Questions about Rehydrataing Dry Yeast Packets.

[SkyStar]

Hellows guys, after reading so many threads and web-guides and some bio-chemical behaviours about yeast cells, i still can't find someone that can post how much difference there is between rehydrataing dry yeast packets instead of just pitching the packet directly in the wort.

I've read that if you just pitch the packet (from the beer kit) direct in your fermentator 50% of yeast cells will get instant killed due to extreme stress-shock during their "adaptation phase", however... i'm very insterested on rehydrataing my yeast (i've never done this before), but i've read so many guidelines and i'm so confused.
1. assuming that i have a 6grams yeast pack, how much water to i have to put in the sanitized glass?
2. Some brewers says that if i put sterilized water instead of classic water i will probably kill even more yeast becasue the sterilized water does not contains any light-grade nutrients for the yeast.
3 Is true that if i put the yeast in a mix of dextrose-water or DME-Water my yeast will become the "strongest and most powerful" yeast on the planet and and won't even die when thrown in the fermentator?
4. I'm confused on how do i should do the last phase of rehydrataion: after mixing and gently stirring the yeast+water mixture, do i have to directly to puour the rehydrated yeast in the fermentator or i have to wait 20-40 minutes to let the yeast adpatate and start to multiplicate itself before pouring? @.@ thank you so much for your help guys!!


OH and the last point: do you feel the difference taste between a rehydratated-yeast beer compared to a directly spinkrled yeast beer? does it tastes much better?

 

[Robin54]

Interesting questions and I may well be wrong in my beliefs, and Im sure others on here will be more knowledgable than me, but getting the impression you are being bamboozled by a load of horlicks.
If a kit says chuck in dry yeast, why would do something different.
All this stuff about 'yeast shock'...I would love to see a proper scientific paper, (peer reviewed)proving this beyond doubt. Mind you the vast majority of scientific papers these days can prove anything the author wants.
Making a yeast starter may be worthwhile, in order to get a brew going sooner, but Ive never done it myself..........except when making complicated bread.

 

[terrym]

There was a similar thread to this some weeks back
http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=57668

 

[MyQul]

I'm a lazy buggerad can never be bothered to re-hydrate dry yeast. I've never have one fail yet. But....I always use 10g-11g packs. At 6g your more than likely underpitching anyway and sprinkling the yeasy may kill up to 50% of it, that being so your severely underpitching and probably heading for a stuck brew

 

[brumbrew]

I've got the brewing elements book on yeast. Very informative.

Your starter wort with dme should be boiled and cooled with a gravity of no more that 1.038 if I remember correctly.

It just gives the yeast a chance to begin feeding on what it will be eating for the next two weeks.

I've found fermentation starts quicker and with move vim when a starter or rehdrated yeast is used.

This surely would give a better flavour profile, or at least no 'off' esters that are caused by stressed yeast.

I only ever pitch direct onto wort for swmbos wines.

 

[Brew_DD2]

I always read that for a simple beer under 1.050 you should rehydrate dry yeast in water not wort, as osmotic pressure or a sugar solution would kill a significant proportion of yeast cells.

For bigger beers, I always go for a starter so I don't get any off flavours from stressing the yeast.

That being said, plenty of people do none of the above and are happy with the results.

 

[SkyStar]

I'm a lazy buggerad can never be bothered to re-hydrate dry yeast. I've never have one fail yet. But....I always use 10g-11g packs. At 6g your more than likely underpitching anyway and sprinkling the yeasy may kill up to 50% of it, that being so your severely underpitching and probably heading for a stuck brew

thats what i'm thinking too, 90% of my brews are from muntons cans and they put only 6g packs for every 1can-2can kits, anyways if youre not using the kit's yeast, wich yeast extactly do you use? for the next time when ill go to my homebrewshop

 

[johnnyboy1965]

thats what i'm thinking too, 90% of my brews are from muntons cans and they put only 6g packs for every 1can-2can kits, anyways if youre not using the kit's yeast, wich yeast extactly do you use? for the next time when ill go to my homebrewshop :
SO-4 is very neutral and gets good results. Fermentis also state that it doesnt matter if you re-hydrate their yeast.

