So, what’s the point of lager?

[phildo79]

Yes, you could make lager cheaper than you find it in Tesco, but let's be honest, it ain't exactly dear to begin with. I'm partial to a bottle of miller but I wouldn't try and clone it because there seems very little point in doing so. I can't imagine too many of us are quibbling over spending 50p per bottle of lager.

I toyed with the idea of making a lager but when I weighed everything up, it just didn't seem to be worth the hassle. Not when I can pop across the street and pick up a sixer for a fiver.

 

[MickDundee]

Yes, you could make lager cheaper than you find it in Tesco, but let's be honest, it ain't exactly dear to begin with. I'm partial to a bottle of miller but I wouldn't try and clone it because there seems very little point in doing so. I can't imagine too many of us are quibbling over spending 50p per bottle of lager.

I toyed with the idea of making a lager but when I weighed everything up, it just didn't seem to be worth the hassle. Not when I can pop across the street and pick up a sixer for a fiver.

That only holds true if you are planning to make generic cooking lager though, which I can’t imagine many, of any, home brewers plan to do. You can get bottles of Banks bitter for 75p a bottle in Morrisons but nobody says they don’t see the point in brewing bitters - that’s because it’s *****. Same holds for cheap lager.

Brewing “proper” lagers is no different to home brewing bitters, stouts, Blonde ales, APAs etc etc.

 

[strange-steve]

Yes, you could make lager cheaper than you find it in Tesco, but let's be honest, it ain't exactly dear to begin with. I'm partial to a bottle of miller but I wouldn't try and clone it because there seems very little point in doing so. I can't imagine too many of us are quibbling over spending 50p per bottle of lager.

I toyed with the idea of making a lager but when I weighed everything up, it just didn't seem to be worth the hassle. Not when I can pop across the street and pick up a sixer for a fiver.

I've a feeling you're one of those people I was talking about who has never tasted a great lager. As an aside, have you ever wondered why some people make their own bread when you can get a loaf for 80p in Tesco?

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

It is cheaper to make your own beers but for me, and I suspect many others, that’s not the only reason we do it.

There is a great deal of pleasure in crafting something of your own, even better if others appreciate it too.

There’s the pleasure of talking about it with like minded people and comparing notes.

Learning about ingredients, tools, techniques, equipment, solving problems, and learning about all the beer styles is enjoyable.

The engineering nuts (@Buffers brewery) love to combine their interests - or use one to justify outrageous developments of the other.

Competitions wouldn’t be so rewarding if you were voted to have bought the best beer.

Lots more but I don’t want to labour any points

 

[phildo79]

I've a feeling you're one of those people I was talking about who has never tasted a great lager. As an aside, have you ever wondered why some people make their own bread when you can get a loaf for 80p in Tesco?

Name some and I'll tell you if I've tried them or not. Does it take 8 weeks to make a loaf of bread?

That only holds true if you are planning to make generic cooking lager though, which I can’t imagine many, of any, home brewers plan to do. You can get bottles of Banks bitter for 75p a bottle in Morrisons but nobody says they don’t see the point in brewing bitters - that’s because it’s *****. Same holds for cheap lager.

Brewing “proper” lagers is no different to home brewing bitters, stouts, Blonde ales, APAs etc etc.

Define proper lager. And don't say Corona.

 

[dad_of_jon]

I've a feeling you're one of those people I was talking about who has never tasted a great lager. As an aside, have you ever wondered why some people make their own bread when you can get a loaf for 80p in Tesco?

Hmmm... This had me thinking, I remember the days when Stella really was an amazing premium lager. I also understood when I went to prague a few years ago what a good lager was, although my taste buds have changed. I can appreciate a tidy lager but no longer have lager on my list of go-tos. I did to a cali common recently (but galaxy hopped it) and that was as near as I want to go. I'm not one for industrial scale pish of any style of beer, thats why I brew because these days there are good beers in the supermarket and they fill in the gaps for stuff I can't make and mine fill in the gaps for beers I can't buy.

 

[MickDundee]

Name some and I'll tell you if I've tried them or not. Does it take 8 weeks to make a loaf of bread?


Define proper lager. And don't say Corona.

I already mentioned some reasonably readily available German pilsners in my previous post - Flensburger, Paulaner and Hacker-Pschorr. I’m not saying these are the epitome of lager but all very quaffable, about 100 times nicer than your 20 for a tenner cooking lager, and about the same price as supermarket “craft” beers.

 

[strange-steve]

Name some and I'll tell you if I've tried them or not. Does it take 8 weeks to make a loaf of bread?

OK ill rephrase that. I've a feeling you're one of those people I was talking about who subjectively speaking has never tasted what they would consider a great lager.

Many of us have and so absolutely believe it is worth the hassle. And since you used the word hassle I assumed you were talking about effort rather than time frame, hence the bread analogy.

 

[MickDundee]

I've a feeling you're one of those people I was talking about who has never tasted a great lager. As an aside, have you ever wondered why some people make their own bread when you can get a loaf for 80p in Tesco?

Hey big spender - we get the 55p loaves!

 

[Buffers brewery]

It is cheaper to make your own beers but for me, and I suspect many others, that’s not the only reason we do it.

There is a great deal of pleasure in crafting something of your own, even better if others appreciate it too.

There’s the pleasure of talking about it with like minded people and comparing notes.

Learning about ingredients, tools, techniques, equipment, solving problems, and learning about all the beer styles is enjoyable.

The engineering nuts (@Buffers brewery) love to combine their interests - or use one to justify outrageous developments of the other.

