aluminum foil & mash

[gurtpint]

Been thinking of using a layer of aluminum foil at the bottom of my mash kettle to avoid scratching, as I'm going to chuck in some pebbles to reduce deadspace and maintain the temperature. Is it a good idea? Any off-flavours or other nasties that could result from the foil being in touch with the mash for the whole 90 mins?

 

[Tony]

More likely to get off-flavors from the pebbles, especially if they have just come from the beach!

No probs from aluminum!

 

[gurtpint]

Ta Tony! Foil it is then. I gave them pebbles a good scrub and then boiled the lot so I suppose they'll be alright. No fish to be seen at the very least, he he. Will probably boil them for a bit again before doughing in to get them nice and warm.

 

[Tony]

Great way to up the temp!

 

[ano]

There are better ways of reducing deadspace, what's your tun's design?

 

[gurtpint]

Any suggestions would be welcomed with open arms. I mash and boil in the same 30 liter SS kettle with a ball valve tap. Well, erm, I'm going to anyway as this is my first AG brew... I don't have a manifold but a false bottom that's made to fit. There are female threads inside the hole for the tap and I'm going to use these for a hop strainer. If I've understood right using a right kind of manifold could reduce the deadspace due to the siphoning effect but no time for that before Saturday. To be honest I've been thinking of buying a thermo box and converting it into a mash tun, so I'm not keen on making a manifold for the kettle... Just want to try things out with minimal equipment and then decide whether I find it worth it to get a separate tun to save a bit of time and effort... The pebbles seemed the most obvious way to reduce the deadspace (down to some 1,5 liters as opposed to nearly 4) but I haven't been around the block yet so maybe there some other methods worth trying.

 

[rabbie]

Hi,
All you need to get a siphon effect is an elbow on the tap connector and a bit of pipe angled down toward the bottom of the vessel (this will sit underneath your false bottom) and some tubing on the tap outlet which drops below that level into whatever you are collecting in.
Once you've lautered you'll have to empty the grain from the tun anyway, so you could just swap the siphon tube out for the hop strainer and get the boil on.
I did my first couple of brews that way, mash in the boiler, lauter to a FV, empty out the grain, clean the boiler, siphon the wort back over and then start the boil. It adds some time to your brewday but it works. You might want to wrap a sleeping bag or something else insulating around the tun during the mash, or keep an eye on the temperature and top up with hot water if you drop significantly.
Good luck and let us know how it goes :thumb:

 

[Aleman]

Line the boiler with a big square of Voile secured to the top of the boiler to make a bag. . Put the entire volume of liquor at 66C into the boiler. . . Add grain to Bag and leave for 90 minutes at 66C . . . stir . . . and then twist the spare material at the top secure a rope to it and lift the bag out of the boiler allowing the wort to run into the boiler . . . Bring to a boil and continue as normal . . . It's call brewing in a bag. . . . It's not a method I would use, but you can produce some reasonable beer this way with very little equipment and less fiddling about

 

[gurtpint]

Rabbie & Aleman, takk & thanks! Had no idea that's all it takes to get a siphon effect going. There's a hardware store a stone's throw away from my place and I think I'll pay them a visit tomorrow after work. I'm glad if that saves me from having to wash and store them stones. I'll see if they have suitable pieces to make sort of an inverted Z thingy with the elbow + pipe so I could connect my hop strainer that way too and make the most of the siphoning effect after the boil as well. It's not a big of a deal really though, since I can always just tilt the kettle to collect my wort without much waste. Forgot to mention that I've cut a camping mattress down to size for insulation during the mash and I think I'll also ask my trusty sleeping bag for assistance just to be on the safe side. Will keep you posted.

 

[gurtpint]

Right, went ahead and got a 1/2" elbow and another adjoining threaded piece from the hardware store. Now I have tubing running to just about as close as I can get to the kettle bottom. Did the water test - 5 liters in, 2,7 liters out. Thus deadspace = 2,3 liters and I think that's not so bad. However, the flow seemed very slow and it took around 10 minutes to get that 2,7 liters of liquor out. The liquor was also going down the tube in a swirling motion (or more of a trickle) instead of a steady flow, which made me think of possible hot wort aeration. Needless paranoia? I know patience is a virtue but sparging like this might take a good while. Is it normal? Zen and the art of sparging without gnawing your fingernails to the bone? I was thinking that maybe I should have got pieces that were smaller in diameter to get a faster flow. Am I on the right track? The tube connected to the tap outside has a 12mm inner diameter.

 

[rabbie]

All sounds normal to me! You have a liquid seal over the outlet so you aren't drawing air into the system (if there is nothing bubbling in the receiving vessel you have nothing to worry about )
You'll find that you can get a much higher run-off rate once you have the tun full with the mash, filling with 5 litres means you had very little force to drive the liquid out. Palmer gives a suggestion of 1 litre per minute I think. Are you brewing tonight?

 

[gurtpint]

Excellent then, cheers! Well, I really WAS going to brew tomorrow but now we've been promised a nice thunderstorm and I'm not sure if it's a good idea under such circumstances... If it can sour the milk, can it also ruin my beer? I've been thinking about waiting until Sunday but I have other stuff lined up so I'm not sure if I can find the time. Then come next week my work schedule gets in the way and I'd have to wait until the following weekend. Sigh. Frustrating time, as I'd finally want to start getting some first-hand experience. But in case things are looking up for Sunday - would my starter be ready to pitch on Sunday morning if I was to make it (with DME) on Saturday morning? Will 24 hours or so be enough?