Is my og a bit low?

[mancer62]

This afternoon I made 2 x 30 bottle kits of red wine.
Punch Nebbiolo og 1070
Punch Merlot 1072.
I made these wines both to the 23l mark as was wondering if they seem a bit low ?
What should I be looking for them to finish around fg?

 

[The Baron]

They are slightly low I would be looking for the 80's to 90as regards finishing anything between 0.990 to 0.995
Yours at 70 and finishing @ 0.995 would give just below 10%
90 to finish at 0.995 would give 12.5%
add more sugar if you want more ABV

 

[mancer62]

They have been in the fv about 4 hours as we speak.... I was hoping for a wine around 11%.
Is it still time enough to add some sugar and if so how much and in what format...ie just stirring it in? or stir in a little hot water solution then add?
Also I don't want to impair the taste of the wine in any way or make it in anyway sweet....

 

[The Baron]

you can still add the sugar just make sure everything is clean and sterile as per your usual process.
I would suggest using a calculator to work out the volume of sugar to add and dissolve it in the least amount of boiled water to dissolve it then cover and allow to cool then add to the wine.
Your currently heading for 10% wine approx so you will not need to add vast amounts

 

[mancer62]

could u be so kind as to suggest a total amount of sugar to add as well as the amount of water that you would use? ty

 

[The Baron]

I think about 400g of sugar for 23ltres should take you to approx 11%. Just dissolve in the least amount of boiled water you can
Ps dont worry if the sugar is not full dissolved as long as its on its way it will dissolve fully in the wine must

 

[DavieC]

Hi @mancer62 , were these kits juice only or did you add sugar whilst making them up? Sg could be low if the thick juice is sitting at bottom of FV and it's more watery nearer the top?

 

[mancer62]

5l of grape juice Davie C....no sugar was added

 

[The Baron]

I think Davie C is asking if you have mixed it properly to get a true SG reading.
Does it give a idea of the SG in the instructions?

 

[DavieC]

Spot on Baron, I'm wondering if the juice is thoroughly mixed right to the top of FV

 

[The Baron]

Give it a good mix and retake the SG before adding any sugar

 

[mancer62]

Ok I will try giving it another good stir but will having added the yeast & nutrient have any effect on any hydrometer reading?

 

[mancer62]

just given them both a good stir...still same reading on hydrometer

 

[The Baron]

Right go ahead with the sugar addition if you want it to be stronger than the predicted 10% and you should be good to go just make sure everything is clean and sanitised

 

[mancer62]

Excuse my ignorance but is it 400g of sugar between the 2 x 23l wines...to basically raise it from 10% to 11% ie add 200g to each or is it 400g to each ?

 

[MartinF]

To (hopefully!) avoid any further confusion by showing the theory & arithmetic used...

A 1% increase in ABV will require an additional drop in SG of about 7.4 degrees of gravity (points), so you'll need to add enough sugar to 23 litres to raise the SG by 7.4 points.

Adding 1Kg (1000g) of white sugar will raise the SG of 1 litre of a liquid by (a theoretical) 360 points. So 1000/360 = 2.77g sugar per litre will raise the SG by 1 point. So to add 7.4 points to 23 litres, add 7.4 x 2.77 x 23 = 470g sugar.

However, adding sugar also increases the total volume, which - in turn - will effectively reduce the ABV. Adding 1 Kg of sugar to a liquid increases its volume by 0.63 litres. In your case, adding 470g sugar to 23 litres gives just below 300ml increase in volume to give 23.3 litres. So if your 23 litres of wine is at 10% & you increase its volume by 300ml, then the ABV becomes 10% x 23/23.3 = 9.87%, plus the 1% ABV gain by the addition of sugar = 10.87%. Or just ignore it; it's simpler!!

 

[mancer62]

For a guy that struggled with O'Grade Arithmetic I am lost.... I thank you for your input which is fascinating but complicated (to me anyway lol)
I just checked back and see that I made the Punch Nebbiolo before and its OG was 1080.......it finished at 996 giving me 11%...It advertises strength is between 10/12%.
I dont want to maybe ruin the taste of it and might just leave it this time but it would need to go down to at least 992 to achieve 10% is this achievable or do wines not really go down this far. ?

I mean even 10% is still reasonable strength I would think ty.

 

[MartinF]

I dont want to maybe ruin the taste of it and might just leave it this time but it would need to go down to at least 992 to achieve 10% is this achievable or do wines not really go down this far. ?

It doesn't really work like that: As the sugars in the grape juice ferment, the SG drops, the sweetness from the sugar is gone - all converted into alcohol (& CO2, but that's not useful to us!). The lower the SG, the less sugars there are in the wine - it just becomes drier. And you might not be able to get it to ferment down to 992 anyway if there are no sugars left to ferment, or if the yeast has given up (which it won't have, at just 10% ABV).

The only way to boost the ABV is by adding more fermentables - e.g. sugar, or more concentrated grape juice. There's always a "however"... However, adding too much plain sugar will make your wine too strong if you're not careful, thinner bodied, and - counter-intuitively - drier (if the yeast is good enough to ferment all that sugar).

Incidentally, I too have been disappointed with the strength of these concentrated grape juice kits when made according to their instructions. I've only tried a couple of them with the same results. Next time I'll aim to make maybe 10% less wine than they suggest & see how that goes.

 

[mancer62]

To be fair I wasn't disappointed at all with the Nebbiolo when I made it just after lockdown I was really impressed with it. I am not for one moment kidding myself on and claiming award winning wine here but producing 30 bottles of deliciousness for 32 quid or one pound ten a bottle is superb...
My puzzlement is the OG however last time was 1080 but this time only 1070.
I noticed last time the grape juice came in a large plastic bladder this time in a 5l plastic container....I emailed and asked if the amount of grape juice has been reduced but was assured it hasn't been.
The last time my FG was 996 giving me 11% ABV.....
This time I'd need it to go down to 990 to achieve 10%.

 

[johncrobinson]

Adding sugar for a 2-4% boost in abv should not harm your wine.
How far down you can get the FG is a tricky business as other things in the wine apart from sugar can affect the final gravity.
It does seem you need more sugar (which you CAN add without ruining your wine).
Low abv wines can taste nice but they don`t tend to "keep" as well.I always try for at least 12%.
The Baron has given you some good advice on how to add the extra sugar.

Your concern about the difference in the kits is justified,Manufacturers love to change things esp if it saves cost.

BTW Its nice to see you using the hydrometer its wine makings most important bit of "tech"