Bag in a Keg.

[Buffers brewery]

Simplest approach I would think would be mimic what the breweries do and carbonate in a corny and do a closed transfer into your bag at the required pressure. Simples

 

[peebee]

Simplest approach I would think would be mimic what the breweries do and carbonate in a corny and do a closed transfer into your bag at the required pressure. Simples

Simple?

I know some of my Corney kegs are only primed for very low pressure (10-12g sugar in 20L, <4 or 5psi), but these sort of beers (not heavily attenuated) are quite capable of kicking off again a few months down the line! The worst I've had got over 60psi before I noticed. 10 or 20psi is not unusual.

The system will need some means of venting some how.

 

[Buffers brewery]

Simple?

I know some of my Corney kegs are only primed for very low pressure (10-12g sugar in 20L, <4 or 5psi), but these sort of beers (not heavily attenuated) are quite capable of kicking off again a few months down the line! The worst I've had got over 60psi before I noticed. 10 or 20psi is not unusual.

The system will need some means of venting some how.

Why you telling me? Tell @foxy . I was "simply" responding to @foxy post regarding his dilemma regarding carbonation. I'm sure he'll appreciate you bringing to his attention the risk of excessive pressure during use. Simply well done

 

[RoomWithABrew]

@foxy
Can you send picture of the connector you are using on the key keg please.

 

[peebee]

Why you telling me? ...

You offered yourself as the sacrificial lamb. I complied and wielded the sickle.

 

[foxy]

Simplest approach I would think would be mimic what the breweries do and carbonate in a corny and do a closed transfer into your bag at the required pressure. Simples

I did mention that I thought of a pressurised transfer but at a couple of degrees, and not knowing the length of time a transfer will take I want to avoid any CO2 dissolving into the beer. The whole idea is to have the beer naturally carbonated at a low cask pressure. If I end up with too much pressure then I am going to have to make a stand to vent it upside down through the spear. I have thought about hanging the keg upside down by the chime but I am pretty that the hot glue onto PET isn’t going to give a good enough bond to hold the weight.

@foxy
Can you send picture of the connector you are using on the key keg please.

Yes I will take some pics today.

 

[Buffers brewery]

I did mention that I thought of a pressurised transfer but at a couple of degrees, and not knowing the length of time a transfer will take I want to avoid any CO2 dissolving into the beer. The whole idea is to have the beer naturally carbonated at a low cask pressure. If I end up with too much pressure then I am going to have to make a stand to vent it upside down through the spear. I have thought about hanging the keg upside down by the chime but I am pretty that the hot glue onto PET isn’t going to give a good enough bond to hold the weight.

Having dosed my fermented beer with sugar solution while still in the bucket (at atmospheric pressure), I do a closed transfer at atmospheric pressure from the fermentation bucket to a pressure barrel (your corny) using gravity. 5 gallons takes 20-25 minutes through 8mm tube with a 50cm head. I use a spundy valve on a corny gas post to control pressure during carbonation.
You could then syphon the carbonated beer into your bag. Obviously this would require a suitable length of beer line with a beer disconnect at one end and an ON/OFF tap at the other with a short length of pipe to connect to your bag connector.
If you want to maintain the CO2 above the carbonated beer in the corny make a couple of mylar balloons with gas disconnects so as soon as the keg pressure is zero, plug the balloon in to maintain flow and gas atmosphere.

FOOTNOTE: I've just read through that and it's the kind of crazy, complicated thing I would do....but may not suit everyone

 

[foxy]

Having dosed my fermented beer with sugar solution while still in the bucket (at atmospheric pressure), I do a closed transfer at atmospheric pressure from the fermentation bucket to a pressure barrel (your corny) using gravity. 5 gallons takes 20-25 minutes through 8mm tube with a 50cm head. I use a spundy valve on a corny gas post to control pressure during carbonation.
You could then syphon the carbonated beer into your bag. Obviously this would require a suitable length of beer line with a beer disconnect at one end and an ON/OFF tap at the other with a short length of pipe to connect to your bag connector.
If you want to maintain the CO2 above the carbonated beer in the corny make a couple of mylar balloons with gas disconnects so as soon as the keg pressure is zero, plug the balloon in to maintain flow and gas atmosphere.

FOOTNOTE: I've just read through that and it's the kind of crazy, complicated thing I would do....but may not suit everyone

I don't think you understand how the King Keg works I will see if I can get the bits and pieces to give you an idea what's involved. I can't syphon int the bag unless I can get a syphon with beer line diameter tubing. The only way of venting is upside down through the spear and liquid post.