 

[MyQul]

thats what i'm thinking too, 90% of my brews are from muntons cans and they put only 6g packs for every 1can-2can kits, anyways if youre not using the kit's yeast, wich yeast extactly do you use? for the next time when ill go to my homebrewshop

Personally, all kinds. Dried yeast, liquid yeast that I've bought and yeast I've cultured up from bottle conditioned beers. But either US-05 or S0-4, or Wilko ale yeast (which is really just nottingham yeast) are all good dried choices which are fairly cheap. Especially the wilko yeast, it's only £1.75 per pack

 

[johnnyboy1965]

Fermentis have just changed their website instructions, and are now saying its best to re-hydrate the yeast in 10 x the volume of water

But on the Safeale website it states either/or.......I wish they would make their minds up.

 

[Brew_Mike]

Interesting questions and I may well be wrong in my beliefs, and Im sure others on here will be more knowledgable than me, but getting the impression you are being bamboozled by a load of horlicks.
If a kit says chuck in dry yeast, why would do something different.
All this stuff about 'yeast shock'...I would love to see a proper scientific paper, (peer reviewed)proving this beyond doubt. Mind you the vast majority of scientific papers these days can prove anything the author wants.
Making a yeast starter may be worthwhile, in order to get a brew going sooner, but Ive never done it myself..........except when making complicated bread.

We were lucky to have Dr Clayton Cone the guy who ran Danstar yeast labs give a talk at the club, and he stated that in all the tests they did, they saw as much as a 50% drop in viability between yeast "Just bunged in" and yeast rehydrated properly. They also did the experiments to determine just what the proper temperatures and conditions were for their products. . . I am sure if you pay for the access you can get the extracts for the proper peer reviewed papers.

One thing I've found that is really confusing is just what people refer to as 'rehydration'. Use water, just water, the minute you see them talking about adding sugars or extracts that is not rehydration.

6g of dried yeast is pretty marginal for pitching 5 gallons of beer, even over here with our smaller gallons Then if you consider you loose 50% by not rehydrating, you can see that you are not creating the best conditions to brew great beer.

If a kit says put the beer in a warm place to ferment, would you?? The same applies to why you choose to rehydrate, to give yourself the opportunity to create the best beer you can.

 

[SkyStar]

Fermentis have just changed their website instructions, and are now saying its best to re-hydrate the yeast in 10 x the volume of water

But on the Safeale website it states either/or.......I wish they would make their minds up.

they reccomend any type of viabilty date on their dry packets? like in how long time it can be used?

 

[HisDudeness]

+1 for Wilko (gervin) Nottingham yeast, cheap reliable and clears really well sediment sticks in the bottle better than anything else I have used too. It finishes quite dry and is pretty clean so can be used in most styles unless you need something a bit more estery.

As for rehydrating its not essential but personally I have found some fermentations to start quicker when the yeast has been rehydrated (presumably due to a greater percentage of cells making it alive into the wort). I agree with MyQul that its probably more important if you only have a small yeast packet and/or its a bit old.

If you do rehydrate I would definitely leave it for 20-30 mins to absorb the water as otherwise its a pointless exercise, most of the cells will still be dry if you chuck it straight in.

This article is well worth a read for a bit more info

http://brulosophy.com/2014/09/15/sprinkled-vs-rehydrated-dry-yeast-exbeeriment-results/

 

[dad_of_jon]

Hellows guys, after reading so many threads and web-guides and some bio-chemical behaviours about yeast cells, i still can't find someone that can post how much difference there is between rehydrataing dry yeast packets instead of just pitching the packet directly in the wort.

Hi, the text below is taken from the Mangrove Jacks Craft Series Dried Beer Yeast Strains guide

http://culturesforhealth.com/media/docs/MJCSA5_Yeast.pdf

Although Mangrove Jack’s Craft Series Yeasts do not require pre-hydration,
cleaner and more professional results may be produced if rehydrated
before use.

