All Grain v Extract what would I gain?

[Geoffinthewilds]

Hi All,
Hope your all staying safe and brewing like mad?, now I have my kegerator project all finished its got me thinking of my next step in my home brewing journey. I have been looking at the various machines and think the Robobrew Brewzilla would work for me, if I pull the trigger would I be getting bigger in the 65l in case I upscale my brewing or would the 35l work?, so thats my first question, but dont' want to start a war what would I get extra if I swap to AG v Extract and how does it work out cost wise and only ever seen AG while re searching on Youtube so would be a complete novice, be good to hear all opinions please from this brilliant forum.

 

[dwhite60]

These are only my opinions. Someone will argue every one of my points below.

All grain gives you more flexibility in what you brew. With extract you're using whatever blend the manufacturer used. Uncrushed grain keeps fresher longer than extract. For best results you'll want to get a mill too. Liquid extract darkens with time. Spraymalt keeps its color but will clump up in a hurry if exposed to moisture.

When I went to all grain one of the biggest differences I found was the ability to brew lighter colored beers.

 

[Geoffinthewilds]

These are only my opinions. Someone will argue every one of my points below.

All grain gives you more flexibility in what you brew. With extract you're using whatever blend the manufacturer used. Uncrushed grain keeps fresher longer than extract. For best results you'll want to get a mill too. Liquid extract darkens with time. Spraymalt keeps its color but will clump up in a hurry if exposed to moisture.

When I went to all grain one of the biggest differences I found was the ability to brew lighter colored beers.

Thanks formyour reply dwhite60, you make some good points so thanks for your input, think its the way I will go but still not 100% but close

 

[An Ankoù]

And on the downside, you'll lose time because you've got to mash and sparge the grain, so add another 2½ hours to your brewday. But. you'll save loads of money as you can get a 25 Kg sack of malt for the price of a decent kit. I used to use extract and made some decent beers, but I don't think I could go back.

 

[Geoffinthewilds]

And on the downside, you'll lose time because you've got to mash and sparge the grain, so add another 2½ hours to your brewday. But. you'll save loads of money as you can get a 25 Kg sack of malt for the price of a decent kit. I used to use extract and made some decent beers, but I don't think I could go back.

Thanks An Ankou we are getting some Internatiol replies lol, was over your part of the World last year, love France, used to live in 85 Department Vendee for a couple of years and enjoyed the Cave scene. My wife and I are looking at reducing costs as we both like a drink and the minimum Unit price of Alcohol in Scotland all adds to the costs, so looking long term, I know the initial outlay will be eye watering but will soon pay itself back, plus really interested in learning the art of brewing and experimenting with diferent flavours hops etc once I gain valuable experience, suppose the next step would be BIAB but I usually jump in both feet first much to the delight of my Mrs, I always seem to find expensive hobbies, used to race Motorcycles and cars and my anorac hobby as she calls it is Ham Radio so home brewing is cheap but very rewarding and she is not complaining on her many trips to sample the offerings in my Kegerator.
Cheers
Geoff

 

[An Ankoù]

Yeah, we love it over here, except for the lack of pubs and beer festivals. I'm in two minds about BIAB, I've been brewing 50 years and it's a relatively new thing. I think the trade off is between the number of pots you need to have and efficiency as, if I understand right, quite a lot of the sugar is left in the residual grain. If you've already your fermenters and kegs then you need a mash tun, a kettle (boiling vessel) and a heat source. I'd go for a propane ring from Calor Gas. You'd have change out of £400 if you got an SS Brewtec kettle and one of the dedicated plastic insulated mash tuns. You could add a hot liquor vessel for your mash water later on but something cheap for that- a big, single skin bottom stainless or aluminium stock pot.

 

[MmmBeer]

An advantage of extract brewing is that the equipment needed is much cheaper and will probably be needed if you later decide to go down the AG route. The raw extract works out about twice as expensive as grain, for an equivalent recipe. The step to BIAB would then be smaller, in terms of additional equipment outlay and procedure.

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

You don’t need to spend a lot on all grain brewing - whatever you have plus one big stew pot. You can of course spend your life’s savings if you choose.

All grain gives you ultimate control but for me it’s mostly the satisfaction of doing it all from scratch (apart from malting the grains but you have to draw the line somewhere!).

You can get a really good approximation using light malt extract and then adding your own specialty malts.

Why are you thinking of moving to all grain?

 

[Geoffinthewilds]

You don’t need to spend a lot on all grain brewing - whatever you have plus one big stew pot. You can of course spend your life’s savings if you choose.

All grain gives you ultimate control but for me it’s mostly the satisfaction of doing it all from scratch (apart from malting the grains but you have to draw the line somewhere!).

You can get a really good approximation using light malt extract and then adding your own specialty malts.

Why are you thinking of moving to all grain?

