Turbo Cider Advice.

[Hainsey]

Planning a turbo cider next week to mature over next few months in time for summer. Here's my recipe and method upt o the point i'm happy with but when in comes to fermenting onwards it all gets a bity hazy, please let me know if there's anything wrong or could be done better as never made this before:

Equipment list
2x 4.5L Demi Jons
2x airlocks
2x rubber bungs c/w hole
Various 500L bottles + caps etc

Recipe
1 sachet Youngs cider yeast
7L Value Apple juice
1L Cranberry juice
2 cups of strong tea
2tsp malic acid
2tsp pectolase
28g priming sugar (granulated)
Splenda to taste

Method
Make two cups strong tea and leave to cool,
Split yeast in two and re-hydrate in 50ml boiled cooled water each,
Sanitise DJ's, airlocks, rubber bungs, funnel etc.
Pour tea into each DJ,
Pour apple juice into each DJ,
Pur cranberry juice into each DJ,
Add malic acid and pectolase to each DJ,
Pour yeast into each DJ,
Stir/shake/Swirl each DJ,
Fit bung and airlocks to DJ's,

QUESTIONS AT THIS POINT

1. How long to ferment, 10 days or longer?
2. What gravity should I be aiming for once fermented?
3. Once fermented out, do I rack to another DJ and then mature in that?
4. Is a DJ ok to mature or will UV rays effect taste?
5. If maturing in DJ do I need airlock and if so what do I do about water/vodka in it evaporating?
6. Can I fit a sealed bung whilst maturing?

After that I'm pretty much ok with priming, back sweetening and bottling.

Thanks in advance.

 

[RobWalker]

malic acid won't work with cider yeast, you need cultured yeast for MLF to take place. you can get this from old rosie bottles if you want it, it imparts a farmyard type taste to it. if you want to avoid that, leave the malic out and just use youngs.

1 - ferment until it's done. i usually clear in the FV before racking.
2 - below 1.000 and no signs of fermentation for a week
3 - yeah, i would. get it off the yeast when you're certain its done (like I say I like to clear in the FV, havnt noticed bad effects) and then mature in the next DJ.
4 - keep it in the cool and dark. sun will affect colour, it only ruins beer as it skunks the hops.
5/6 - i usually only bung it properly if it's a wine that's been stabilized (or a flat cider.) once campden etc is added (you don't really need to do this for cider,) wait 48 hours and bung it. with cider, just keep it under airlock and make sure it's topped up to the neck. where are you storing your dj? i dont think evaporation will be an issue. not in this flippin weather anyway...

 

[Hainsey]

Cheers for the answers Rob,

I didn't know about the mailc acid/cider yeast issue, is Old Rosie yeast the only way to get cultured yeast or can you buy that from somewhere? I think I might leave the malic acid till next time.

I will be storing in shed in the dark.

 

[oldbloke]

1. How long to ferment, 10 days or longer?
2. What gravity should I be aiming for once fermented?
3. Once fermented out, do I rack to another DJ and then mature in that?
4. Is a DJ ok to mature or will UV rays effect taste?
5. If maturing in DJ do I need airlock and if so what do I do about water/vodka in it evaporating?
6. Can I fit a sealed bung whilst maturing?

1. 10 says to 3 weeks, depending on conditions. It will go clear - then you know it's done.
2. Just wait until it clears
3. If you like. I bottle.
4. Yes, it's OK. It's hops that get skunked.
5. I'd use a lock just in case. Just check it every few days
6. Only if you're positive there's no yeast eatign sugar and producing gas

Young's cider yeast doesn't need rehydrating - just chuck it in (not too soon after the tea, if the tea's still hot)
Skip the malic if you're not doing MLF (which you're not with Young's yeast, unless you buy a lactobacillus culture and chuck that in too)
I see nothing in that recipe that needs pectolase - but it can't hurt. My TCs clear all by themselves.
How I do it: http://oldbloke.livejournal.com/745294.html

 

[calumscott]

You can buy it, I can't remember off hand who stocks it but google will be your friend.

If using a commercial culture like that you would add it towards the end of the first flush of fermentation.

You'll also need to mature for many months - don't expect to be drinking it this summer.

If you are looking for cider for the summer, I'd think about a cleaner style, omit the malic, maybe add some other juices to give a little more body (oldbloke has some great ideas) and go with that for this year and do another one late autumn for summer 2014...

 

[Hainsey]

Oldbloke/Calumscott - Thanks for info I'm defo going to skip the malic and pectolase and rehydrating the yeast.

So much info and recipes out there its hard to know where to start sometimes! :hat:

 

[calumscott]

The pectolase is only necessary if you are worried about crystal clear cider - pectins can cause cloudiness/haziness. There's a lot of pectin in apples (why they're so good for making chutney!) but we really have no idea how much makes it into the concentrates that make the juice...

I tend to add it, even though I don't care about haze in ciders...

