Steeping worries

[Popspicker]

I told my LHBS that I fancied a go at something similar to TT landlord.
He is the most helpful and patient guy.
I don't like to doubt him but as part of the recipe he gave me a few grains to leave soaking in less than boiling water.
Does this make much difference?

 

[RobWalker]

Yeah. Steeping extracts the colour and flavour from the grains, but not the sugars, you'll want to steep for about half an hour in a few litres of hot water to be sure, then take the grains out and boil that water up in the main boil afterwards. I'm guessing it's a dark malt of sorts?

 

[Popspicker]

Cheers Rob
At least I haven't wasted my time

 

[RobWalker]

Just to give you a general run down too (I only just learned this :p)

If you wanted to mash speciality grains that have no diastatic power (the ability to convert itself into sugar,) then you need to mash the speciality grain with a base grain - 2 row, wheat malt, etc. For partial mash, you can do this (for example) by using 500g of each and topping the rest up with DME/LME when boiling.

Steeping is purely for flavour and colour, but it does make a big difference to the both. The only difference is that it won't create any sugar like mashing will. It's pretty common to have speciality grains in home brew, so maybe you could look into it a little now that you've had a taste :)

 

[Popspicker]

Cheers mate.
There's lots of experimenting to do eh?
Thanks for the info

 

[Popspicker]

You wouldn't happen to have a solid recipe of this type of partial mash for a hoppy bitter/pale ale would you Rob?

 

[RobWalker]

Er, weirdly I do, and I have like 6 recipes on Beersmith. This is a conversion of an award winning american all grain from another forum...there's a lot of ingredients though!

Award winning American IPA
Brew Type: Partial Mash Date: 16/08/2011
Style: American IPA Brewer:
Batch Size: 5.00 gal Assistant Brewer:
Boil Volume: 6.02 gal Boil Time: 90 min
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.0 % Equipment: My Equipment
Actual Efficiency: 76.9 %
Taste Rating (50 possible points): 35.0

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
7.00 lb Pale Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract 71.8 %
1.00 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 10.3 %
0.75 lb Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 7.7 %
0.75 lb Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 7.7 %
0.25 lb Wheat, Torrified (1.7 SRM) Grain 2.6 %
1.00 oz Chinook [13.00%] (30 min) Hops 33.3 IBU
1.00 oz Cascade [5.50%] (30 min) Hops 14.1 IBU
1.25 oz Cascade [5.50%] (15 min) Hops 11.4 IBU
0.50 oz Williamette [5.50%] (15 min) Hops 4.5 IBU
1.00 oz Williamette [5.50%] (5 min) Hops 3.7 IBU
2.00 oz Cascade [5.50%] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
0.25 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs California Ale (White Labs #WLP001) Yeast-Ale

Beer Profile Estimated Original Gravity: 1.065 SG (1.056-1.075 SG) Measured Original Gravity: 1.065 SG
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.014 SG (1.010-1.018 SG) Measured Final Gravity: 1.012 SG
Estimated Color: 10.4 SRM (6.0-15.0 SRM) Color [Color]
Bitterness: 66.9 IBU (40.0-65.0 IBU) Alpha Acid Units: 5.6 AAU
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 6.6 % (5.5-7.5 %) Actual Alcohol by Volume: 6.9 %
Actual Calories: 291 cal/pint

 

[Popspicker]

WOW
That's brilliant !
Thanks Rob, I'm gonna follow that to the letter, for my next attempt.
Appreciate your help mate :clap:

 

[RobWalker]

I suppose the good part is, it's a good way to get stocked up on carapils, munich, torrified wheat etc! :p

 

[Popspicker]

Would that grain be steeped or boiled Rob?

 

[RobWalker]

Hmm. None of those malts have diastatic power, so I suppose we need a sub...

Award winning American IPA
Brew Type: Partial Mash Date: 16/08/2011
Style: American IPA Brewer:
Batch Size: 5.00 gal Assistant Brewer:
Boil Volume: 6.02 gal Boil Time: 90 min
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.0 % Equipment: My Equipment
Actual Efficiency: 74.3 %
Taste Rating (50 possible points): 35.0

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
2.68 kg Pale Liquid Extract (15.8 EBC) Extract 57.9 %
0.70 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (39.4 EBC) Grain 15.2 %
0.45 kg Pale Malt, Maris Otter (5.9 EBC) Grain 9.7 %
0.34 kg Cara-Pils/Dextrine (3.9 EBC) Grain 7.4 %
0.34 kg Munich Malt (17.7 EBC) Grain 7.4 %
0.11 kg Wheat, Torrified (3.3 EBC) Grain 2.5 %
28.35 gm Chinook [13.00%] (30 min) Hops 33.1 IBU
28.35 gm Cascade [5.50%] (30 min) Hops 14.0 IBU
35.44 gm Cascade [5.50%] (15 min) Hops 11.3 IBU
14.17 gm Williamette [5.50%] (15 min) Hops 4.5 IBU
28.35 gm Williamette [5.50%] (5 min) Hops 3.6 IBU
56.70 gm Cascade [5.50%] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
0.25 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs California Ale (White Labs #WLP001) Yeast-Ale

Beer Profile Estimated Original Gravity: 1.065 SG (1.056-1.075 SG) Measured Original Gravity: 1.065 SG
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.015 SG (1.010-1.018 SG) Measured Final Gravity: 1.012 SG
Estimated Color: 21.3 EBC (11.8-29.6 EBC) Color [Color]
Bitterness: 66.6 IBU (40.0-65.0 IBU) Alpha Acid Units: 5.6 AAU
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 6.6 % (5.5-7.5 %) Actual Alcohol by Volume: 6.9 %
Actual Calories: 291 cal/pint

Replace Maris Otter for your favourite base malt and mash. Alternatively, steep them all, use the original recipe and add another 1kg or so of DME.

 

[Aleman]

Hmm. None of those malts have diastatic power,

0.45 kg Pale Malt, Maris Otter (5.9 EBC) Grain

Replace Maris Otter for your favourite base malt and mash. Alternatively, steep them all, use the original recipe and add another 1kg or so of DME.

Actually Maris otter is a variety of pale malt which is a base malt, . . . and has diastatic power . . .so you can do a partial mash which in extract brewing just simply means hold at 65C for 30 minutes before draining off the liquid and adding the liquid to the extract in the boiler. This should be enough to convert the starch in grain and adjunct to prevent a starch haze . . . won't be fully fermentable as a proper mash . . . but that is why its called a partial mash . . . but will add body and 'malt' to the end beer.

Incidentally be very careful when quoting and translating ingredients from the US as the specification of malts (and indeed the names) while sounding very similar to those available in the UK are not actually the same

That Caramel/Crystal Malt at 20 Lovi is not the same as our standard 120EBC (~60L) crystal malt . . .you are probably looking at caragold or caramalt rather than any of the standard crystal malts

 

[Aleman]

Hmm. None of those malts have diastatic power, so I suppose we need a sub...

Award winning American IPA
0.75 lb Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 7.7 %

Didn't really look at the first recipe properly, but Munich Malt is diastatic as well . ..although it's difficult to predict how much more adjunct it can convert in addition to its own weight.

The real way to use it would be to mash the grains until you have a negative starch end point test . . . and have a 1/2lb lager malt on standby just in case it takes to long to convert

 

[Popspicker]

Thanks Rob and Aleman

I think I'm in way above my head now boys, this is getting really scientific eh?
I appreciate your help and I'm prepared to learn though.