Who uses Star San

[Bill_g]

Careful here ... the correct dilution rates are important and are as follows:

• Star San: 1 fluid oz to 5 US gallons (29.6ml to 18.9 litres) i.e. 1.56 ml to 1 litre
• Chemsan: 10ml to 5 litres i.e. 2ml to 1 litre

Both manufacturers officially answer that the diluted product should be used within a few hours of mixing. However this is just what they have tested and will stand by, it's not general practice amongst home brewers.
The cloudiness aspect is much debated. Chem San mentions this on their FAQ and say hard water is ok as long as pH < 3.5 but of course that would be along with the use of the product within a few hours. I personally would not keep cloudy Star San or Chemsan because the surfactant aspect of the product has been degraded. These products work on a 2 pronged attack of surface tension reduction and low pH to break the cell wall. I fortunately have a water softener and with soft water either product remain crystal clear indefinately. I'm not prepared to gamble a batch of beer plus all that work for a few pence saved on sanitiser, but in the end it's personal choice.

 

[DCBC]

Great advice - but can you do anything to keep the pH low as long as it's low? Like I said before I just mix it up and if it's cloudy I dropper CRS into it until it isn't. I like to think that solves the problem, and I have not yet (touch wood) had an infection, but perhaps I'm missing something.

 

[DCBC]

I have used VWP for years but am about to pick up an order from Dark Rock which includes 250 ml of Harris Suresan (not sure how they manage this as there appears to be another product called Suresan) and is clearly their answer to Starsan being a no rinse sanitizer. The active ingredient appears to be sodium percarbonate but as I am no chemist and have never used the product before I wonder if anyone has any observations please?

If it's mainly sodium percarbonate then this looks like it's an oxyclean-type thing rather than Starsan. If it's also got large amounts of sodium metasilicate then it will be a PBW substitute which has a similar application. I bet it's very similar to this: Chemclean 400g | The Malt Miller

Either way they're cleaning products rather than sanitisers - i.e. to get the dirt off before you can sanitise. And I always rinse these products even if they say they are no-rinse, simply because they seem more 'chemical' to me than StarSan!

 

[UKSkydiver]

... which includes 250 ml of Harris Suresan ...
I wonder if anyone has any observations please?

I have been using Harris SureSan since I started brewing about 18 months ago (~18 brews). It's all I use and I've been using it as described without any infection (as far as I know) It does appear to have the same ingredient (soduim percarbonate) as the Oxi cleaners.

Ref: Suresan-MSDS.pdf (harrishomecraft.com)

So, it is nothing like StarSan and ChemSan. You have to use it within one hour of it being made up, unlike StarSan and ChemSan.

This brings me to antoher question I have which I've been meaning to ask for a while, so rather than hijack this thread, I have started my own here

Cheers

 

[micklupulo]

If it's mainly sodium percarbonate then this looks like it's an oxyclean-type thing rather than Starsan. If it's also got large amounts of sodium metasilicate then it will be a PBW substitute which has a similar application. I bet it's very similar to this: Chemclean 400g | The Malt Miller[/UR

Either way they're cleaning products rather than sanitisers - i.e. to get the dirt off before you can sanitise. And I always rinse these products even if they say they are no-rinse, simply because they seem more 'chemical' to me than StarSan!

Thanks for this and here is their blurb on it. I will have a chat to them tomorrow when I go over though masks don't help so any further chemical insight would be most welcome!

 

[Oddersocks]

Thanks everybody, learned a lot there.
So I think in terms of a hand spray, just make up a litre with warm water and 1 ml.
interesting about the Oxyclean too. I think I’m settled on the Grainfather, still looking though, I worry a bit about the chiller. This pumping hot wort through it to clean it doesn’t fill me with confidence to be honest.

I have an immersion chiller then bought a plate chiller and was also thinking about the CF chiller. I had nothing but trouble with the plate chiller and don't use it anymore. I went back to the immersion chiller and haven't had a bad brew or experience with it. No cleaning hassles either. I only changed in the first place because I was swayed by the pesky influencers online..

 

[Dmac]

I use sodium percarbonate exclusively. Haven't had a problem with it. It's no rinse and
It rinses easily. I found this online: "Sodium percarbonate uses active oxygen to penetrate carbon or protein soils and has a high kill rate on wide range of microorganisms making it an effective sanitiser as well as cleaner." I always ensure that I wash and clean everything after fermentation etc n then use sodium percarbonate for everything afterwards... Hope this helps...

 

[Polcho]

Careful here ... the correct dilution rates are important and are as follows:

• Star San: 1 fluid oz to 5 US gallons (29.6ml to 18.9 litres) i.e. 1.56 ml to 1 litre
• Chemsan: 10ml to 5 litres i.e. 2ml to 1 litre

Both manufacturers officially answer that the diluted product should be used within a few hours of mixing. However this is just what they have tested and will stand by, it's not general practice amongst home brewers.
The cloudiness aspect is much debated. Chem San mentions this on their FAQ and say hard water is ok as long as pH < 3.5 but of course that would be along with the use of the product within a few hours. I personally would not keep cloudy Star San or Chemsan because the surfactant aspect of the product has been degraded. These products work on a 2 pronged attack of surface tension reduction and low pH to break the cell wall. I fortunately have a water softener and with soft water either product remain crystal clear indefinately. I'm not prepared to gamble a batch of beer plus all that work for a few pence saved on sanitiser, but in the end it's personal choice.

This dilution was really helpful

 

[jayk34]

I use a 2 litre lemonade bottle and mix up 3ml of star San with De-ionised water. The water was on offer back in February this year in Tesco and got it delivered with the groceries.

I then fill a glass spray bottle out of the 2 litre lemonade bottle to sanitise bottles as I drink them. I have found that it keeps for at least one month (probably longer) in this way before I need to make another batch and I test it before every brew day with pH paper strips if I have any left, otherwise I make up a new batch.