 

[Beerbellybob]

What the hell is turbo cider it sounds amazing

 

[oldbloke]

What the hell is turbo cider it sounds amazing

That's it, I'm writing a FAQ. I'll need co-authors, starting with GA...

 

[oldbloke]

What the hell is turbo cider it sounds amazing

Cheap and easy to make cider from shop-bought juice.
http://oldbloke.livejournal.com/745294.html is a how-to for the clean style. The farmyard style (I prefer the term 'funky' myself) is marginally more complicated

 

[Hainsey]

What the hell is turbo cider it sounds amazing

Hi Beerbellybob aand welcome to the forum. Turbo CIder (or TC) is basicilly cider made from pure apple juice as apposed to being made from real apples. Its called TC because its faster than pulping apples etc. Oldbloke's blog is a good how to (link is posted further up this topic) or just use the search function for more info.

 

[oldbloke]

Oldbloke/Calumscott - Thanks for info I'm defo going to skip the malic and pectolase and rehydrating the yeast.

So much info and recipes out there its hard to know where to start sometimes! :hat:

Are you going to sweeten at all? If not, the flavour from straight AJ may be a bit lacking. It may be even if you do...
To counter that:
I've tried various 'other juice' as half a litre of each gallon, and cranberry has been my default for rounding out the flavour and mouthfeel without taking over.
But I just bottled on with blueberry, and though it's still 2 weeks off finishing conditioning, the taste off the bottling syphon was great.
Tomorrow I'm bottling one with cherry which I'm also hopeful about.
Pomegranate worked but wasn't "oooo fantastic"
Raspberry I wasn't keen on, ditto mango (which also has pulp problems)

Don't make it any more complicated than that for your first time. You'll be making a lot more, plenty of chances to experiment.

 

[calumscott]

What the hell is turbo cider it sounds amazing

That's it, I'm writing a FAQ. I'll need co-authors, starting with GA...

:clap: :clap: :clap:

Well done that man, long overdue. :thumb:

 

[ScottM]

viewtopic.php?f=48&t=25735

That's the how-to I wrote for the very first TC I made.

Doing it again I would omit the Malic and additional sugars, as by the time it's finished and primed it's above 6% anyway :)

 

[Beerbellybob]

I'm defiantly goin to try this seems so simple

 

[oldbloke]

http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=25735

That's the how-to I wrote for the very first TC I made.

Doing it again I would omit the Malic and additional sugars, as by the time it's finished and primed it's above 6% anyway :)

Yeh, I recall reading it recently, a link to it would deffo be in any FAQ

 

[Hainsey]

Are you going to sweeten at all? If not, the flavour from straight AJ may be a bit lacking. It may be even if you do...
To counter that:

I was going to sweeten it to taste at bottling stage with splenda then add priming sugar and bottle.

 

[Hainsey]

What the hell is turbo cider it sounds amazing

That's it, I'm writing a FAQ. I'll need co-authors, starting with GA...

:clap:

 

[narmour]

Cheers for the answers Rob,

I didn't know about the mailc acid/cider yeast issue, is Old Rosie yeast the only way to get cultured yeast or can you buy that from somewhere? I think I might leave the malic acid till next time.

I will be storing in shed in the dark.

If you're not done fermenting this yet, I have a 5 gallon batch of TC which is going malolactic as we speak. I'm about to rack it and get another brew started so I could send you a sample of the lees and a drop of cider to inoculate your brew with. It should be ripe with bacteria as it has been sitting with the original inoculant in it for about 5 weeks now. The cider has developed a nice spiders web crust so MLF is properly underway now.

The inoculant that I received was from Calum Scott who received it from Greys Alchemy who cultured the bacteria from Old Rosie, so technically mine is a third generation cider, if you want it yours will be a fourth. Lets see how big a cider family tree we can get going!!! Grey's cider already has grandchildren. Grow your own then pass it on.

PM me if you're interested and I'll get your details.

 

[Hainsey]

Cheers for the answers Rob,

I didn't know about the mailc acid/cider yeast issue, is Old Rosie yeast the only way to get cultured yeast or can you buy that from somewhere? I think I might leave the malic acid till next time.

I will be storing in shed in the dark.

If you're not done fermenting this yet, I have a 5 gallon batch of TC which is going malolactic as we speak. I'm about to rack it and get another brew started so I could send you a sample of the lees and a drop of cider to inoculate your brew with. It should be ripe with bacteria as it has been sitting with the original inoculant in it for about 5 weeks now. The cider has developed a nice spiders web crust so MLF is properly underway now.

The inoculant that I received was from Calum Scott who received it from Greys Alchemy who cultured the bacteria from Old Rosie, so technically mine is a third generation cider, if you want it yours will be a fourth. Lets see how big a cider family tree we can get going!!! Grey's cider already has grandchildren. Grow your own then pass it on.

PM me if you're interested and I'll get your details.

Love it, will defo take you up on that thanks very much, I'll PM you my address details also I might need some clear instructions on how t use etc as quite new to this, once I'm done fermenting I'll then offer it up on the forum for others! (might start a new topic though) :party: