Beginner Perry, what to do with sediment

[Compact]

I bought a house with a Pear and Apple tree.
Did some Googling, collected the pears (try them first as not too bothered if it goes wrong)
Mash with pole and bucket
Press with home made car jack and netting
Poured into bottle
Campden tablet.

So what next, there is a lot of sediment.
Should I wait to settle and siphon into a 2nd bottle?
Or filter it through?
Or just go ahead with dropping some yeast in.

p.s. I sterilized as much as I could

Thanks

Not sure why the image isn't showing
And can't put it in the post due to the below
"Your post looks too spamy for a new user, please remove off-site URLs." Argghhhhhh really, flickr spammy?

 

[Compact]

The URL is Flickr dut cim slash photos slash 98617255@N02 slash 9985100753

 

[bobsbeer]

Just had a look at your code. I think it may be because the target is not an image file. I think it needs .jpg etc at the end for the forum code to recognise the image. Martin may know better but he's away at present.

 

[Compact]

Good point, the Flickr share wasn't easy to spot.
Thanks

Here's the photo of the murky brew

 

[bobsbeer]

Now I can see it, I would add your yeast now and let it ferment out. The trub will settle out once fermentation dies down, then you can rack it into a clean DJ and top up.

 

[oldbloke]

Yeh, there could be all kinds of useful stuff in that sediment, the yeast will find anything good. Let it run for a while before thinking of losing that.

 

[Compact]

Great
Have dropped a Campden Tablet in
24hrs later Yeast and Pectolase tablet.

Also started on the Apple Cider (on the right).

You mention I can top it up, as the I've run out of Pears, is it ok with such a large gap of air air in the top of the jar?

 

[Crastney]

the one on the left should be ok, initial fermentation might be quite strong, so the one on the right is probably a bit too near the top (if it's only just started), and you'll have apple bubbles blowing everywhere. once initial fermentation dies down, you can top up to about a half inch lower than the one on the right is now.

a large airgap whilst initial ferment is ok, as the yeast produce carbon dioxide, which is heavier than air, so sits on top of the liquid, and slowly fills the air gap, expelling air out of the air lock, and then expelling CO2 out of the airlock. later on, when fermentation dies down, the CO2 layer will get less, so you need to be more worried about how much air there is, hence you top up to make the air gap smaller.

 

[Compact]

Cheers

The one of the right hasn't started fermentation, so will make more space.

As I haven't got any Pear juice left for the one on the left, what would you suggest.
Top up with water, or leave as is and it may not be great?

Thanks

 

[histman]

Top with supermarket apple juice not water.

 

[godfrey]

top up with the one from the right :)

 

[Compact]

The one on the right is Apple, the left is Pear.

I've more Apple to press tonight, so could I top the pear up mid fermentation with new apple juice?


Also I've a few bags of blackberries in the freezer I picked, I was thinking of adding a few handfuls to one of the apples, to see how it tastes.
Anyone successfully tried this?

Thanks

 

[graysalchemy]

You have too much apple juice in the right so top up the left one with that from the right. A bit of apple in the pear won't make any difference and what is in the right is going to end up on the floor anyway. :grin: :grin:

 

[Compact]

Topping up question.

If the Pear (on the left) has been fermenting for 3 days, when should I top up from the cider (on the right)?
I've read about keeping air out during fermentation.


Sterilizing Question
Do you have to keep everything sterile form the moment you start mashing and pressing your apples.
Or the point you start fermenting?

i.e. I'm using a wood post wrapped in a plastic bag and a gorilla tub for the mashing. All clean, but not sterilised.

Thanks

 

[Crastney]

If the Pear (on the left) has been fermenting for 3 days, when should I top up from the cider (on the right)?
I've read about keeping air out during fermentation.

as long as you don't leave it open all day, swishing it around, letting air get into it, a few minutes with the lids off will do no harm (there is a layer of CO2 from fermentation which acts as a partial barrier anyway)

Sterilizing Question
Do you have to keep everything sterile form the moment you start mashing and pressing your apples.
Or the point you start fermenting?

i.e. I'm using a wood post wrapped in a plastic bag and a gorilla tub for the mashing. All clean, but not sterilised.

Thanks

onwards from the DJ that you put the juice into should be sterile. You are adding camden/potasium sorbate after that, to kill off any nasties, then leave for 24 hours before pitching yeast.
the plastic bag will probably split fairly soon - the gorilla tub should be very clean, but not necessarily sterilised if you don't want to (but I probably would) - no point in risking mashing the apples into a dirty container is there.

 

[Compact]

Hi All
Thanks for all the useful tips

On to the final hurdle

From the below, Left to Right
A - Pear, B - Apple: Both Yeast added 7 days ago, as you can see all settling down
C, D, E - Apple: Yeast added 4 days ago, seems to be going strong
F - Apple/Pear: Mashed yesterday Campden tablet in

What next
Bottling?

