What should I buy?

[TheOsprey]

Ok,

About a month ago I bought a Youngs lager kit. I still haven't used my lager can, but I'm kind of hooked on the idea already. I think I'll use a couple of kits, then move onto grain. I say that - I might find the kits to be really hard and not move on! But I'm generally quite confident in the kitchen, so this should be similar, right?

I'm thinking of setting up in the garage. It's an external garage so not heated. Terrym said:

If you don't want to brew in the house and use the garage instead the cheapest option is to use a water bath to get the right temperature. I use a trug container from Wilko (about £4) in which I put the FV and part fill it with water which is then heated by a 50w fish tank heater (ebay about £7). I set up the heater thermostat to keep the bath at 19-20*C by temperature measurement and not relying on the heater setting.

So I'm thinking of setting up like that initially. I'm also thinking of setting up a fridge/freezer and a hob on an old desk for the mash stage.

So basically, what else will i realistically need to get in the near future to keep me rolling? My FV doesn't have an airlock, should I get one of those? Do I just cut a hole in the top of the FV and stick the airlock in it?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Nick

 

[keat64]

Be warned. Kit brewing doesn't use up much time. You can be pitching the yeast within 30 minutes.
Where as All Grain, will take about 4 or 5 hours before you can sit down.
Now having said that, AG is far superior to kits, so I guess the old addage goes... you get out, what you put in.

In answer to the FV. If its a tight fitting lid, then yes, drill a hole in it and fit an airlock, if you get one with a rubber bung, you could also use this on a Demijhon if you decide to brew small or have a go at wine.
You've probably started in the correct order, a few kits to get the idea and feel for it, before moving on to all grain.
And atleast this way, you'll already have some equipment.

For the mash, quite a few folks on here have built a mash tun from a cooler box, and for boiling we use a catering boiler.
There is a technique called 'Brew in a Bag", this is referred to as BIAB. This involves using the same boiling vessel to mash in, where by you use a bag to soak the grains.
Basically, It's one less process to a mash tun.

Lots of options, but worth the effort.

By the way, the guys on here will always chip in with advice or answers, so don't get put off by what appears to be complexity.

 

[terrym]

AG is far superior to kits

Nor sure about 'far superior'. Superior perhaps at best. There are plenty of kits out there that deliver excellent results with and without a boost. On the other hand if you buy a 1.5kg one can and brew it with table sugar.......

 

[terrym]

My FV doesn't have an airlock, should I get one of those? Do I just cut a hole in the top of the FV and stick the airlock in it?

You don't actually need an airlock, but they can be very useful, since they indicate how the fermentation is progressing. However for them to function as intended you need a gas tight lid to FV seal which often doesn't happen, so the CO2 bypasses the airlock, making it as useful as a chocolate teapot.
So if you fit an airlock be prepared for it to fail. Both my FVs leak and the one that has an airlock is made leakproof by using cling film between FV and lid as a seal.
Otherwise don't bother, and just slightly crack the lid to release the CO2.

 

[Dutto]

Nor sure about 'far superior'. Superior perhaps at best. There are plenty of kits out there that deliver excellent results with and without a boost. .......

Especially the AG kits! :thumb: :thumb:

 

[Slid]

Especially the AG kits! :thumb: :thumb:

Yes that is right, of course. It takes me 5-6hrs for an AG brew using my lovely new toy, the Grainfather. However, today I had other tasks at hand. Namely completing the filling of a skip on the drive, to help in the project to turn "our" garden into a virtual paradise.

This left me a bit short of time and strength for a "proper" beer, so I chucked a Coopers Stout and one of the two cans that come in a Wherry kit into a bucket with some Roast Barley & Crystal malt juice, boiled up with whatever hop pellets were to hand.

I think there is a place for pimped-up-a-bit kits. I have even thought about doing a full length AG brew and doing half in a small FV and adding a kit to the other half in a 30L FV. The Partial Mash brews I did were very good and a noticeable improvement on a kit.

The two styles I think are best suited to kit brewing are:

• The so called "lawnmower beers" - where you want a low-ish alcohol beer after mowing the lawn, albeit in my case, it takes about 10 mins to mow the lawn.
• Stouts or other dark beers. Especially as a steep of Roast Barley, Chocolate and Crystal in any proportion will give this a very big lift.

 

[Fil]

imho every brewer benefits from cutting their teeth on a few kits, with kit brewing your focusing on all the crucial aspects that you need to get right, you can **** up an ag brew as much as you like upto and including the boils completion, but make one slight error in cleaning, rinsing, and sanitising the Fermenting bucket and any of the cold side equipment or err on maintaining the temperature of the fermenting beer and the brew is easily f*cked..

