AG#2 Golden Ratio IPA (Critique / Tips welcome!)

[chuff76]

Hi guys

This weekend I will be attempting my 2nd AG brew.
I am using full BIAB method in a 40l Buffalo.

Here is my recipe, trying out some new hops this time:
#2 Golden Ratio
American IPA

Recipe Specs
----------------
Batch Size (L): 23.0
Total Grain (kg): 6.466
Total Hops (g): 180.00
Original Gravity (OG): 1.062 (°P): 15.2
Final Gravity (FG): 1.012 (°P): 3.1
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 6.58 %
Colour (SRM): 8.3 (EBC): 16.4
Bitterness (IBU): 51.7 (Tinseth)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 70
Boil Time (Minutes): 60

Grain Bill
----------------
5.820 kg United Kingdom - Maris Otter Pale (90%)
0.323 kg United Kingdom - Crystal 30L (5%)
0.323 kg United Kingdom - Munich (5%)

Hop Bill
----------------
15.0 g Amarillo Leaf (8.6% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Cascade Leaf (7% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Chinook Leaf (13% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Amarillo Leaf (8.6% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Cascade Leaf (7% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Chinook Leaf (13% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Amarillo Leaf (8.6% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Cascade Leaf (7% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Chinook Leaf (13% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Amarillo Leaf (8.6% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Cascade Leaf (7% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (0.7 g/L)
15.0 g Chinook Leaf (13% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (0.7 g/L)

Misc Bill
----------------

Single step Infusion at 66°C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 20°C with Safale - American Ale Yeast US-05

How does this look as an American style IPA ?

I also struggled with a few bits on my first brew so am keen to get it right this time - Here's a list of my woes, and how I hope to overcome them - Any advice much appreciated!

AG#1

• Poor efficiency - Ended up with an SG of 1.045 instead of 1.060+ I think this was down to my messed up mash temp being too high, the online calculator I used suggested start at 74 but this only dropped to 71 when I mashed in. got it down to 68 for an hour, but I realise this is still too high
• Too much liquid - Started out with 35l, with the grain it was brimming over. Didn't have as much boil off as expected. I'll try around 33 this time
• Extended boil - Due to the above, I had a heavily extended boil (getting on 2 hours!) to reduce the volume and try and bring up the SG. This of course will have screwed with my IBU's.
• Intermittent rolling boil - I might have to live with this for now, scared of messing with the electrics yet

Wish me luck


Am really enjoying designing my labels lately, cart before horse, I know but here it is

 

[DoctorMick]

Personally, and this is just preference, I'd increase the IBUs a little bit to maybe 60 but I like my beer quite bitter. Also, I'd consider using just one hop for the 60 min additions, a lot of the flavour is lost from the early additions and you're using some pretty expensive hops there. I'd probably increase the dry hops as well but it really is down to taste for beers like this and the best way to learn what you like is trial and error.

 

[chuff76]

Cheers Doc

I've been choosing IBU based on similar beers that I like, and was also trying to be a bit conservative after last time (extended boil, increased bitterness - still tastes great though!)

I wonder how much of the flavour comes through at all - in fact why dont people just use a cheap bog standard bittering hop and then the good ones later.

I've just noticed your making a Goose Island IPA clone, how is it? - That is the beer that changed the world for me, I would love to try and make it some day!!

 

[DoctorMick]

Cheers Doc

I've been choosing IBU based on similar beers that I like, and was also trying to be a bit conservative after last time (extended boil, increased bitterness - still tastes great though!)

I wonder how much of the flavour comes through at all - in fact why dont people just use a cheap bog standard bittering hop and then the good ones later.

I've just noticed your making a Goose Island IPA clone, how is it? - That is the beer that changed the world for me, I would love to try and make it some day!!

I've wondered exactly the same thing, at some point I'll do two brews which use a lot of bittering hops and do one with an expensive hop and one with a cheap bittering hop to see what the difference is like.

The Goose Island will be the next one going on but I'm not sure how accurate the recipe will be. It's from the Mitch Steele IPA book and comes direct from the brewery I believe but the recipe is pretty hard to work out as it is based on percentages rather than weight. I'll post my interpretation of the recipe when I brew it in a couple of weeks.

