the reason

[micoo]

I think the reason most people get into homebrew is because of the cost. we should not forget this. it is the most fundamental point in HOMEBREWING but i keep seeing AG brewing being pushed as the way forward. AG brewing is an expensive way to home brew, and i believe some kits are as good as any AG. lets push more kits rather than AG.

 

[31bb3]

Im all for kits there good value for money and not time consuming
However i must admit id like a bash at AG but dont know if i can justify the initial expense

 

[Moley]

No, I'm sorry, if you move to AG and once you've offset or disregarded the set-up costs (which don't have to be high), AG is the cheapest way of brewing, followed by kits and finally by extract.

Certainly, it is far more time consuming, but kit beer will always be very evidently kit beer.

Having said that, kits are a bl**dy sight better now than I ever remember them being 30 years ago, and I made a few quite acceptable kit brews before I moved to AG.

But I'll never brew another kit.

 

[Wez]

Hi Micoo

Good thought provoking post.

I'm not sure I 100% agree that the forum doesn't push kits as much as AG I just think we have more AG brewing members, but we are happy to listen to all of our members opinions. What you normally find though is someone who has moved from kits to AG will normally encourage someone interested in doing the same, it's also true though that anyone who is hapy with kits isn't thought any less of, we all homebrewers however it's made. Personally I dont agree that saving money is the most fundamental part of home brewing (like I say thats me personally), I started to brew my own as I was disapointed with the quality of beer in the pubs within walking distance. The money saving is a very welcome side effect :) Brewed kits for about 18 months then after experimenting with dry hopping started to get interested in recipes and then read up on AG and gave it a go. I still make kits up though from time to time.

If what and how you brew works for you then fair play :thumb: it's probably fair to say that the vast majority of people here brew for themselves.

By the way, feel free to post about which kits you think are great, I always liked Muntons Smugglers :drink:

 

[timbowden]

No, I'm sorry, if you move to AG and once you've offset or disregarded the set-up costs (which don't have to be high), AG is the cheapest way of brewing, followed by kits and finally by extract.

Certainly, it is far more time consuming, but kit beer will always be very evidently kit beer.

Having said that, kits are a bl**dy sight better now than I ever remember them being 30 years ago, and I made a few quite acceptable kit brews before I moved to AG.

But I'll never brew another kit.

i agree with moley :thumb:

 

[Moley]

By the way, feel free to post about which kits you think are great, I always liked Muntons Smugglers :drink:

Cooper's Dark Ale worked for me, made with extra spraymalt.
EDME Stout was another good one, stock up now while you can still get it.

I have to confess I've never tried a ‘premium’ 2-can kit, those do seem expensive to me.

 

[corby_brewer]

there are some good kits on the market, e.g, EDME STOUT and WERRY to name two, but as far as AG brewing goes, in the long run it works out cheeper than kit brewing and you get better quality results.

 

[31bb3]

No, I'm sorry, if you move to AG and once you've offset or disregarded the set-up costs (which don't have to be high)

So how much is the cost of a set up ????

 

[corby_brewer]

So how much is the cost of a set up ????

You can get a fully functional AG setup for under £20. Just get yourself a couple of cheepo kettles form asda or tesco and use a FV to make a boiler, and use a cheepo coolbox as a mashtun. or just use a boiler and try the BIAB method.

 

[unclepumble]

Sorry I don't agree with the cost argument, I used to brew kits 20 years ago & I'm only 40 now, I brewed them then because I was interested in making my own beer, sod all to do with cost I brew now because I am interested in making my own beer nothing to do with cost.

I have recently started brewing again, & decided I would either do AG or kits, depending on taste/quality of pint, The only difference between the kit set up and an AG setup was a boiler and a mashtun.

I bought the mash tun (a picnic cooler from an army and navy stores) for £16.00 and the boiler cost me £65.00 from a brewshop, I made a mash strainer out of a s/s flexible tap connector, so less than £100 setup.

I brewed an AG to my own recipe, and brewed a BRUPACKS IPA twin can KIT, all went well with both, however, I still have about 8 pints of the Kit brew in a keg, I have done 2 further AG brews which 1 has gone and the other I am saving for christmas, (however should it have been mid year that would have gone 2). The Kit brew keeps getting overlooked, because it is quite a nice drink but miles away from a homemade AG brew.

The 2 can kit cost me £20, an AG brew of around 5% costs me about £12-14.

Maybe the extra outlay and time taken to do the AG brews is prohibitive to some, but it is worth it for the extra quality and flavour you get.

I quite like Woodfords Kits, one of the best for me, but still more expensive than AG in the longrun, and not as good.

Think a nice home made Chocolate cake with fresh eggs, butter dark chocolate etc, compared to a Sarah Lee Cakemix

 

[dodgyal]

Yup I think of this as a hobby plain and simple, don't mine talking about either kits or AG its all good for a bit of banter. I think there are a few who have gone from kits to AG, and when you are talking about brew days I think the AG's tend to get a little more interesting because of the various methods and kit used. Don't mean were any less interested in the kit brew days its all good! :clap: (Says me on my 7th post lol...)

