to have multiple problems, all at once

Cheers, PhilB

 

[Brew_DD2]

Thanks Brew_DD2. Happy to also give that a try. Do you tend to use a particular yeast, say for IPAs? Also, is 10 days the absolute longest, so perhaps you bottle after fewer days?

I tried a variety of different yeasts and had the same issue. Make sure you have hit your final gravity. Should not be an issue inside 10 days, especially if you are fermenting a bit warmer. I genuinely couldn't believe that was the cause of my problem, especially as you very rarely see it discussed as a potential problem.

I was having the same issue. Sickly sweet taste regardless of style, and darkening of the beer. Only presented itself at or after bottling. Beer always smelt and tasted great earlier in the process.

 

[Devlin]

Awesome, this was great. I’ll be putting these suggestions to use on the next brew and see what I uncover. Worst case I always have my local beer shop to fall back on, they have a mega selection so never far away from good beer.

 

[Jakeyboi]

It looks like your not filling your bottles enough, it’s probably not the main cause, but you want the beer line to be at the narrowest part I.e the neck so there’s less contact with air. Also when you bottle is there still plenty of co2 dissolved in your beer? When I used to bottle there would always be some co2 fizzing out of the liquid, which would purge the headspace in the bottle of any oxygen. My guess that your small batches at warm temp would struggle to hold onto any co2, and therefor can’t release during the agitation of the bottling process.

If you take gravity readings you will notice that the airlock still bubbles long after FG is reached. This is the dissolved co2 coming out of the liquid from fermentation. Try bottling after a week, (providing fg is stable), and letting it condition longer in the bottle.

Ive had pale ale oxidise and it was rank, it was a beautiful pale colour with plenty of hop flavour and aroma, I couldn’t believe it was the same beer only a week later. It went very dark, lost all hop flavour and I can only describe what was left as a stale malty taste. I keg my beers and I had forgot to purge the keg with co2, and the siphon hose was a bit short so there was a bit of splashing.

I am making a batch of beer as a wedding gift, and I plan to bottle. I am going to purge each bottle with co2 before filling, just because I know realise how detrimental oxygen is to the beer, and my kegged beer is far superior to anything I ever bottled.

Keep going I’m sure you will get the the bottom of it.

Jake

 

[uDicko]

So far then (it would be really good to see what you do vs what works) the suggestions are:

• Try PET bottles
• Try dark bottles
• Keep bottles in dark place
• Fill all the way to the top of the bottle with wand inside leaving minimal headspace
• Try and keep fermentation temperature low 18-21
• Keep the lid on when cooling, minimise oxygen exposure on cold side
• Try ensuring good yeast pitch (probably not an issue with your smaller batches)
• Try different yeasts

My money is on your cooling process :) seems to be the only part that has max oxygen exposure on the cold side. Oxidisation from my own experience destroys a beer within 2 - 3 weeks of exposure, less depending on the grainbill.

 

[Cwrw666]

I tried a bottling wand for a while but was never happy with the huge headspace it left so used to put some beer in a jug and top up the bottles with it to leave about 1 cm headspace.
Now I just fill the bottles straight from the tap which I find quicker and easier than the bottle wand. Plus you never have to worry about the bottom of the wand coming apart and having beer overflowing everywhere!

 

[Devlin]

Cheers uDicko

A good summary there. Next batch will definitely be experimental in nature.

Not sure why I had it in my mind you should never cover the pot when cooling but now having read Chapter 7 on howtobrew.com ‘Cooling the wort’ it does recommend to keep the lid on as oxygen exposure during this period is heightened. Will pay particular attention to this area next time.

 

[connor7932]

["Devlin, post: (all kept in a cool, dark place)-------
after bottling,it needs a fermenting temp for 3-4 days to convert the priming sugar.-then cool.
if put strait in a fridge,yeast will sleep and you have sweet beer with a haze.
try the bottles at room temp for 3-4 days,it might clear and produce C,O,2

 

[steve denholm]

Hi Devlin, are your brews turning reddish/brown? I had a couple of brews that I cocked up at bottling and they turned sort of reddish and the flavour changed; I cleaned up my bottling method a bit, one of the main things is using PET beer bottles and squeezing the bottle until the beer was right at the lid then capping (the bottles return to normal shape when the carb up).

It was very frustrating though!!

 

[HarryFlatters]

When you open the bottle, is there any fizz or psshhht of gas escaping? I've only scanned the thread, but I don't recall any mention of if your beer has actually carbonated.

 

[foxbat]

When you open the bottle, is there any fizz or psshhht of gas escaping? I've only scanned the thread, but I don't recall any mention of if your beer has actually carbonated.

Good question. If the caps aren't sealing then that's the problem right there.

 

[Rodcx500z]

Good question. If the caps aren't sealing then that's the problem right there.

Hi Foxbat, I said that right at the start of this thread swing tops could not be airtight or fastened down properly.