I think I want to get a Keg setup. I think...

[Ceejay]

Sorry, this might be a long one, but I want some of your input to try and rationalise my thought process!

I've always bottled my beer, and never really taken the time to understand what's involved in serving from a keg. To be honest, I thought that, for my situation, it might be a PITA. But, the more I think about it, the more it intrigues me. I'll fill you in on my setup.

All my beer stuff is stored in my dusty cellar (including fermentation fridge), along with a tonne of other crap. There's not much room in there but I could probably squeeze a couple of kegs in with CO2. Also, the roof is only about 4'6 high so I have to bend down when I go in there. My house is upside down, so the cellar is 2 floors below my lounge and kitchen. I have no room anywhere to put another fridge/kegerator etc.

So there we are. I have a cramped, dusty cellar with low headroom and no refrigeration and I can't turn an area of my house into a kind of mini bar, that a lot of folks have. However, the more I think about it, the more I think those are minor annoyances, compared to the overall goal. i.e. the advantages of kegging outweigh the disadvantages for me.

1. I don't have to bottle any more.
2. I can still bottle from the keg if I want to give out samples, using counterpressure
3. The kegs will be in a cellar at around 12C, which is ideal for many beers.
4. I can dial in whatever level of carbonation I want.
5. If I know I'm going to have people over and we're going to be drinking, I move the keg upstairs.
6. Dust can be dealt with. I can cover the top of the keg with a plastic bag, for instance
7. If I'm drinking at home, I can fill a 2 litre bottle with beer from the keg and stick it in the fridge.
8. In the summer, the cellar becomes a bar, since the entrance is in the garden.
9. I've read that pouring into a cold glass can help with foaming if the beer is a tad too warm.
10. I also read that you can basically keg, gas up and serve beer much quicker than the time it takes to bottle condition.

Now, the questions I have are:

A) Is 12C or so a low enough temperature not to cause me a problem, as long as I'm drinking the beer within, say, a month, assuming good sanitation?
B) Can you see any disadvantages, other than cost and what I've listed above?
C) What is the current thinking on the best system available to us? Corny, Ecofass, Polykeg, Crusader?

I'd really appreciate your input on this.

BTW, I just read this (at the bottom), which was brilliant: http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/0000/1312/Summerzym95-Kegging_How-To.pdf

 

[markmark]

Now, the questions I have are:

A) Is 12C or so a low enough temperature not to cause me a problem, as long as I'm drinking the beer within, say, a month, assuming good sanitation?
Definitely, I'd say that's about ideal for storing ales. Most yeasts will stop working at this temperature and drop out clear. At colder temperatures you risk a chill haze which can be very difficult to remove. You are also keeping the keg topped up with CO2 and this will stop and major oxidation issues.
B) Can you see any disadvantages, other than cost and what I've listed above?
No, not really...as long as you have a source of CO2
C) What is the current thinking on the best system available to us? Corny, Ecofass, Polykeg, Crusader?
I use corny kegs and find them great....though there are a number of rubber seals that need to kept in good order and sometimes people report leak problems. This can quickly empty your CO2 cylinder if you don't notice it. Don't have any experience of the others, though I do like the look of the Crusader ones.

Hope that is of some help :)

 

[calumscott]

Now, the questions I have are:

A) Is 12C or so a low enough temperature not to cause me a problem, as long as I'm drinking the beer within, say, a month, assuming good sanitation?

12C sounds like an ideal cellar temperature to me. In theory, a kegged beer with CO2 shouldn't go off. It's like a bottle with a one way valve where you top up the CO2 as you go.

B) Can you see any disadvantages, other than cost and what I've listed above?

None. Some say "but I like to have bottles to take places" but just get kegs that are a little smaller than your brewlength, you keg most of it and bottle a little.

C) What is the current thinking on the best system available to us? Corny, Ecofass, Polykeg, Crusader?

I've gone polykeg as I was lucky enough to get the last of the secondhand batch that asd sold on Jim's. They are really ideal. Lightweight, durable, stackable and for me the 30l ones are ideal. That's a keg and a crate of bottles per brew!

I was going to go ecofass but when the poly deal came up I couldn't say no. I'm basically going to be completely set up with 4 x 30l kegs for the price that 2 x 20l ecofass would have cost without all the gas and dispense gear.

BTW, I just read this (at the bottom), which was brilliant: http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/0000/1312/Summerzym95-Kegging_How-To.pdf

Looks like a good guide that. :thumb:

 

[ECLIPSE]

I currently have 4 AEB corny and a kegerator setup. Although the kegeraror only fits 2 cornys in a once. This is OK though as I only have 2 taps mounted to the door. The other 2 are filled with beer and left to mature until a tap becomes available.

You sound like you are ready to tale the next step and invest in a keg system. I was a bit uncertain at first but after the initial investment I couldn't be more happy! You wont regret it! Go for it!

