Haze developing after 2-3 weeks.

[BeerEagle]

Hi guys.

I'm now in to my 7th AG brews, mostly PAs and IPAs. I bottle and leave them in my dining room to clear. After about a week or so they are perfectly shiny and definitely pass the feck test. But a week or two later they seem to develop a very slight haze.

I could understand it if: 1 - it was hazy from the start and never cleared or 2 - I was chilling them and got a protein haze but: clear and then not?

Any idea what's happening?

Thanks

 

[orlando]

Are you getting a good hot & cold break? A really good rolling boil removes long chain proteins which otherwise can come back to cause instability or chill haze which is protein coming out of solution. Does it disappear when the beer warms up again?

Another source of the polyphenols that cause chill haze is high hopping rates, though again a good hot break and of course cold break should remove these too. Do you use something like Irish Moss or Protafloc in the boil as this will also help to remove the proteins. What is your chilling process as again this is a process that can also help to remove the problem?

 

[BeerEagle]

Thanks for your reply Orlando.

I get a good hot break and a solid rolling boil (3kw immersion element in an insulated keggle, with a second element to bring it up to boil), use irish moss at -10 minutes.

Have no chiller at the moment so I'm cooling in a cube overnight. Could this be the issue? I have some break material in the cube but I make sure that it doesn't get into the fermenter. The Aussies use this method a lot and don't seem to have a problem.

My bottles are not being chilled yet, the haze is appearing when my bottles are initially at carbing temps. They clear after a week then a week or two later they're hazy again.

No change in flavours apart from what's expected (suspected another organism in there) or over-fizziness.

 

[orlando]

OK, it's not the hot break, so I would look at the Irish Moss and substitute it for Protafloc. I used Irish Moss originally and it doesn't perform as well as Protafloc, at least for me, I'm sure it will have its defenders. You worry me a little with the expression "suspect another organism in there" as infection is another candidate. You say you make sure break material doesn't get into the fermenter, how do you eliminate it? Can't say much about chill cubes never used them so I guess asking guys in Oz what they do to get a cold break might be in order but I would have another method of cooling on my shopping list. One final thing is to try recirculating the wort before transferring to the cube as this will help filter break material out. If no pump then try letting the wort sit for at least 1/2 hour before transfer to allow as much trub to settle as possible, again helping to leave as much break material behind as possible.

One other thing that I am a big fan of is a product called KwiKlear which is a fining agent that will drop a brew bright in 24 hours. If everything else is fine then this will finish the beer beautifully.

 

[BeerEagle]

Good advice Orlando. I have some Protofloc so I'll try that next time.

I do leave the boiler for about 30 minutes (with late hops) but I'll give it a go at recirculating a few gallons before running off. It'll have to be the "pour into a jug and pour back into a boiler" method. (note to budget: take a hit on a pump next month)

And yes, I need a chiller. I have a counterflow design in my head, just need to get off my ar$e and build it - or would that not help and an IC would be better at dropping the cold break material?

Will also order some kwikclear.

Thanks again for your time.

 

[BeerEagle]

Orlando, at what point in the process do you add the Kwik Clear and how.

Does it take a lot of yeast out and make the bottle conditioning take longer?

 

[orlando]

Kwiklear is a 2 part product that is gelatine based. Part A is added to charge the particles either positive or negative, can't remember which way round. Part B is added 1/2 hour later both parts are stirred after addition, the Part B then acts in the opposite to part A by attracting all the particles as it falls through the brew. It is added at the same time as you prime using a bottling bucket. It makes no difference to the yeast which ferments the sugars as usual whether in bottle or keg. I honestly can't fault it it has never let me down and is one of those things you will never brew without when you see how marvellous the effects are. My bottles condition in a week so don't worry about that.

 

[BeerEagle]

Sounds great, so you use it at the same time as batch priming? Do you then wait for settling or just stick it in the bottles with the beer?

How does it affect the stickiness of the yeast in the bottle?

 

[orlando]

Straight into the bottle or keg once the stirring is finished, it's that simple. Yeast falls to the bottom in 24 hrs and stcks like the proverbial once cold conditioning is underway, it really is that good.

 

[BeerEagle]

Great stuff, just bought two packs ready for the weekend's bottling marathon.

Many thanks for your advice.

 

[orlando]

Do remember to give Bottle A 1/2 hour after stirring and make sure you measure both accurately, I find you are more accurate if you weigh it with some small precision scales. Let me know how you get on.