Cider -Bottle carbonating

[Fraz]

Hi all,

Recently joined the forum as I am need of some sound advice regarding my homebrew cider and feel a little out of my depth.

To put you in the picture, during September 2018 I made 4 gallons of cider from picked apples, using the guidance of Whittenham Hill cider pages.
First fermentaion was 9 days before transferring off the lees to 4 indiviudual gallon demijohns.

The juice had a starting SG of 1.045 and finished at 1.004 a couple of weeks later (5.5% by estimate). I left the cider in the demijohns for 6 months to condition and bottled 3 gallons a couple of days ago(10/03/19).

From trawling online info' and using priming calculators I made a syrup of 17g table sugar and pitched this into each of the demijohns prior to racking into individual bottles, hoping to make caronated cider.

As a test, I have demijohn at room temperature to observe any changes.....As of yet, I have seen no indication of fermentation. I fear that the yeast contained within may be long dead and that I have wasted my time in bottling some of it.

My questions....

1) Having left the cider for 6 months with all fermentation long ceased - Is this too long to add sugar and then bottle to create sparkling cider? Should I have done this much sooner before fermentaton ended or is this irrelevant?

2) Is 17g of table sugar to 1 gallon of cider really enough to promote noticable carbonation? - It seems very little. I'd envisaged adding 1 tsp per bottle like with beers etc.

3) My cider is stored under the stairs which allows a stable temperature of 13 to 15'C. Is this warm enough to allow for fermentation with the priming sugar I have added?

4) I had hoped to monitor the carbonation by opening bottles over the coming weeks and then pasteurising when at a suitable level. If no carbonation occurs am I correct in saying all I've done is sweeten my still cider slightly?

If there is no indication of change from the gallon I have, what should I do? I was under the impression that I could theoretically keep adding sugar to the cider which would keep making it stronger until the alcohol was so high it killed the yeast? HELP!

 

[freester]

Yes it is very likely all the yeast has died if it has been sat since October clearing. Something similar happened to me in my first year of cider making.

Easy fix is to add a pinch of yeast into the bottle with the cider and priming sugar. I actually do this all the time for my carbonated batches because I rarely bottle my cider within a couple of weeks of fermentation.

A vague attempt to answer your questions:

1) yes 6 months is too long. Either bottle within a couple of weeks of fermentation finishing or as I said above add a pinch of yeast when bottling.
2) Not sure - I'm never that precise but I add 2 level measuring tsp per litre.
3) 13-15 deg is probably OK. I ferment in the garage but bring bottles into the house to carbonate which is probably nearer 18-20
4) Yes slightly sweeter but I'd challenge you to taste the difference.

Hope this helps

 

[Fraz]

Freester,

Thanks for the reply, much appreciated!

So, 17 grams is 4 tsp of sugar - In comparison to what you add to yours, I've used less than half the amount of sugar.

Would it be suitable to open each bottle, add a pinch of yeast and extra sugar before quickly recapping or is it too late for any more messing about?

This also makes me wonder....If the yeasts in my cider are now all dead, can I sweeten and bottle to my hearts content without any fear of fermentation and explosions?

 

[freester]

So, 17 grams is 4 tsp of sugar - In comparison to what you add to yours, I've used less than half the amount of sugar.

Yes - but it should be slightly sparkling.

Would it be suitable to open each bottle, add a pinch of yeast and extra sugar before quickly recapping or is it too late for any more messing about?

I guess this depends on your attitude to risk. It would probably be OK (having never done it myself). If I was desperate for sparkling I probably would.

This also makes me wonder....If the yeasts in my cider are now all dead, can I sweeten and bottle to my hearts content without any fear of fermentation and explosions?

That is the million dollar question. I'm not sure anyone would recommend that without pasteurising!

 

[MattH1973]

Not much add to freesters expertise but a couplem of quick points
- 13 to 15 degrees is definitely OK for fermentation (using suitable cider or champagne yeast). My cellar is around 13 and this has to date always been warm enough.
- i would risk re-opening the bottles to add a pinch of yeast, as that will quickly produce CO2 which will protect the cider. Indeed, this is probably less risky then leaving still cider in the bottles for weeks (where there is little or no CO2). You can reduce the risk by putting them somewhere particularly warm (airing cupboard) to get the carbonation started asap.
- the rule of thumb i use is if the demijon has cleared, then the yeast is dead and you need to add a pinch. if its still cloudy then you may well be OK without it.

 

[freester]

- i would risk re-opening the bottles to add a pinch of yeast, as that will quickly produce CO2 which will protect the cider.

Good point that hadn't occurred to me!

 

[Kybren]

I'm about to try and carbonate some of my cider my gravity is at 1.010 but has finished fermenting do I need to wait till 1 or add a pinch of yeast and not as much sugar

 

[freester]

Mmm. If it's cider with no non-fermentable sugars I'd be worried 1.010 is a tad high. Stuck or at least need to wait a little longer. I'll often bottle / carbonate at 1.002-4 but only if I've left it a good few weeks and it's stayed at the same FG.

 

[Kybren]

Thanks ill leave it a bit longer see how it goes

 

[Derekmr]

Not much add to freesters expertise but a couplem of quick points
- 13 to 15 degrees is definitely OK for fermentation (using suitable cider or champagne yeast). My cellar is around 13 and this has to date always been warm enough.
- i would risk re-opening the bottles to add a pinch of yeast, as that will quickly produce CO2 which will protect the cider. Indeed, this is probably less risky then leaving still cider in the bottles for weeks (where there is little or no CO2). You can reduce the risk by putting them somewhere particularly warm (airing cupboard) to get the carbonation started asap.
- the rule of thumb i use is if the demijon has cleared, then the yeast is dead and you need to add a pinch. if its still cloudy then you may well be OK without it.

Surely if its cleared then it may be all sugars have gone but there are still yeasts there?

 

[MattH1973]

Surely if its cleared then it may be all sugars have gone but there are still yeasts there?

My understanding is that the yeast can only live whilst it is chewing through the sugar, and shortly after. When it clears I think what is happening is that all the sugar that can be fermented has beem fermented, and at that point the yeast starts to die. the clearer it is, then the more dead the yeast.