 

[RoomWithABrew]

@foxy
I'm currently in Whangarei and will be back to home later tonight. I seem to have two different styles of Keykeg connectors.
The older ones are basically the same as sankey D type and I've fitted the ball lock couplers on for gas and liquid plus removed the non return float in the liquid line and in the gas side. But I have a newer one with a red " tap " on the gas side which when opened allows all the gas out. I couldn't get this type to work like a conventional connector until I fiddled around with the way that red one worked. It would be ideal in your situation because as you fill the bag via the liquid post the gas would just vent out. Hopefully you'd then have the bag full of beer the "keg" empty of gas and the beer could start to carb up. Trouble is getting the pressure outside of the bag to equal the pressure inside the bag when you cant measure the pressure in the bag.
Using a beer engine would just suck the beer out and you wouldn't need to pressurise outside the bag just leave it open to the atmosphere in that space. But you want to go a slightly different way.
I have my thinking hat on.

 

[foxy]

Well the couplers on the King Keg are a choice of A type and D type. I was unsure of the sanitary of the bags in the ones I got out the shop so I got a couple more made up. The Kegs are filled with nitrogen so had to evacuate that to get the cap and bagless spear out,
The bags have been under a vacuum of high pressure so was unsure a gravity fill would open up the bag but it did. I didn't need to apply any pressure so as Buffer said I could have transferred to a secondary and spunded to desired pressure before filling.
That will do with the next one.
Easy to disassemble with a strap wrench and fit a new bag, I grabbed a couple of spare bags they are cheap come ready sanitised just fit start again.
I used the A type coupler and left the gas 'in' port open so it could expel the air in the cavity as the bag filled.
40 minutes to fill with 20 litres.

This is a Key Keg video of filling upside down
Camra approved apparently.
https://www.wishbonebrewery.co.uk/2...y of transfer pump,per the first video above.

 

[Buffers brewery]

…as Buffer said I could have transferred to a secondary and spunded to desired pressure before filling.
That will do with the next one.

Good to hear my suggestion would’ve worked

 

[Darren Jeory]

I wrote some time ago about using a 10 litre keg with a bag inside. Decided to go with the 19 litre bag in a keg. So while cask beers do taste superior the shelf life isn't so good. Yes one can fill the vacuum of a cask with gas from the bottle and prevent air getting in but it's a lot of mucking around.
I have today brewed an Extra Stout which I will be transferring into the bag in the keg to condition adding sugar to the brew to encourage further fermentation.
I have a couple of inline pressure valves one is a $2.00 white plastic one which I doubt will be accurate enough, the other is a factory set valve this one is set to 6 PSI and is spot on but I will get a 5 PSI version so won't have to rely on a gauge. I am hoping after a few weeks conditioning I will be able to draw a cask style beer from the keg with the use of a picnic pump and a stout nozzle on my tap. I will not have any worries about having to finish the cask quickly or playing about with a CO2 bottle.

The cheap one on the left and the factory set on the right.
View attachment 84052
I will put a blow off tube on the keg while conditioning before attaching the inline pressure valve.
View attachment 84054

Please post a pic when you pull a pint off

 

[Darren Jeory]

I wrote some time ago about using a 10 litre keg with a bag inside. Decided to go with the 19 litre bag in a keg. So while cask beers do taste superior the shelf life isn't so good. Yes one can fill the vacuum of a cask with gas from the bottle and prevent air getting in but it's a lot of mucking around.
I have today brewed an Extra Stout which I will be transferring into the bag in the keg to condition adding sugar to the brew to encourage further fermentation.
I have a couple of inline pressure valves one is a $2.00 white plastic one which I doubt will be accurate enough, the other is a factory set valve this one is set to 6 PSI and is spot on but I will get a 5 PSI version so won't have to rely on a gauge. I am hoping after a few weeks conditioning I will be able to draw a cask style beer from the keg with the use of a picnic pump and a stout nozzle on my tap. I will not have any worries about having to finish the cask quickly or playing about with a CO2 bottle.

The cheap one on the left and the factory set on the right.
View attachment 84052
I will put a blow off tube on the keg while conditioning before attaching the inline pressure valve.
View attachment 84054

Also can you link to what equipment you bought? I'm about to go into kegging and am intrigued

 

[foxy]

Please post a pic when you pull a pint off

There is another thread. Cask beer from a keg.