It's flat again...

[chojo]

Right I'm getting more than a little pissed off with this, I'm on my fourth brew now and once again it's flat. The first two I found out my barrels were leaking but the last two have been in bottles one in glass the other in p.e.t's. the plastic is rock hard after two weeks in the warm but after going in the cold when I open them I get all the co2 escaping like dry ice and a flat pint it's as if no matter what I do any gas produced just sits on top and is not absorbed at all by the beer. Any ideas before I chuck the lot through the window. Funny thing is the raspberryade that I made was fizzy and I hadn't primed that yet!

 

[SloeBrewer]

How much priming sugar are you using? Should be half a teaspoon per 500 ml bottle for ales, 1 teaspoon for lager. I batch prime, so tend to add 80g sugar per 23 litre batch, for beer. How cold are you serving the beer? If it's too cold, the CO2 will be absorbed by your beer. Try serving at 13C.

 

[JimmyB78]

Could be the glass you're using, sometimes dishwashers leave a bit of detergent/rinse aid which stops the co2 from forming the bubbles. It's why lager glasses in pubs have 'headesaver' bits on the bottom.

Probably something else but worth checking in case it's something that simple.

 

[Hawks]

How long has it been sat in the cold as well ?

 

[IPA]

Right I'm getting more than a little pissed off with this, I'm on my fourth brew now and once again it's flat. The first two I found out my barrels were leaking but the last two have been in bottles one in glass the other in p.e.t's. the plastic is rock hard after two weeks in the warm but after going in the cold when I open them I get all the co2 escaping like dry ice and a flat pint it's as if no matter what I do any gas produced just sits on top and is not absorbed at all by the beer. Any ideas before I chuck the lot through the window. Funny thing is the raspberryade that I made was fizzy and I hadn't primed that yet!

Don't be impatient. Leave bottles for six weeks to condition. Barrels condition much quicker in two to three weeks and I agree with slowbrewer batch prime with 80grs sugar if its beer and as much as 120grs if it's lager. 7-10 days at 20° the rest of the time at about 12-15° if you can manage it. As regards the leaking barrels lubricate the seals and tap thread with vaseline and if they are new ones check that there is not a bit of faulty moulding preventing the tap being tightened home. Look inside and you should be able to see the end of the thread clearly if not remove the obstruction with a sharp knife or scalpel.

 

[pittsy]

Right I'm getting more than a little pissed off with this, I'm on my fourth brew now and once again it's flat. The first two I found out my barrels were leaking but the last two have been in bottles one in glass the other in p.e.t's. the plastic is rock hard after two weeks in the warm but after going in the cold when I open them I get all the co2 escaping like dry ice and a flat pint it's as if no matter what I do any gas produced just sits on top and is not absorbed at all by the beer. Any ideas before I chuck the lot through the window. Funny thing is the raspberryade that I made was fizzy and I hadn't primed that yet!

Don't be impatient. Leave bottles for six weeks to condition. Barrels condition much quicker in two to three weeks and I agree with slowbrewer batch prime with 80grs sugar if its beer and as much as 120grs if it's lager. 7-10 days at 20° the rest of the time at about 12-15° if you can manage it. As regards the leaking barrels lubricate the seals and tap thread with vaseline and if they are new ones check that there is not a bit of faulty moulding preventing the tap being tightened home. Look inside and you should be able to see the end of the thread clearly if not remove the obstruction with a sharp knife or scalpel.

80g and 120g are you kidding ? 80g for an ale but upto 120g for a fizzy ale while a lager will want about 150g plus easily , my wheats beers have 150g sometime more (all 23l brew.)

 

[IPA]

Quote: 80g and 120g are you kidding ? 80g for an ale but upto 120g for a fizzy ale while a lager will want about 150g plus easily , my wheats beers have 150g sometime more (all 23l brew.) Unquote

I brew very good lager's and wheat beers with less than 100grs of priming sugar

 

[chojo]

Ok guys they have all been ales no lagers i keep 2 weeks in fv 2weeks in warm primed with 1tspn sugar per 500ml bottle 2tspns per 2ltr pet and 100gms per 23ltr barrel all seals have been lubed and tightened and pressure checked in water no leaks now on either but one does have a broken tap which i'll replace before using again. I use brown 500ml beer bottles from the LHBS. Then moved out to the shed where it's a constant 10 - 15 degrees, the first brew i got impatient with so i only gave that 2 weeks outside. the next have been out there for 4- 6 weeks on average. When i serve it i use a carling pint glass with the etching on the bottom it has never been in a dishwasher i always wash by hand and rinse well dry and polish straight away ( i'm a bit obsessed with clean glasses).
I'm concerned i'm doing something stupid and just not realising it at the time so any and all ideas welcome.

