Made my first cider....but

[Neil Whittaker]

Hello,
Been AG brewing for a while but recently I picked raspberries, rhubarb & strawberries. So I thought, I'll try a cider.
Extracted the juice by leaving with sugar on top. Simmered the juice at 70C to pasteurize, cooled, topped up with apple juice. Did not have any cider yeast, so used recycled voss and 20psi. OG 1.046 FG 1.008
The result is a little tart, sharpe, sour. The wife said bitter. Still more than drinkable. Some people might even like it this way.

I had no expectations, just a experiment. What would I do in the future to have a more sweet, less sour result?

 

[Neil Whittaker]

Couple of pics

 

[Griff097]

From what I have read about turbo ciders, if you don't use a cider yeast with a sweetener they turn out quite dry, same if you use a champagne yeast.
I have my first turbo fermenting now as well.
Look in ebay etc for Cider yeast with sweetener.
You could also 'back sweeten' to your taste with an artificial sweetener, not sugar/honey etc as that will kick off fermentation and make it stronger and dryer.

 

[Neil Whittaker]

Oh interesting. So I could add either lactose or maybe a sweetener to the mix to balance try and balance it back out.
It is in a keg @ 3c, so getting it to dissolve might be a challenge.

 

[Tavi-brewer]

Hi Neil
It’s always tricky sweetening a cider due to the ABV. Your starting gravity was spot on for around 6%. I use Mangrove Jack M02 and brew it dry as a bone, let it clear and rack it off. I then hit it with metabisulphite and pot sorbate to stabilise and backseeeten with around 100g sugar per gallon. You’ll need to experiment for your taste but this comes out with just a hint of sweet.
The important bit now is to let it sit a while until you are absolutely sure there’s no slight secondary fermentation. You may get a slight haze but don’t worry just let this drop out. Rack it a final time before bottling. I used to put my bottles in a box under the stairs until I was sure they were safe! Never had an issue thankful.
What you don’t want is exploding bottles so be careful
Most people have a variation to this and it would be good to hear what their thoughts are
Good luck
T

 

[Cwrw666]

What would I do in the future to have a more sweet, less sour result?

Like beer, cider improves considerably with keeping.
I've never had success with sweetening it but it does mellow out with time and you soon get used to it.

 

[Paul Roberts]

I've used a sweetner such as erythritol.

 

[Neil Whittaker]

Thank you all for the suggestions. The plan is:
Boil a small amount of water (100ml) and add 10 sweeteners, let the mixture cool.
Pull a 200ml glass, and keep adding the sweetener mixture till it tastes more balanced.

Do some math, confuse myself, inject the lot directly into the keg using my Kegland T-piece and beer bottle.
I'll post some pictures and tasting notes tomorrow.

 

[Tavi-brewer]

Sounds like a plan
I can’t take sweeteners so don’t t use them. Wish I could as it would make things a little simpler.
I get a horrible bitter tang when I have them. Haven’t had Dr Pepper, 7 Up or the like since . Anyone else?

 

[Neil Whittaker]

Yeah, My wife wanted to cut down on sugar in here hot drinks. The first few brands were very bitter. She then bought Saccharin based, Slimmer Sweetener, which are really cheap and they are much nicer.

 

[Neil Whittaker]

Right done, went with 15 sweeteners in about 9L. I think I'll give it the weekend before i give it a taste again.

When i was "testing", it both had a sweeter taste, but remained sharp. Only time will tell.

How I inject it into the keg:

 

[David_M]

Hi, I use Morrisons sucralose granulated sweetener. Same sweetener as Splenda but cheaper. 30g in 23 litres of cider takes the edge off just enough for my taste.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

I have read these sweeteners can give an off flavour but i am not sure if this is one of them.

 

[Griff097]

Hi, I use Morrisons sucralose granulated sweetener. Same sweetener as Splenda but cheaper. 30g in 23 litres of cider takes the edge off just enough for my taste.View attachment 51797

Have you tried leaving it for a super long conditioning period instead?

 

[David_M]

I have read these sweeteners can give an off flavour but i am not sure if this is one of them.

No off flavours or bitter after taste. If you look it up on the Internet it seems that the starting point in the manufacture of sucralose is sucrose.

 

[David_M]

Have you tried leaving it for a super long conditioning period instead?

Very dry is very dry, even after a long conditioning period. I batch prime and bottle, so weighing out and adding the sucralose at that point is only a minor additional step.

 

[Neil Whittaker]

For science, I will try it tonight and report back.

 

[Dazzelknight]

I use this, not the cheapest but tastes great, and after doing a little research this sweetener does not give you the green apple splatters !

 

[Nicks90]

If its really sharp, it could be that the cider is too acidic. If you have some pH testing strips you can easily check. I think you should be looking at about a pH of 3.5 to 4 for cider.
You could try an experiment with a bottle that you already have and dissolve a little calcium carbonate - literally a tiny tiny amount on the end of your finger nail - in 5ml of water and pour your cider over it. Has the sharpness gone?
Other alternative is to leave it to condition and it should undergo malolactic (I think that's what it's called) reaction, which takes a lot of sharpness away.
I did a vimto cider as my first tc and it was rather [cough] tart. 6 months later I found a few bottles and it was lush!!!

 

[Neil Whittaker]

Right then..... I let it have a little time in the keg and i've served it upto a couple of people.
Overall they really liked it and would be quite happy to have been given that in a pub. My wife is not as easily convinced though.
I'd say the main criticism was they would have liked more punch from the fruit I put in.

@Nicks90 - Hard to be objective, but it is only a little sharp now with just a week in the keg. I'll measure the PH tonight and see what it comes out as. Raising the PH sounds like an interesting experiment.