To go AG all you need is a VERY big vessel and a bag or sheet of netting. Brewpot volume is crucial, to contain a bag of grain for the mash and to contain the post sparged(rinsed), pre boil volume of beer when it stars a violent boil so for a 5 gallon(23-5l) brew consider a 40-50l pot to contain everything comfortably.

the cheapest brewpot is probably a freecycled ex mango chutney barrel fitted with a couple of budget kettle elements and a copper/brass(plumbing fittings) drain/valve.
Brew with basic kit a few times and it will soon become apparent what if any extra equipment would be beneficial to you and how you find you prefer to brew.. many bits of brewkit get bought and remain in the box unused....

 

[Dutto]

Here's a few of the cheaper options for an AG kit.

1. My Mash Tun is made from a 32 litre cool box and a few bits of copper tubing and fittings.

2. The boiler is made from a Wilco FV (£8), a Tap from Homebrew (£4) and the element from a Tesco kettle (£5).

One third of the fun is making the gear, another third is using it to brew with it and the final third is drinking the product. Enjoy! :thumb: :thumb:

 

[TheOsprey]

Snip

Thanks for the advice - and for the help with jargon too! I'll definitely have a few goes at kits first - I'm not sure how much time I'll have free with a baby on the way, I definitely won't be a multi batch maker - one at a time for me!

You don't actually need an airlock, but they can be very useful, since they indicate how the fermentation is progressing. However for them to function as intended you need a gas tight lid to FV seal which often doesn't happen, so the CO2 bypasses the airlock, making it as useful as a chocolate teapot.
So if you fit an airlock be prepared for it to fail. Both my FVs leak and the one that has an airlock is made leakproof by using cling film between FV and lid as a seal.
Otherwise don't bother, and just slightly crack the lid to release the CO2.

Might just stick with the FV for now then, seems it's less vital with a kit. Cheers.

imho every brewer benefits from cutting their teeth on a few kits, with kit brewing your focusing on all the crucial aspects that you need to get right, you can **** up an ag brew as much as you like upto and including the boils completion, but make one slight error in cleaning, rinsing, and sanitising the Fermenting bucket and any of the cold side equipment or err on maintaining the temperature of the fermenting beer and the brew is easily f*cked..

To go AG all you need is a VERY big vessel and a bag or sheet of netting. Brewpot volume is crucial, to contain a bag of grain for the mash and to contain the post sparged(rinsed), pre boil volume of beer when it stars a violent boil so for a 5 gallon(23-5l) brew consider a 40-50l pot to contain everything comfortably.

the cheapest brewpot is probably a freecycled ex mango chutney barrel fitted with a couple of budget kettle elements and a copper/brass(plumbing fittings) drain/valve.
Brew with basic kit a few times and it will soon become apparent what if any extra equipment would be beneficial to you and how you find you prefer to brew.. many bits of brewkit get bought and remain in the box unused....

Thanks - especially for the relative times of kits/ag. I'll try to get the basics down first - I think I'll tinker with my first one though, as it's a lager kit - if I leave it as it is it will seem undrinkable to me anyway!

Here's a few of the cheaper options for an AG kit.

1. My Mash Tun is made from a 32 litre cool box and a few bits of copper tubing and fittings.

2. The boiler is made from a Wilco FV (£8), a Tap from Homebrew (£4) and the element from a Tesco kettle (£5).

One third of the fun is making the gear, another third is using it to brew with it and the final third is drinking the product. Enjoy! :thumb: :thumb:

Thank you! Got a few DIY bits to look at now. How hot does the kettle element get? I'm assuming not hot enough to melt the tub! How do you keep the temperature constant? Or is it just a boil (or heat to 70ish) and cool process?


Thanks all!

 

[Dutto]

The kettle element gets hot enough to boil the wort ...

... but DO NOT switch on the boiler until the element is covered by the wort! :nono: :nono:

The "cut off" has been removed so that it just keeps boiling away when it reaches full temperature; which is when I normally add the bittering hops.

With a single element it takes a few minutes to come up to the boil and some people fit two elements to bring the wort to the boil and then switch one off. (I stir in the froth that is produced near the boiling point but I know some of the members skim it off and remove it.)

At the 23 litres level the boil is vigorous but not hard enough to slosh wort over the side. As a precaution, I rest the lid on top of the boiler but prop it on the stirrer so that the vapours and nasties can still escape with ease.

I also use the boiler to heat up the strike water and sparge water for the mash using the Inkbird Temperature Control to switch it off at the right temperature. (Obviously, using the vessel for these purposes means that I have to temporarily drain and sparge the Mash Tun into a separate container before using it as a wort boiler.)

At the end of the boil I fill the boiler above the level of the element, switch it on for couple of minutes and then clean the element with a semi-stiff nylon brush and rinse everything out before putting it away for the next brew.