 

[micoo]

No, I'm sorry, if you move to AG and once you've offset or disregarded the set-up costs (which don't have to be high), AG is the cheapest way of brewing, followed by kits and finally by extract.

Certainly, it is far more time consuming, but kit beer will always be very evidently kit beer.

Having said that, kits are a bl**dy sight better now than I ever remember them being 30 years ago, and I made a few quite acceptable kit brews before I moved to AG.

But I'll never brew another kit.

WHY

 

[corby_brewer]

WHY

do you know anyone who makes AG?

 

[31bb3]

WHY

do you know anyone who makes AG?

only you guys never been lucky enough to sample AG think thats why im reluctant to have a go myself

 

[TheMumbler]

I think the reason most people get into homebrew is because of the cost. we should not forget this. it is the most fundamental point in HOMEBREWING but i keep seeing AG brewing being pushed as the way forward. AG brewing is an expensive way to home brew, and i believe some kits are as good as any AG. lets push more kits rather than AG.

While cost is a factor in homebrewing, I'm not sure it is the only reason that people do it. I think maybe you perceive a bias because there is more discussion of AG perhaps because there is more to discuss. There is the equipment side of it; do you buy it, make it or a combination of both? If you are making your own what design, where do you get the materials. Mash tun designs etc etc. Then there are the recipes. Can you clone this beer or that, has anybody tried it before? Then the ingredients; what hops do you like, which yeasts, what about mash temperature, water treatment... Also people are more likely to feel proud of their own creations and are, therefore, more likely to talk about them.

Kits on the other hand really just boil down to sticking the kit in a bucket as per the instructions. Fair enough there is a bit of room for messing about and improving your results but there is basically less to do, so less discussion. Nothing wrong with kits. Many of them are IMO excellent value for money and they are quick and easy to do. AG on the other hand is a long day at it and there is a lot more room for disaster.

However I like the fact that I can at least try to make any beer I like (including my own recipes) and AG does taste better in my experience, even when a cack handed fool like me is making it

 

[llannige]

I view homebrew as a hobby.Money does not play any part in it.
I would really miss my local and it plays a big part in my life.I love a drink and the time spent with "the boys".You can't really compare the two.There are not many occasions when they don't have tidy guest ales on,and the prices have not gone over the top.
I also love and am proud of the brews that I produce and the feedback that I receive.
Kits are as much a part of homebrewing as is AG,not my bag though but I wont knock it.If you are happy with kits then great,I'm sure you get the same feeling as I do when I sink a few of mine.
There is a place for us all brewers.

Admin,why not start a separate thread for kits and extracts so they don't get lost among the AG threads.I'm sure it will provide a bit of a "higher profile" in the future.

 

[micoo]

yes kits verses AG that would be a fair fight ,,,, lets here from the kit brewers .

 

[Wez]

Admin,why not start a separate thread for kits and extracts so they don't get lost among the AG threads.I'm sure it will provide a bit of a "higher profile" in the future.

Well we have considered that, but..how many kit brewers would go into the AG section, and how many AG brewers would go into the kit section? My guess is....not many.

So by keeping everything together everyone is in the same pot, which is maybe the way it should be? All homebrewers in the same place.

Objective = Make beer
Method = Make beer
Result = Make Beer

:thumb:

 

[Wez]

yes kits verses AG that would be a fair fight ,,,, lets here from the kit brewers .

Why "fight" ?

Look, we like this forum to be one where members help each other, not sure if you meant to try to drive a wedge between AG and Kits, but it does feel like that?

 

[Vossy1]

I quite like this post :grin:

I think the reason most people get into homebrew is because of the cost

Initially I would agree, but once you really get into HB that is less of a factor. I always liked to think I was making beer cheaper and that my costs would re-coup themselves, but I keep finding things to spend my money on :lol:

it is the most fundamental point in HOMEBREWING

If you truley believe that, give it up, it wont pay off. Add your labour costs into the mix and it simply isn't worth it, especially with the price of supermarket bought alcohol.

i keep seeing AG brewing being pushed as the way forward

If you really want to make pub class beers and better, then AG is the only way to do it, sorry that's a fact. Kits are good, some are great, equal to AG, but as they come out of the box they don't even compare to AG brewing regards flexibility.

AG brewing is an expensive way to home brew

It is actually the cheaper than kits, once the offset of gear has been made v time. Naturally you can't compare cheap kits to real AG brewing.

and i believe some kits are as good as any AG

Some kits are, they're great, I loved my 3kg kits.

lets push more kits rather than AG.

As a forum we don't push any method. Our members simply say what they do, AG, kits, wine etc and the way they do it. It would be wrong for any of us to say 'don't do this....do that'. That doesn't mean we can't say what our preferences are based upon experience. Most AG brewers have the priviledge of hindsight and have brewed kits/extract before going AG.....not all kit brewers can say that.
I've enjoyed reading this thread, there are some great replies within it