Recipe volumes check, please

[Jmio]

Hi all!

Made a mistake with the volumes on my first recipe due to an incorrect equipment profile in the recipe calculator tool.
This Sunday we want to brew it again but with the correct quantities to try to learn from the differences between both beers.
I would appreciate your review of the new recipe:

BIAB Full Volume (No Sparge)
19 L kettle
Grains
Maris Otter 6 EBC	2.000 g	90.9%
Crystal Extra Dark 240 EBC	200 g	9.1%
Hops
East Kent Goldings 6%	10 g	60 min (boil)
Fuggle 4.2%	5g	20 min (boil)
Yeast
Safale S-04	7 g
Mash
Initial Water Volume	13.69 L
Hopstand Temp	67°
Mash Temp	65°
Time	1 h
Pre-Boil Gravity	1.037
Boil
Grain Absorption Rate	0.67 L/Kg
Water/Grain Ratio	2.7 L/Kg
Original Gravity	1.045
Boil Off (1 h)	2.3 L
Fermenter
Batch Volume (Fermenter)	10 L
Fermenter Loss	2 L
Bottling volume	8L
Final Gravity	1.011
Brewhouse Efficiency	65%
ABV	4.5%
IBU	21
Color	27 EBC

Thank you!

 

[The Biochemist]

Overall looks good to me

Couple of little points:
-You water/ grist ratio is 6.2 L/Kg rather than 2.7
-I think you mean ‘strike water’ in place of ‘hop stand’
-Are you sure you’re only getting 65% efficiency? Chances are it might be a few points higher…

Sounds tasty though!

 

[Jmio]

Overall looks good to me

Couple of little points:
-You water/ grist ratio is 6.2 L/Kg rather than 2.7
-I think you mean ‘strike water’ in place of ‘hop stand’
-Are you sure you’re only getting 65% efficiency? Chances are it might be a few points higher…

Sounds tasty though!

Awesome! Thanks a lot!

- I think the water / grist ratio comes from the calculator... I will check if I can edit it and if any of the other values change
- Yes, I meant Strike water... Still mixing up the terms...
- After the first brew, I posted my measurements somewhere else and was told that my efficiency was '89%, too high for a first brew'. I tried to be more conservative in my estimations. I have changed it to 75% in the calculator and the ABV has raised to 5.1%, which is ok with me. I think nothing else has changed.

Cheers!

 

[Jim Brewster]

Your mash will be quite thin with 2.2kg of grain in 13.69 litres. The maximum ratio is usually taken as around 4:1 which would be 8.8L for the mash. The theory is that too thin a mash can dilute the enzymes too much and efficiency drops. Traditionally you would have a thicker mash and make up the rest of the volume with sparging, this improves efficiency if that is something you want to do.

75% efficiency seems a decent starting point. You can always adjust it up or down next time once you have a rough idea of what you're getting. If your actual gravity is higher than the target then you can always "liquor back" i.e. add more water to the wort to hit your target gravity with a slightly larger volume.

 

[foxy]

As you are 'BIAB' with 'No Sparge' then it's possible to get 80% two things squeeze every last drop of wort out of the bag and be sure to have a fine crush.
All my brews are full volume in a Guten, I get 65% with a finer crush.
Your grain absorption rate looks a bit low too.

 

[The Baron]

I usually use 19/20ltr in a 21ltr brew to mash with approx 4kg of grain and get 75%+ Eff and that is good enough for me I do not chase Eff too much (would rather add a little more grain) as long as it is reasonable but prefer a looser mash(less chance of a stuck one IMO) than what is sometimes recommended but every brewer is different so look at all the answers and I am sure you will fathom out a system that works for you.
Ps I would swap your hops around and use the Fuggles earlier in the brew and the EKG later as more flavour/aroma just my preference

 

[Jmio]

@Jim Brewster, I didn't know about the efficiency drop of a thin mash. As this will be our second brew only, we don't care much about efficiency, but for sure we will try sparging in future brews.

@foxy, I read in some forums that a common grain absorption rate value is 0.08 gallons per pound, which I believe is 0.67L/kg. My grains have a fine crush. Which rate would you recommend? I think It has a direct impact (although not too heavy) on the initial water volume, which was my mistake on my first batch.

@the baron, our plan for this next brew is to 'fix' our first recipe to try to notice the differences, but the next one could be swapping both hops. Nice idea!

Thank you, guys!

 

[The Biochemist]

When you say fix, what was wrong with it? Was it drinkable?

 

[The Baron]

I would always use EKG near the end of a brew just for flavour and aroma above Fuggles but this is always subjective as brewers tastes are different so by all means do experiment

 

[Jmio]

When you say fix, what was wrong with it? Was it drinkable?

The problem was an incorrect equipment profile in the app I did use to get the water and grains quantities, which ended with only 1.5kg of grains in almost 14l of water for the mash.

It's drinkable, but without much body, as expected. We will let it age for a some weeks anyway.

 

[The Biochemist]

That’s fine, just call it a table beer and it’s spot on!

Don’t leave it too long though - small beers don’t generally age as well as their bigger brothers…

 

[foxy]

@Jim Brewster, I didn't know about the efficiency drop of a thin mash. As this will be our second brew only, we don't care much about efficiency, but for sure we will try sparging in future brews.

@foxy, I read in some forums that a common grain absorption rate value is 0.08 gallons per pound, which I believe is 0.67L/kg. My grains have a fine crush. Which rate would you recommend? I think It has a direct impact (although not too heavy) on the initial water volume, which was my mistake on my first batch.

@the baron, our plan for this next brew is to 'fix' our first recipe to try to notice the differences, but the next one could be swapping both hops. Nice idea!

Thank you, guys!

There is one very simple explanation for efficiency drop when full volume mashing. There are sugars remaining in the grain which are not rinsed out by the sparge.
A common rule of thumb is 1 litre per kilo loss to grain absorption, for me I go for around 0,750 litres to each kg of grain but I do go to the extreme of weighing down the grain with a tub of 20 litres of water and me pushing down on the tub.

As Baron says don't get hung up on efficiency, your efficiency will be how you brew, it isn't a competition.

 

[The Biochemist]

As Baron says don't get hung up on efficiency, your efficiency will be how you brew, it isn't a competition.

Couldn’t agree more - much better a tasty brew at 60% than a meh one at 90%! You’ll learn the efficiency of your system with time which will make you recipe design more accurate, but it really isn’t something to stress about!

 

[Eskdale]

Once you have familiarised yourself with your set up and your method the only thing that can set your programmed figures awry is your grain crush.
Thankfully I have been gifted a mill and have more confidence in hitting the numbers I am aiming for.
But you will get there.

Emma