Yeast temp for British ales

[Sandimas]

I tend to brew predominantly British ales - bitters, golden ales etc. with either Gervin or S-04 yeast. Despite doing over 160 brews I've always gone for the not-too-cold not-too-warm approach and fermented 18-21C.

I've struggled to get fruitiness in things like a 5% dark ale. Reading around I came across a clone recipe for Doom Bar that suggested fermenting at 25C to bring out the fruitiness from the yeast. I'd never considered fermenting this high due to risk of fusel alcohol.

Is it worth a go at 25C? Any idea what commercial brewers do, do they ferment some brews at higher temps?

 

[Ben034]

I think 25c is too high. Personally, I wouldn't go above 21c with most English ale yeasts. Slightly higher you may be ok but 25c is pushing it I think.

I've never used gervin but with S04 you may struggle to get those fruity flavours you're after. I would try a liquid English ale yeasts like WLP002 and see if that makes a difference for you. This strain has worked well for improving my bitters.

 

[trevorS]

I will follow this with interest as I now have a thermometer!

For about 25 years i brewed with kit beers ie malt and a pack of yeast and always fermented on a heater plate without temperature control and the results were always drinkable, but now with my new thermometer i find the temperature is always above 30 c , so now I brew AG don't use the heater and my brews fermentation run at 20 c ie room temperature and the only difference is my brews ferment a lot longer now 7 to 10 days where it was only maximum of 6 days,
SO heater or no heater that is the question?

 

[Ben034]

I will follow this with interest as I now have a thermometer!

For about 25 years i brewed with kit beers ie malt and a pack of yeast and always fermented on a heater plate without temperature control and the results were always drinkable, but now with my new thermometer i find the temperature is always above 30 c , so now I brew AG don't use the heater and my brews fermentation run at 20 c ie room temperature and the only difference is my brews ferment a lot longer now 7 to 10 days where it was only maximum of 6 days,
SO heater or no heater that is the question?

If it works for you and you enjoy the beer carry on. 30c is certainly above the optimum temperature for most ale yeasts though. I would aim for around 20c.

What type of yeast are you using out of interest?

 

[trueblue]

Try better yeast. SO-4 is by far the most boring yeast I have tried.

 

[trevorS]

If it works for you and you enjoy the beer carry on. 30c is certainly above the optimum temperature for most ale yeasts though. I would aim for around 20c.

What type of yeast are you using out of interest?

Brewpak ale yeast at the moment dried

 

[Sandimas]

Try better yeast. SO-4 is by far the most boring yeast I have tried.

What would you consider a better yeast? Presumably one of the liquid ones, but they are so expensive.

 

[MyQul]

What would you consider a better yeast? Presumably one of the liquid ones, but they are so expensive.

Yes, liquid yeast. But they dont have to be expensive. Initial outlay might be but reusing then yeast brings the cost down. You could also go culture up a bottle conditioned yeast. The Gales yeast is lovely and fruity and cost me a couple of quid from ASDA

 

[CD]

Peter Austin, the founding father of micro-breweries, told me at his fledgling Ringwood Brewery in 1884, that they fermented at between 18C and 20C to quarter gravity (2 days for Ringwood Bitter, 3 for Old Thumper), cooled to 12C and rested for 4 days, racked into casks adding finings, and sent out to the trade (pubs) two days later. I have followed that advice ever since.

 

[MyQul]

To answer the initial question, underpitching will also make the yeast produce more ester (but you can risk a stuck ferment if you get it wrong)

 

[GerritT]

Bulldog and Mangrove Jack have dry ale yeast, with some character. I pitch above 20º, probably around 22º (wonky thermometer), but my brews are quaffable. I'd pitch around 24º too if I had no alternatives.
But not above 25º, that's danger zone.

 

[trueblue]

What would you consider a better yeast? Presumably one of the liquid ones, but they are so expensive.

Yes I prefer liquid yeast but they don't cost more. With sensible management you can get at least 6 brews from each pack. On the rare occasion I use dried yeast I would go for Nottingham or Neal's classic ale yeast.

 

[An Ankoù]

Peter Austin, the founding father of micro-breweries, told me at his fledgling Ringwood Brewery in 1884, that they fermented at between 18C and 20C to quarter gravity (2 days for Ringwood Bitter, 3 for Old Thumper), cooled to 12C and rested for 4 days, racked into casks adding finings, and sent out to the trade (pubs) two days later. I have followed that advice ever since.

Sadly, Peter Austin has passed away, but he was never that old!
Did you know he set up the Coreff Brewery in Morlaix (Finisterre) before it moved down the road. The poor lad would turn in his grave if he could taste some of the stuff they brew now.

 

[Sandimas]

Thanks for all the replies.

I have cultivated yeast from a bottle-conditioned Wye Valley beer and used it in a few brews. Also used some of the MJ dried yeasts in various brews, especially Empire Ale Yeast. However, if I'm honest, I can't seem to taste the difference - which could of course just be my taste buds.

Can anyone recommend one of the commercial liquid yeast for an ale where I'll really notice the difference? I'll give that a go.

 

[MyQul]

The Fullers strain has a very distinctive profile and I believe this is WLP002/WY1968. You can also get it out of a bottle of Fullers 1845 or Bengal Lancer

 

[stz]

SO4 doesn't like it warm. Not advisable to take it above 20C. Plenty of others are happy 21-23C. This 18C business is complete rubbish as is 25C or above when discussing English ale yeast. 'fruitiness' is often less about fruitiness and more about 'the absence of neutrality'.