For all strains except the Bohemian Lager Yeast, add the sachet contents
to 100ml of water previously adjusted to a temperature between (30��"35°C).

For Bohemian Lager Yeast, rehydrate using 3.4 fl.oz (100 ml) of (20��"25°C) water.

Stir gently into a yeast cream for between 8 and 12 minutes then add yeast cream directly to wort. Alternatively the dry yeast can be added directly into the wort by sprinkling onto the surface and leaving to stand for 10-15 minutes before stirring.

In most cases Mangrove Jack’s Beer Yeast can be used at a ratio of one
10 gram pack for up to 6.6 US gal (25L). However, for best results take note of the following exceptions to the rule:

EXCEPTION RECOMMENDATION
Ales of original gravity over 1.050
Lagers to be fermented at 57°F (14°C) or lower

Under-pitching yeast in lagers or stronger ales will result in extended
lag times (the time between pitching your yeast and the commencement
of fermentation) which can allow undesirable microbes to multiply,
tainting your beer. The yeast will become “stressed” and may produce
excessive and undesirable fruity esters and/or sulphur compounds.
High end gravities are also possible where lower pitch rates are used,
leading to sweet and worty unfinished beer.

Number of Sachets to Use
Use 2 x 10g packets
per 6.6 US Gal (25L)

WATER TEMP: all strains except bohemian lager yeast
(30��"35°C)

WATER TEMP:bohemian lager yeast
(20-25°C)

3.4 fl.oz
(100 ml)
WATER

Store in original packaging at below 50°F (10°C) for optimum 30 month life.
At 68°F (20°C) storage temperature viability will remain high for 12 months.
At 86°F (30°C) storage temperature viability will remain high for 4 months.
Above 86°F (30°C) viability and yeast condition will become seriously
compromised within 6 weeks

 

[chub1]

As a novice i have tried both sprinkling and re hydrating and to be honest have not noticed any discernable difference!

 

[dad_of_jon]

As a novice i have tried both sprinkling and re hydrating and to be honest have not noticed any discernible difference!

I've found re: fermentation that re-hydrated gets going so much quicker! (so less chance of infection) pitched at 3pm - bubbling away by 9pm

 

[Covrich]

thats what i'm thinking too, 90% of my brews are from muntons cans and they put only 6g packs for every 1can-2can kits, anyways if youre not using the kit's yeast, wich yeast extactly do you use? for the next time when ill go to my homebrewshop :
SO-4 is very neutral and gets good results. Fermentis also state that it doesnt matter if you re-hydrate their yeast.

If you're looking for neutral, US05 is very neutral (as is Nottingham)

S04 is an English style one which attenuates less and leaves more esters.. I wouldn't say that is neutral at all.

@skystar to be honest there are hundreds of yeasts out there when you look into liquids.. but even at dry yeasts you pick the yeast to suit the style you make.. if you're new to brewing and not sure what to pick you could ask for a suggestion here or just use what comes with it for now..

For example, If you make an American IPA you could go US05, if you're making a Saison you could use a dry saison yeast (tbf not a good example you're probably better off going liquid there).

There are 100s of different ones to try even for English Ales. Just like Hops so many to choose from with flavours

Like John Palmer says why go to all the trouble of agonising over your malts and your hops to then throw some generic yeast in which lends itself no character.

 

[chub1]

I've found re: fermentation that re-hydrated gets going so much quicker! (so less chance of infection) pitched at 3pm - bubbling away by 9pm

Will have to try more re hydrating then. Would that be the case with any yeast, as i have only ever used either kit yeast's or Wilko Gervin and that's it?

 

[Covrich]

Will have to try more re hydrating then. Would that be the case with any yeast, as i have only ever used either kit yeast's or Wilko Gervin and that's it?

Probabaly more of a reason to do it with kit yeast especially if they include only a 6gram pack

 

[dad_of_jon]

Will have to try more re hydrating then. Would that be the case with any yeast, as i have only ever used either kit yeast's or Wilko Gervin and that's it?

yes and the rehydrating temp for the water (or liquor if you're a purist) is normally higher than the fermenting temp.

+1 for covrich's comment