Use a slim plastic tube to siphon into smaller bottles (how do you stop sediment going)?
If so I know plastic lemonade are good, but thinking of some Grolsh types, as they look fancy and it's the first bottling

Where do you suggest I can get them, Ikea sell some, are they strong enough?
Once I've put in sterlised bottles, should I fill to the top? How long would they last?
Is there anything I can add at this stage to make interesting taste i.e. ginger, raspberries, or is it too late

Finally what do you do with the sediments anything fun?

Thanks

 

[Crastney]

...
What next
Bottling?

Use a slim plastic tube to siphon into smaller bottles (how do you stop sediment going)?
If so I know plastic lemonade are good, but thinking of some Grolsh types, as they look fancy and it's the first bottling

Where do you suggest I can get them, Ikea sell some, are they strong enough?
Once I've put in sterlised bottles, should I fill to the top? How long would they last?
Is there anything I can add at this stage to make interesting taste i.e. ginger, raspberries, or is it too late

Finally what do you do with the sediments anything fun?

Thanks

You can use plastic tube from B&Q - thin diameter = slow flow, thicker diameter = fast flow - you might want larger tubing for racking off the sediment from one DJ to another clean one, and thinner for bottling (else you might end up spilling lots if it's coming out too fast).

First wait till fermentation has finished - maybe two more weeks for the first ones, then rack to another DJ leaving the sediment behind, and top up with more juice or boiled water. Then leave to clear for at least two weeks, then rack again to another DJ to leave behind the last layer of sediment. Then bottle.

You can get a device for racking (transfer liquid from one DJ to another, whilst leaving sediment behind) - this is basically a rigid plastic tube attached to your tubing, with a cap on the bottom, it can be lowered into the DJ, and if you clip it somehow to the neck of the DJ, the bottom of the tube is above the layer of lees, so you don’t transfer any sediment.

You can also get a ‘little bottler’ which is a tubing system which only lets liquid through when it’s in the bottle (not sure how it works, but people on here tend to like it) – personally I use a tube that I can stick my finger of the end of, and my bottles are lined up ready with lids off, and I just go from one to the next, stopping the flow with my finger between each one.

Level of liquid in bottles needs to be near the top but leave some air space – too much and you have a small risk of spoilage due to oxygen, to little, and CO2 pressure won’t build up enough if you’re making fizzy.

If you’re going fizzy then any bottle that’s previously taken pressure (2 litre coke bottles, champagne bottles, glass bottles with crown caps) – if you’re going with dry, still cider, then you’ll kill of the yeast, and have no need for pressure able bottles, so 1 litre squash bottles will be fine – either kill the yeast with chemicals, or rack off the yeast enough times to leave none behind, and no sugars left to ferment should be ok too.

Bottles will improve with age for up to a year or two, and maybe longer, and will slowly deteriorate, but still drinkable many years longer (not usually a problem on this forum, the speed some drink).

Flavours should be added before bottling ideally, allowed any extra fermentation to happen, and then taken off the sediment. If you add at the start, all the flavour may go before fermentation finishes, too near the end, and it won’t all ferment out, or you’ll have too much. There are many threads about this.

Sediment can be kept, and used as a yeast starter for your next batch, it's also very nutritious, vull of vitamin B, and can be drank, eaten if you really want to. Otherwise I just stick mine on the compost heap if it's thick enough, or swill down the drain..

Good luck – hope they turn out ok.

p.s. have you thought about bulk ageing, and Malolactic Fermentation?

 

[Compact]

Fantastic, thanks again for a detailed reply.

To confirm I understand, I should leave the cider's in the Demi-Johns for a couple of weeks, before transferring to bottles.


If I want to add flavour, i.e. some blueberries I'd picked and frozen.
Would 1 week after the yeast (i.e. the one of the left) be a good time?
If so would you mash and drop in a few handfuls and leave for the 2nd week?

A quick question, someone mentioned second fermentation, what is this and should I carry it out with any of mine?

Lastly, am I correct, that if I want fizzy cider, I drop a few spoonfuls of sugar in when bottling?


Thanks

 

[oldbloke]

Lastly, am I correct, that if I want fizzy cider, I drop a few spoonfuls of sugar in when bottling?

Up to 1tsp/pint. A full tsp is quite fizzy, half a tsp probably won't be fizzy enough.

 

[Crastney]

traditionally, the way that I've done it is to add all the fruit at the begining, however, having said that, I've never done a 'flavoured' cider (ie cider with other stuff added), and I've recently heard on here that if you add the flavouring fruit later, then the higher alcohol content of the original liquid that you're adding the fruit to will allow more of the fruit flavour to be absorbed into your brew. So in effect you could do the fermentation, then add the fruit for flavour, and it'd add more sugar so fermentation would continue - you'd have to factor in the extra sugars, into the expected abv before you start, so you know how much sugar to add at the begining. Then follow the usual process, ferment on the fruit for three/four days, then strain off the pulp/skins etc, into a clean DJ, top up with water/juice/sugar syrup as required, then finish fermentation, leave to clear, add finings if you want, etc, etc.

Secondary fermentation in wine/cider is really only the continued first fermentation, but off the trub/lees, at a slower rate, and possibly includes malolactic fermentation at a later stage.

hope this helps - glad to be of assistance.