Hope this helps. :thumb: :thumb:

 

[TheOsprey]

Very helpful, thank you

 

[TheOsprey]

So, quick as a flash (only 4 years), I'm back and thinking again of setting up to brew in the garage.

I've had another look through this thread (and mocked the confidence of my former self, whose wife was only a month pregnant, and thought he had a mystical thing called 'time' on his hands), and have decided to forego the hob in favour of a catering boiler, as suggested. I've found a fridge locally going free, so I can set up a fermentation fridge. I've also found a couple of ads on ebay which look like a good deal - but obviously I don't really know what I'm talking about.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Home-Bre...375204?hash=item421b17a224:g:9JkAAOSwVhNe7120
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Complete...414511&hash=item2896b99dfc:g:1bcAAOSwatVe8y7-
Both within an hour of me - everything in the first one looks perfect, then the second ad I'm only really interested in the inkbird and heater - hoping I can make an offer.

Anyone care to take a look and let me know if either of these (particularly the first one) look like a good deal/absolute bargain/rip off?

Thanks

 

[stan.distortion]

Neither are a ripoff imo, the first is asking about what you'd expect to pay for the boiler alone and you're getting a load of useful stuff thrown in and the second is asking about what you'd expect to pay for an inkbird and heater and you're getting a load of not so useful stuff thrown in.

The PET bottles may tip the scales on the second, I don't use them but they're one of those things I'd use if I had them (if that makes sense). Like putting a few bottles in the post for a competition, bringing your own beer to some event that doesn't allow glass, bottling a few in plastic so you can give them a squeeze to check carbonation, etc.

If you've tight for space then maybe just get an inkbird and a heater but if a few buckets and a box of bottles gathering dust won't block the place up then the second could be worth getting, chances are you'll find a use for most of it at some stage.

 

[TheOsprey]

Thanks very much, that's really helpful.

Neither are a ripoff imo, the first is asking about what you'd expect to pay for the boiler alone and you're getting a load of useful stuff thrown in and the second is asking about what you'd expect to pay for an inkbird and heater and you're getting a load of not so useful stuff thrown in.

Haha exactly what I was thinking on the second one.

Of course both may end up getting loads of bids which will render the question void!

 

[stan.distortion]

Tbh, I'd get in touch with the seller for the first and see if he'll remove the listing and take cash in hand instead. I'd been looking at a very similar setup for about 50% higher price and the only thing that's put me off is distance, I'd have to trust the seller and get it couriered.

Some of the kit is a bit rough around the edges like the bit of hosepipe in the mash tun (I've no doubt it works but it's not food grade material) and that cooler... I reckon you could re-list that as modern art for 10x the price he's asking

For me it would be an ideal upgrade from what I'm using even if it was only the coolbox and boiler, a good scrubbing and sterilising and you should be at an advanced stage with your equipment for about 1/5th the price you'd have paid by starting out with stovetop and steadily upgrading.

 

[TheOsprey]

Tbh, I'd get in touch with the seller for the first and see if he'll remove the listing and take cash in hand instead. I'd been looking at a very similar setup for about 50% higher price and the only thing that's put me off is distance, I'd have to trust the seller and get it couriered.

Some of the kit is a bit rough around the edges like the bit of hosepipe in the mash tun (I've no doubt it works but it's not food grade material) and that cooler... I reckon you could re-list that as modern art for 10x the price he's asking

For me it would be an ideal upgrade from what I'm using even if it was only the coolbox and boiler, a good scrubbing and sterilising and you should be at an advanced stage with your equipment for about 1/5th the price you'd have paid by starting out with stovetop and steadily upgrading.

Haha yeah the coil is... interesting.

The hosepipe did strike me as weird. I'm hoping it's easy to switch out.

 

[stan.distortion]

Lol, the coils just kind of end up that way. I'd used a roll of 10mm copper from B&Q to make mine, wound it around a paint tin as someone suggested on here and it came out looking the bees knees. Now after countless cleanings and minor squishings from getting moved around it's well on its way to looking the same, hopefully one day it'll look as badass and battle scared as that one

The hose pipe will switch out easily, a foot of 1/2" silicone hose from a homebrew store would do the job and cost less than a quid. I'd boil the crap out of the filter though, it's an unknown and could have stood for a couple of years with the last brews wort in it but steep it in cola or just do a mash with it and it will come out gleaming.

 

[TheOsprey]

Thanks again!

 

[TheOsprey]

Aargh! Now this has come up:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/114277842985
Obviously I've got no idea what these things are going to go for eventually. But this is an hour and a half away, which is probably pushing it, particularly as I'd have to squeeze it into my Xzara Picasso!

I'm wondering whether to just hope something pops up ultra-local...

 

[kelper]

Get a hydrometer and trial jar if you don't have already.