 

[IPA]

What recipe are you using? A small addition of wheat malt or wheat flour will help with head retention.

 

[IPA]

I have just noticed that you are extract brewing so therefore a slight addition of this should improve head retention.
http://www.themaltmiller.co.uk/index.ph ... ductId=477

 

[pittsy]

good call IPA :thumb: that should help , @ chojo , wheat spray malt is often 50% barley 50% wheat so adjust recipe as needed

 

[chojo]

good call IPA :thumb: that should help , @ chojo , wheat spray malt is often 50% barley 50% wheat so adjust recipe as needed

I don't know about extract brewing they've all been kits i just open a tin add water and yeast !

 

[IPA]

good call IPA :thumb: that should help , @ chojo , wheat spray malt is often 50% barley 50% wheat so adjust recipe as needed

I don't know about extract brewing they've all been kits i just open a tin add water and yeast !

Look at the weight of malt extract in your kit and add 5-10% by weight of this spray malt when you mix in the water and hopefully you will see an improvement in head retention. I would advise that you boil it in a little water before adding it to reduce the risk of bacterial infection. If this doesn't work you could be descended from Ann Boleyn.

 

[morethanworts]

Sounds like an odd one to me, unless you've just got very high expectations of fizz. Doesn't sound like you're crash chilling at any point and putting excessive pressure on the yeast, either.

I'm told washing up liquid can affect head retention, not just dishwasher stuff. Try one with just hot water. Personally, I'm not that bothered about head retention, as long as the right amount of fizz is there, though I don't think I've ever made a homebrew that wasn't at least as head-retentive as most commercial bottles.

I'd want to get the fizz sorted above the head retention as such. Obviously, you can try a good 100g or so in 23L next time for an ale, much more for a lager. I'd stick to bottles for the lager. I put 80g sugar in just 9.5L of Brewferm Abdij and it's very good, but not jumping out of the bottle, so there's room for more. I'm finding 80g to be slightly less than I want, even in about 20 litres.

 

[chojo]

I don't want silly amounts of fizz just a normal level. E.g wells bombardier and 1698 are my faves so that kind of fizz would be perfect for me. I've just made a wherry kit 2 day ago I take it it's too late to add the malt now? I'm going to bottle this one as well, would you batch prime then bottle or sugar them individually?

 

[IPA]

I find it much easier to batch prime. I dissolve 80gr sugar in hot water and when I can no longer see any grains of sugar I stir it thoroughly into the beer and then barrel or bottle it. Yes it it is too late to add the spray malt this time.

 

[rpt]

There's been lots of advice about improving head retention but the OP is complaining about flat beer. I'm not sure why it's flat but does it matter? I've just started drinking my first AG brew which I batch primed with 80g of sugar for 23L and the beer is a bit flat, but it's still yummy. It has some life but it isn't fizzy. I'd want a lager to be fizzy though.

 

[morethanworts]

I'd definitely stick to bottles while you sort the issue out, in any case. A barrel introduces too many other possibilities, which I would only try to address once I had the bottles conditioning how I wanted.

 

[MadrikXIV]

I'm a bit confused at flat ales?

Ales generally don't have much fizz to them, just enough to create some froth and head, and some don't even have that.

Pale or IPA would have a bit of fizz to them, and surely a Wherry isn't meant to be fizzy?

Surely just want a slight psst as you open a bottle?

 

[rpt]

I'm a bit confused at flat ales?

It's a matter of taste. Generally lagers should be fizzy but ales aren't, but they aren't usually totally flat. They need a little bit of life. Bottled beer is usually fizzier than that from a hand pump as the pump can put some life in the beer.