Thoughts on first proper AG attempt

[Ale]

Hi all, I've tried one 5L AG brew but something went wrong and it didnt ferment properly so I am trying again. I've bought a Wilko's 12L (ish) stockpot and 10L FV to do a 10L brew. Where will I be going wrong with this recipe or does it look OK to the more experienced brewers. This is using what I have left from the first attempt and I got some cascade hops to add which the man in the HB shop recommended as a popular (or did he mean most expensive) option.

2.3KG Maris Otter Pal
0.5KG Crystal (doesnt have number rating on it)
Mash at 67°C for 60 mins in 7.65L water (3L per KG)
Sparge with 4.35L at approx 80°C to give total of 12L for the boil.

60 min boil with 30g Fuggles added after 10 mins and 15g after 50 mins

Into the FV at 20°C and dry hopped with 25g Cascade hops (in a hop bag) straight after pitching yeast or should I wait.

Then 2+2+2 before drinking if I can wait that long.

So what should I change? Is 12L for 10L in the FV a good guess?

 

[chthon]

A 12l stockpot is too small to boil 12l of wort. You need at least 16l, otherwise it is filled to the rim, and when it starts to boil it will certainly boil over.

Then you have to take into account the necessary evaporation, which is mostly determined by the power of your heat source. 1,5 kW gives an evaporation rate of 2.4 l/hr, 2 kW gives 3,2 l/h. And you do need a whole lot of power to bring the wort to the boil in a reasonable time.

The software I use says 8.4 l for mashing, 6.8 l for sparging.

Seems you should get around 1.060 after boiling, and 33 IBU, which looks a neat little beer. But your stockpot does seem too small. I would at most boil only 9 l in it.

Oh, and while boiling, use a simple ruler to check the evaporation. First, calibrate it with water in your stockpot, and make a table of it, because you have an offset on your ruler. Like 1l = 1,1 cm, 2l = 1,9 cm, etc.

 

[Slid]

I think the Wilko pot I have is 15L to the brim and 12.5L or so to the line that indicates the maximum boil volume.

2.8kg was as much grain as I can mash in this pot.

You don't actually need a vigorous boil on the stove and an inch and a half of headroom is actually fine for a first time.

I would have used a tenth of the Pale Malt weight for the Crystal and that would make the mash, sparge and boil a little easier.

 

[Slid]

The methodology is outlined here:

http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=53598

I also leaned that putting the mash in the oven at 50C - the lowest setting, works very well indeed. Stir it half way through.

Hope this helps. I also added my 10-12L of AG to a kit and brewed it to 25L ususally. A reasonable compromise of quality and quantity.

 

[Ale]

I think the Wilko pot I have is 15L to the brim and 12.5L or so to the line that indicates the maximum boil volume.

2.8kg was as much grain as I can mash in this pot.

You don't actually need a vigorous boil on the stove and an inch and a half of headroom is actually fine for a first time.

I would have used a tenth of the Pale Malt weight for the Crystal and that would make the mash, sparge and boil a little easier.

Sounds like the same one. It didnt say the volume on the packaging but I had seen that this one was 12L on the website a little while ago. As you say, thats the intended maximum it can hold rather than total volume of the pot. Sounds like I'm pretty much on the same wavelength as you, which I will take as a good sign.I can reduce he Crystal, thanks.

What final volume do you get from a 12L boil volume? I will be using gas.

 

[chuffer]

Hi all, I've tried one 5L AG brew but something went wrong and it didnt ferment properly so I am trying again. I've bought a Wilko's 12L (ish) stockpot and 10L FV to do a 10L brew. Where will I be going wrong with this recipe or does it look OK to the more experienced brewers. This is using what I have left from the first attempt and I got some cascade hops to add which the man in the HB shop recommended as a popular (or did he mean most expensive) option.

2.3KG Maris Otter Pal
0.5KG Crystal (doesnt have number rating on it)
Mash at 67°C for 60 mins in 7.65L water (3L per KG)
Sparge with 4.35L at approx 80°C to give total of 12L for the boil.

60 min boil with 30g Fuggles added after 10 mins and 15g after 50 mins

Into the FV at 20°C and dry hopped with 25g Cascade hops (in a hop bag) straight after pitching yeast or should I wait.

Then 2+2+2 before drinking if I can wait that long.

So what should I change? Is 12L for 10L in the FV a good guess?

Not sure if it's the reason it didnt ferment properly but I wouldn't dry hop immediately after pitching yeast. You only dry hop at the end or toward the end of fermentation. Was the hop bag sanitized?

 

[chuffer]

Did you check the pH of the mash? Should have been around 5.2

 

[Ale]

Not sure if it's the reason it didnt ferment properly but I wouldn't dry hop immediately after pitching yeast. You only dry hop at the end or toward the end of fermentation. Was the hop bag sanitized?