 

[chuff76]

I will be VERY interested to hear how the Goose Island turns out.

Trying to get my process down to a tee, once I feel a bit more confident I would like to try a clone.

Interesting stuff about the bittering hops, they do seem to be the most expensive bit although I'm trying to make very hop forward beers so I guess its to be expected.

I wonder if I could grow my own ..

 

[Leon103]

If you efficiency is way off on your first brew you may want to adjust your grain bill until you get it right.

 

[strange-steve]

Not a comment on your recipe but your label is brilliant.

 

[chuff76]

Not a comment on your recipe but your label is brilliant.

Cheers Steve :) Not sure how golden my ratio's will be on Saturday :lol:

 

[chuff76]

If you efficiency is way off on your first brew you may want to adjust your grain bill until you get it right.

Any suggestions Leon? I've been using Brewers Friend, but I'm not entirely convinced it is suitable for BIAB.

Is it as simple as adding more grain to boost my SG ? I've got tons of the stuff at home

 

[nigelnorris]

Any suggestions Leon? I've been using Brewers Friend, but I'm not entirely convinced it is suitable for BIAB.

Is it as simple as adding more grain to boost my SG ? I've got tons of the stuff at home

Not sure which order but you need weights of 3.233kg, 1.9981kg, 1.2349kg to really make it work. If you're going to add more grain you need to be thinking 5.231kg of something.

:ugeek:

 

[Leon103]

Any suggestions Leon? I've been using Brewers Friend, but I'm not entirely convinced it is suitable for BIAB.

Is it as simple as adding more grain to boost my SG ? I've got tons of the stuff at home

On Brewers friend change the efficiency (if this can be done, I use beersmith). Then add more grain to boost the numbers

 

[chuff76]

Not sure which order but you need weights of 3.233kg, 1.9981kg, 1.2349kg to really make it work. If you're going to add more grain you need to be thinking 5.231kg of something.

:ugeek:

My recipe has got almost 6.5kg of grain, my first one had about 6.2kg.

Do people do this? if I expect rubbish efficiency, would just using more grain net the same result (aside from costing more and being wasteful).

I've got a nice new stainless steel mash paddle too which I hope will help - My plastic was was going all bendy in the hot water

 

[nigelnorris]

My recipe has got almost 6.5kg of grain, my first one had about 6.2kg.

Do people do this? if I expect rubbish efficiency, would just using more grain net the same result (aside from costing more and being wasteful).

I've got a nice new stainless steel mash paddle too which I hope will help - My plastic was was going all bendy in the hot water

No. My post wasn't intended as serious. I broke up your ingredients according to the golden ratio. In those quantities they'll fit exactly along the lines on your label. The nest big line would be 5.231kg long, and so on.

Da Vinci would have liked it, but then I think he was a wine drinker.

 

[Cqr]

Not sure which order but you need weights of 3.233kg, 1.9981kg, 1.2349kg to really make it work. If you're going to add more grain you need to be thinking 5.231kg of something.

:ugeek:

Use biabacus, it's great for biab
I use it
I've got Brewers friend, and beer smith 2
But biabacus is the best IMO and it's free

 

[chuff76]

No. My post wasn't intended as serious. I broke up your ingredients according to the golden ratio. In those quantities they'll fit exactly along the lines on your label. The nest big line would be 5.231kg long, and so on.

Da Vinci would have liked it, but then I think he was a wine drinker.

Damn yeah that passed right over my head, but now you've really got me thinking... Can I somehow get the fibonacci sequence into my beer

 

[nigelnorris]

Damn yeah that passed right over my head, but now you've really got me thinking... Can I somehow get the fibonacci sequence into my beer

Easier to do that with the hops.

EG. Dry hop with 3.3g, 5.3g, 8.6g, 13.9g, 22.5g, 36.4g to get the same 90g load give or take due to rounding.

Today's homework for anyone reading this, break the boil/aroma hop timings into 6 intervals then recalculate the total hop weight and addition portions in the same ratios to get the same bitterness out. Probably need more than just a pencil for that, but it's not too hard. Excel would be cheating.