Competitions wouldn’t be so rewarding if you were voted to have bought the best beer.

Lots more but I don’t want to labour any points

Talking of “engineering nuts” and “outrageous developments” I’m on the case right now. Making a little video as well. Not sure where I should post it, “joke of the day” or “how are you keeping busy during isolation”

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

you can get a loaf for 80p in Tesco?

Hey big spender - we get the 55p loaves!

Game on! Who can make the best lager using your breads - at least 25% of the grain bill to be breadcrumbs!

 

[phildo79]

OK ill rephrase that. I've a feeling you're one of those people I was talking about who subjectively speaking has never tasted what they would consider a great lager.

Many of us have and so absolutely believe it is worth the hassle. And since you used the word hassle I assumed you were talking about effort rather than time frame, hence the bread analogy.

I've tried loads of great lagers. But are those lagers readily available in the shops? No, no they are not.

I did say that I wasn't sure why someone would make a beer that is readily available in the shops.

I already mentioned some reasonably readily available German pilsners in my previous post - Flensburger, Paulaner and Hacker-Pschorr. I’m not saying these are the epitome of lager but all very quaffable, about 100 times nicer than your 20 for a tenner cooking lager, and about the same price as supermarket “craft” beers.

Well I wouldn't go as far as that. Sure, they are better than bland ***** like carlsberg, Carling etc. but nothing to write home about IMO. And they are more expensive. If they are £2 a bottle, that's £40 for 20, as supposed to a tenner. Yes, I'm sure we can all afford £40 but would you want to be spending that on beer every time you went to the supermarket?

Scale needs to be taken into consideration when talking about affordability. I don't consider buying the odd can of craft beer a splurge but I would if I was buying 20 of them.

 

[strange-steve]

I've tried loads of great lagers. But are those lagers readily available in the shops? No, no they are not.

I did say that I wasn't sure why someone would make a beer that is readily available in the shops.

In which case I'm not really sure what your point is.

I don't think anyone here was suggesting the OP brews a Coors Light clone, but if they were then I agree, it's not worth the hassle. If though the suggestion was that it's very possible to brew a great lager, are you still saying it's not worth it?

 

[phildo79]

For me, I probably wouldn't. But I am impatient and much prefer stouts and hoppy beers. If I were to do it, it would need to be a solid recipe of a lager that I had already tried and rated very highly.

But if you had that and weren't put off by the lagering time, go for it.

My original comment was based on making something akin to what's on the supermarket shelves.

 

[strange-steve]

Fair enough then

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

I don't think anyone here was suggesting the OP brews a Coors Light clone, but if they were then I agree, it's not worth the hassle.

Indeed. My hope is to brew something that’s an improvement on shop bought lagers. I know good lagers are available from on-line beer companies but these are definitely more pricey, starting around £1 per 100ml.

I have several ales when family come round but don’t have anything for the lager drinkers other than shop bought stuff that’s probably just OK. I’d like to make something nice for them. I may have to pick a style to start, or maybe just pick a recipe.

Also see my post about there being reasons for brewing beyond cost, I’d be happy to pay £1/100ml for my friends but I’d rather makes them something nice if I can.

 

[johncrobinson]

It might seem obvios that there is money to be saved in brewing our own
But i really dont think thats why most of us do it.Its a factor sure but homebrew for many is the elusive quest for my perfect pint or glass of wine.

 

[HoppyTommy]

Lagers and ales take the same amount of time roughly to ferment and produce alcohol, it's just IPAs benefit from being drunk quickly as hop character dissipates quite quickly, whereas lager benefits from extra conditioning time. You can ferment a lager in 2 weeks, bottle condition it for another 2 weeks and drink. It won't be bad necessarily, it's just lagering it will make it taste quite a bit nicer and also clear the beer. There's also this Brulosophy quick lager method I've tried a couple of times. It does speed things up a bit but I still think leaving the beer for a while helps. Then again, I bottle all my beer, maybe kegging and force carbing has "quicker" results.

I've had some really good results from the Brulosophy lagering technique. For those who can't be bothered to look at the article, I had to recently simplify for my dad and came up with the following.

Fermentation guide
Pitch at 20c.
Set fridge to 11c. 8 days Gravities should be half way there.
Increase temperature by 2c every 12 hrs until 19c reached.
Leave about 4-10 day (7 days) days until FG reached.
Reduce temperature by 2c every 12hrs until down to 1c. Then leave for 5 days.

 

[Dutto]

..... I had to recently simplify for my dad and came up with the following.

Fermentation guide
Pitch at 20c.
Set fridge to 11c. 8 days Gravities should be half way there.
Increase temperature by 2c every 12 hrs until 19c reached.
Leave about 4-10 day (7 days) days until FG reached.
Reduce temperature by 2c every 12hrs until down to 1c. Then leave for 5 days.

That's "simple"?

I'll be honest, I can't taste a difference between most of the systems I have tried, with the exception of leaving it to condition for many weeks!

This constant adjustment of temperature reminds me of the dozens of minute Hop Additions that are promulgated by the so called connoisseurs as "improving" something or other.

For me, brewing should be a pleasure, not something that takes up hours of my time and patience in the rather spurious belief that, sometime in the distant future, I will taste something better.

It's much easier to brew it, cold crash it, carbonate it and then let it sit on a shelf for ten or more weeks. In the meantime, I can brew something that doesn't need the same amount of conditioning time!

 

[Mr_S_Jerusalem]

message edited massively due to its stupidity and inability to locate a delete button