This is the new recipe. Dont have the one that went wrong any more.

So if I leave it in the FV for 14 days and dry hop after 7? And yes I will sanitise everything (except the hops and yeast) that comes into contact with the beer after the boil.

 

[Slid]

Sounds like the same one. It didnt say the volume on the packaging but I had seen that this one was 12L on the website a little while ago. As you say, thats the intended maximum it can hold rather than total volume of the pot. Sounds like I'm pretty much on the same wavelength as you, which I will take as a good sign.I can reduce he Crystal, thanks.

What final volume do you get from a 12L boil volume? I will be using gas.

Another useful trick is to sparge out more volume than you can initially boil in one pot. A 2-3L pot can be simmered away alongside the main pot with the hops in it and used to top up the main pot and spin out the final brew length. Adding either table sugar (~200g?) or DME (~300g?) will keep the ABV's in line with most recipes.

 

[Ale]

Just got round to doing this today, six weeks after the original post.

I'm going to increase the Fuggles in the boil to get into the best bitter range. Ive got 69 grams so its all going in. It gives IBU of 45, bang in the middle of strong british ale range that Im heading for (30-60 on Brewers Friend). Pre boil gravity is 1.046, which would be fine as it is but it will only get stronger as it boils and the recipe builder says OG of 1.060 for 10l. for 13l it says 1.046 which is pretty much bang on what it is as I went a little over my 12l including sparge water.

 

[BeerCat]

I would say after reading your first post to go easy on the crystal. Less than 5% is good for most of my recipes and i use less than that most of the time. If your impatient do an IPA style beer and drink after 4 weeks. 2weeks in the FV and 2 weeks in the airing cupboard works for me. Good to see you getting started at AG.

 

[Ale]

All done today. Its not a quick and easy job is it.

But I now have a fraction under 10 litres of beer in my small FV in my brew fridge. OG was 1.056 which gives me an efficiency of about 70%. Im expecting 19 bottles which if I hit target FG will be 5.8% ABV. I will decide if I want to try another AG or stick with kits in 6 weeks time when I drink my first bottle.

 

[IainM]

All done today. Its not a quick and easy job is it.

But I now have a fraction under 10 litres of beer in my small FV in my brew fridge. OG was 1.056 which gives me an efficiency of about 70%. Im expecting 19 bottles which if I hit target FG will be 5.8% ABV. I will decide if I want to try another AG or stick with kits in 6 weeks time when I drink my first bottle.

Welcome to the dark side. There is no going back now.:twisted:

 

[Ale]

Its now bubbling away nicely in my brew fridge. One thing I learned is that I only have 2 stock pots, one of 12l boil volume and one 5l. I moved the grain to the smaller one to sparge and couldnt fit all of the planned sparge water in so did one lot pouring over slowly and then repeated until I had used the planned volume of water. I got 70% efficiency so not too bad. If I do it again I will pour the wort from the mash into smaller pans and use the big one to sparge. If I decide to keep down this route I will add a 30l pot (maybe Grainfather) and use the small pot for sparge water heating.

So my thoughts are turning to batch priming for the first time. Am I right in thinking I need to dissolve the sugar in warm water and then rack the beer onto it and bottle straight away? As I cant use corn sugar as I have an intolerance to it I will use table sugar, about 40-45 grams for what came out at 9.8 litres

 

[chesters-mild]

Welcome to the dark side. There is no going back now.:twisted:

Dead right! Just you wait till you drink the beer :thumb: You will be amazed at the difference between kit and all grain beer, well done and happy quaffing
Cheers

 

[Ale]

Not obvious signs of fermentation yesterday or today so taken a gravity reading this evening. Currently at 1.016. DOuble checked the photo I took of the OG reading and t was only 1.054, not 1.056 that I originally put. Gives an ABV of 4.99% atm. Obviously tasted the sample used for the reading as well. Get a fairly strong fuggles hop flavour. Ive definitely had a few pints in pubs with a very similar and not too bad although its not my favourite.

 

[chub1]

Not obvious signs of fermentation yesterday or today so taken a gravity reading this evening. Currently at 1.016. DOuble checked the photo I took of the OG reading and t was only 1.054, not 1.056 that I originally put. Gives an ABV of 4.99% atm. Obviously tasted the sample used for the reading as well. Get a fairly strong fuggles hop flavour. Ive definitely had a few pints in pubs with a very similar and not too bad although its not my favourite.

I must admit to tasting from my trial jar,however the beer will taste different again once bottled ,carbed and stored a while:thumb:

 

[Ale]

It reached 1.012 which was target gravity so bottled 2 days ago. Batch primed with a hop tea. Very cloudy though. I'll give it 10 days-2 weeks carbonating (maybe sneek a bottle then to try it) and then cool for a couple of weeks and then on the shelf in the garage to condition.