 

[Ceejay]

I think I'm ready! I was more worried about the complication of having the kegs in my cellar, so if I want a couple of pints, I'm having to go downstairs and outside to get beer. Then, I can just fill up a big bottle and serve it that way. Is it easy to fill a large bottle from a picnic tap?

 

[bobsbeer]

I think if I were starting from scratch I would go Crusader kegs from the getgo. I used to have cornies and changed over to kegs this summer. They are easy to get, about the same price as cornies. Less prone to leaks, and are available in a range of sizes, ie 20lt or 30lt and bigger. I have 20 lt and they are just as easy as cornies to clean and fill. The connections are more secure and easily available. The rest of the equipment is the same as cornies, ie gas, regulator, beer font etc.

 

[ECLIPSE]

I would see it as part of the fun having to take a little trial to get yourself a pint... It adds to the fun in my opinion! If you are serious about a keg setup I can highly recommend the cornet system. It will last you a lifetime if you look after it properly. And the added benefit of not having to bottle anymore is bliss.

When you say that space is an issue and that you wouldn't be able to accommodate a fridge in your cellar, how many kegs would you be able to accommodate down there? I live with my fiance in a very small city centre flat. And I managed to fit a lader fridge into the 2nd bedroom which I turned into a kegeraror. It only for 2 cornys in at s time. I have 4 in total so the other 2 can be hidden away in the cupboard and allowed to mature.

 

[Ceejay]

I reckon I have space for 2 kegs plus gas, but another fridge in there just isn't practical. Too much other crap in there! Most of it isn't mine, as we rent our house. Maybe in the future, if I convince the landlord to bin the two knackered washing machines! I don't need refrifgeration though, right?

 

[Dave1970]

I think I'm ready! I was more worried about the complication of having the kegs in my cellar, so if I want a couple of pints, I'm having to go downstairs and outside to get beer. Then, I can just fill up a big bottle and serve it that way. Is it easy to fill a large bottle from a picnic tap?

It is easy to fill a big bottle from a party tap - if you do it right!

I have a party tap, that came from Norm, at my request he supplied it with 5ft length of 3/16" beerline instead of the standard short length of thicker line. This much thinner line reduces the pressure at the nozzle so reduces foaming. When filling a bottle (500ml glass ones for me not big ones) a length of standard 3/8" line push fits nicely into the tap so a suitable length allows you to fill the bottle from the bottom (much like a little bottler) which makes filling much easier.

Using this setup I've been able to bottle from the keg without the need for a beer gun/counterpressure filler - although this was achieved by chilling the keg down to 6C

 

[Ceejay]

Brilliant, that's just what I needed to hear! Great insight. Well chaps, I think that's all the encouragement I need! I'll have a look at what I need to source :thumb:

Would this regulator be any good?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Beer-Gas-Regulator-co2-/141133046626

Seems an OK price.

 

[calumscott]

Depends how many kegs (or different pressures really) you want to run.

That looks like you could run two pressures from it. I think I want to go for a triple, that way I can have lager "fizzy", APA "a bit fizzy", and psuedo-cask ale "just-enough-to-get-it-out" at the same time.

 

[Hawks]

Can you not drill a hole down into your cellar and run beer line into the house

In all seriousness though, sounds like a good idea 12c is about perfect temp. I would be careful with the CO2 in a cellar though as it's heavier than air so you need to be sure you have no leaks. Turn it off when you can and probably worth looking into a CO2 detector like this http://www.tech365.co.uk/alarms/ala...de-detector/?gclid=CO_N1NjNm7sCFQ1L3godhlMA0g

I have cornies which are great, but due to the HUGE price increases I think I would look at one of the other options if I was doing it all again now.

 

[Ceejay]

Ah cool, cheers guys. Yeah, I want to run 2 kegs to start with, so looks like that's just the thing. No bids either, so could end up with a bargain :thumb:

I'll definitely look at getting the CO2 detector. Safety first and all that :)

 

[calumscott]

Ah cool, cheers guys. Yeah, I want to run 2 kegs to start with, so looks like that's just the thing. No bids either, so could end up with a bargain

Then if that's the one for you, I shall remove it from my watch list and *actually* wait for a triple to come up... :thumb:

 

[Ceejay]

Lol! Thanks man, but I really don't mind - I haven't actually got any kegs yet. :

 

[calumscott]

Yeah, I really need the triple one and I'm not going to be serving from a keg until late Feb at the earliest...

 

[bobsbeer]

I'll definitely look at getting the CO2 detector. Safety first and all that :)

I wouldn't get too worried about CO2. A detector for co2 will be expensive. Don't be fooled by thinking a CO detector will work. That is a completely different gas and wholly dangerous. CO2 on the other hand is relatively harmless, unless you are worried about global climate change.

 

[Rhys]

CO2 in a poorly vented cellar as I understand could be a problem, so take sensible care.
CO2 regulators IF used with pub type kegs Crusader or polykegs with sankey fittings should have pressure release valves AFAIK. Not so much a problem with cornies which have their own PRVs so I've heard.