 

[Leon103]

My recipe has got almost 6.5kg of grain, my first one had about 6.2kg.

Do people do this? if I expect rubbish efficiency, would just using more grain net the same result (aside from costing more and being wasteful).

I've got a nice new stainless steel mash paddle too which I hope will help - My plastic was was going all bendy in the hot water

Yes people do it. If your efficiency is poor the beer isn't going to hit the desired abv

 

[chuff76]

The 'Golden Ratio' is going to have to wait, I'll be saving that idea and labels for another time when I can figure out how to get a bit of mathematical magic in there.

I made this in the end:
#2 as yet un-named
American IPA

Recipe Specs
----------------
Batch Size (L): 23.0
Total Grain (kg): 7.800
Total Hops (g): 300.00
Original Gravity (OG): 1.064 (°P): 15.7
Final Gravity (FG): 1.012 (°P): 3.1
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 6.79 %
Colour (SRM): 10.0 (EBC): 19.7
Bitterness (IBU): 56.4 (Tinseth)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 60
Boil Time (Minutes): 60

Grain Bill
----------------
7.020 kg United Kingdom - Maris Otter Pale (90%)
0.546 kg United Kingdom - Crystal 30L (7%)
0.234 kg United Kingdom - Munich (3%)

Hop Bill
----------------
20.0 g Amarillo Leaf (8.6% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.9 g/L)
20.0 g Cascade Leaf (7% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.9 g/L)
20.0 g Cluster Leaf (6.5% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.9 g/L)
20.0 g Amarillo Leaf (8.6% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil) (0.9 g/L)
20.0 g Cascade Leaf (7% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil) (0.9 g/L)
20.0 g Chinook Leaf (13% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil) (0.9 g/L)
20.0 g Amarillo Leaf (8.6% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma) (0.9 g/L)
20.0 g Cascade Leaf (7% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma) (0.9 g/L)
20.0 g Chinook Leaf (13% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma) (0.9 g/L)
40.0 g Amarillo Leaf (8.6% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (1.7 g/L)
40.0 g Cascade Leaf (7% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (1.7 g/L)
40.0 g Chinook Leaf (13% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (1.7 g/L)

Misc Bill
----------------

Single step Infusion at 66°C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 20°C with Safale - American Ale Yeast US-05

I used a massive grain bill and again got poor efficiency but I did account for it with the recipe, pre-boil was 1.054 and I ended up with 19l in the FV at 1.062 so very pleased.

I'm having issues with thermometers - The one I bought recently got chucked in the bin, not fit for purpose. This thing was telling me I was at a steady 66 for almost an hour when it crept up to 67 ?!! I used my other basic thermometer and I was down to 62. I am now searching for a money no object best thermometer I can find.

After the boil I chilled to 80 degrees then put in all my aroma hops for 30 mins - I had already removed my hop spider and put them in loose - Big mistake - draining from boiler to FV was a complete nightmare and it cost me a lot of time.

FV is bubbling away like crazy - I've got a big dry hop planned for what should be my strongest and hoppiest brew yet :thumb:

 

[RZH]

You'll find it takes you a few batches to really work out what sort of efficiency you're getting. Using software such as BeerSmith 2 you can input your actual figures against your predicted ones to give you your total efficiency. Sorry if you've already mentioned it but what sort of sparge method are you using? As for thermometers, I looked around for ages, always saw the Thermapen recommended. Was sort of reluctant paying so much for a thermometer but finally bought one and can see why they're so rated. Super accurate, super fast.

Look forward to seeing how this turns out, love a big IPA.

 

[DoctorMick]

You'll find it takes you a few batches to really work out what sort of efficiency you're getting. Using software such as BeerSmith 2 you can input your actual figures against your predicted ones to give you your total efficiency. Sorry if you've already mentioned it but what sort of sparge method are you using? As for thermometers, I looked around for ages, always saw the Thermapen recommended. Was sort of reluctant paying so much for a thermometer but finally bought one and can see ywhy they're so rated. Super accurate, super fast.

Look forward to seeing how this turns out, love a big IPA.

Seconded, I really like the thermopen and they're really useful for plenty of none brewing related stuff as well.