I just fancy a go and once I gain more experience playing about or trying new recipes, dream territory I would like to own my own micro brewery in Spain or France but that would be a dream, I blame it on these new life abroad programs my Mrs watches, plus I love a gadget :-)

 

[Geoffinthewilds]

An advantage of extract brewing is that the equipment needed is much cheaper and will probably be needed if you later decide to go down the AG route. The raw extract works out about twice as expensive as grain, for an equivalent recipe. The step to BIAB would then be smaller, in terms of additional equipment outlay and procedure.

Think I must have to much time on my hands like the rest of us lol, but like the micro brew machines and love learning new skills so think the swap to AG would push me to be a better brewer

 

[MyQul]

All grain gives you ultimate control but for me it’s mostly the satisfaction of doing it all from scratch (apart from malting the grains but you have to draw the line somewhere!).

What, you haven't got your own field of barley? And you dont malt your own grain? Pfft Your not a REAL home brewer!

 

[Geoffinthewilds]

Yeah, we love it over here, except for the lack of pubs and beer festivals. I'm in two minds about BIAB, I've been brewing 50 years and it's a relatively new thing. I think the trade off is between the number of pots you need to have and efficiency as, if I understand right, quite a lot of the sugar is left in the residual grain. If you've already your fermenters and kegs then you need a mash tun, a kettle (boiling vessel) and a heat source. I'd go for a propane ring from Calor Gas. You'd have change out of £400 if you got an SS Brewtec kettle and one of the dedicated plastic insulated mash tuns. You could add a hot liquor vessel for your mash water later on but something cheap for that- a big, single skin bottom stainless or aluminium stock pot.

I will always remember when my step son came over to see us and we went to the local bar and at 8pm he wanted to shut, a bit of a shock to the system as we had 24 hour drinking back in Wales before it was ever legal lol

 

[MyQul]

plus I love a gadget :-)

If you love gadgets and shiny, shiny kit, you've chosen the right hobby. Full garage - Empty wallet!

 

[An Ankoù]

I just fancy a go and once I gain more experience playing about or trying new recipes, dream territory I would like to own my own micro brewery in Spain or France but that would be a dream, I blame it on these new life abrod programs my Mrs watches, plus I love a gadget :-)

I don't know all parts of France. but from my experience, the French don't take the same aproach to drinking beer as we Brits do, but nevertheless there a re plenty of microbreweries- and the beer isn't very good. Even established breweries trying to copy, say an AIPA, get it horribly wrong. I think to be successful, you'd need to brew English-style beer for expat Brits. That's not to say there isn't some good beer. The bière de Garde from the North East is lovely and so is saison. But the French don't down half a gallon at a sitting, rather a glass.

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

I just fancy a go and once I gain more experience playing about or trying new recipes, dream territory I would like to own my own micro brewery in Spain or France but that would be a dream, I blame it on these new life abroad programs my Mrs watches, plus I love a gadget :-)

OK - so you might need more than a big stew pot, you’re gonna need a really big stew pot!

The great thing is you could start with a smaller stew pot, learn your craft, and then buy a bigger pot and scale up?

 

[terrym]

@Geoffinthewilds
If you mean brewing beers as in using malt extract with a hop boil (rather than making up a kit with or without 'improvements')
Extract ......
Main Pros
- Most AG recipes are directly convertible to extract except those where part of the grain bill requires mashing like oats or torrified wheat. You can still steep some grains like crystal, chocolate or black malts
- Its quicker than AG and there is less kit involved. All you need is a large enough stock pot for the hop boil in addition to the basics. You dont have to boil all of the ME, some of it can go straight into the FV as for kit. So you can brew beer with a stock pot of half to third of the final volume.
- If you are into large quantities malt extract is easier to store and under the right conditions will probably keep longer (esp DME)

Main Cons
- Cheap or old LME may bring a twang to your beer. (But you shouldn't get that with premium LME specifically sold for brewing)
- Malt extract is more expensive than grain
- There is less choice for selecting a base to make up a recipe (compared to AG) ie you are restricted to 5 colour types.

And all malt extracts will dissolve, even DME, you just have to be a bit patient and work on it to allow any clumps to break down an then disssolve. I never get a problem with this.

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

What, you haven't got your own field of barley? And you dont malt your own grain? Pfft Your not a REAL home brewer!

No, just a part-time charlatan I’m afraid - damn, you found me out!

 

[Geoffinthewilds]

If you love gadgets and shiny, shiny kit, you've chosen the right hobby. Full garage - Empty wallet!

I love spending the kids inheritance

 

[Geoffinthewilds]

OK - so you might need more than a big stew pot, you’re gonna need a really big stew pot!

The great thing is you could start with a smaller stew pot, learn your craft, and then buy a bigger pot and scale up?

No matter how bad my AG trials if I go that way, go, it can never be as bad as when I was in Libya and had to brew apple juice with bakers yeast, used to call it cloud 9, did the job though

 

[AXW123]

I moved over to all grain about a year ago. I don’t have lots of expensive kit. Pros my beer is much more predictable and lighter and cheaper and better cons it takes longer. You literally pay your money and take your choice.